Coming Soon: Gen V Non-Invasive Catch Can Bracket DSE-VP-CC-002

[Simms]

What's the recommended plumbing route for G5?

[timberwolf]

Ordered one! Hope there's one left

[Zybane]

Definitely interested in this. Oil in the intake tract really sucks.

[TexasTonka]

Put me down for one.

[TexasTonka]

Coming Soon: Gen V Non-Invasive Catch Can Bracket DSE-VP-CC-002

I will have the prototype in a few weeks. Will be just like the Gen IV version:

- Compatible with the Radium Engineering Competition Catch Can https://www.radiumauto.com/Universal...-Can-P289.aspx
- Clamps around the frame, padding reduces marking or damage to the frame. NO DRILLING!!
- Easy and quick installation, three screws install the bracket.
- Lightweight, pocketed design machined from billet aluminum with a durable anodized finish.
- Stainless steel hardware

Very interested in this but unsure on how the single Radium set up works. I use the ACRX can on my GenIV ACR, two inlets and a filtered vent, easy to follow. I looked on the Radium website and it looks like you would need to run two Radium cans for the same effect? I'm no engineer which is why I am asking the question, how does a single Radium set up work?
I'd be most interested in an open system.

[Jack B]

The G5:

Drivers Side: There is supply air from the filtered side of the air box. In theory the air flow is from the air box to the valve cover. However, during race conditions, blow-by in the engine can reverse that process, my car had oil in the airbox. This typically is a filtered catch-can.


Passenger side: there is a vacuum line from the front of the engine that connects to the valve cover through the pcv. This can be handled in multiple ways, a simplke filtered catch-can or an air-oil separator.

Very interested in this but unsure on how the single Radium set up works. I use the ACRX can on my GenIV ACR, two inlets and a filtered vent, easy to follow. I looked on the Radium website and it looks like you would need to run two Radium cans for the same effect? I'm no engineer which is why I am asking the question, how does a single Radium set up work?
I'd be most interested in an open system.

[donk_316]

Air-oil separator

... Yeah? Exactly what a RX can is...

http://www.rxspeedworks.com/product/catch-can-kits/ Patented technology

That radium can is no better than the Ebay Greddy specials.

[TexasTonka]

Agree 100%, but this takes me back to my question, how can a single inlet/outlet Radium unit work on our cars? Would you not need two?
The ACRX unit has two inlets/one outlet so it follows your logic and plumbing description but is vented to atmosphere.

The G5:

Drivers Side: There is supply air from the filtered side of the air box. In theory the air flow is from the air box to the valve cover. However, during race conditions, blow-by in the engine can reverse that process, my car had oil in the airbox. This typically is a filtered catch-can.


Passenger side: there is a vacuum line from the front of the engine that connects to the valve cover through the pcv. This can be handled in multiple ways, a simplke filtered catch-can or an air-oil separator.

[SSGNRDZ_28]

I think a passenger side can would collect the majority of the oil for most owners. If you wanted to add a drivers side can to cover your bases during the scenarios Jack is describing you could.

If you want a vented system radium offers optional filters you could add instead of plumbing the lines back into the manifold or airbox. So vented or closed systems are both an option.

The brackets should work on the crossmember and side brace bars so in theory the flexibility is there for each owner to create a system that suits them best. Hence why I have no plans to sell plumbing kits or cans. The idea is just to allow people to clamp these on easily and create their own solution.


https://www.radiumauto.com/Blog/Post/Catch-Cans-101-102

[SSGNRDZ_28]

Agree 100%, but this takes me back to my question, how can a single inlet/outlet Radium unit work on our cars? Would you not need two?
The ACRX unit has two inlets/one outlet so it follows your logic and plumbing description but is vented to atmosphere.

The ACR-X can required modified valve cover pickup points correct? Did these translate to the Gen V?

To use one can would it not just be a matter of adding the vent filter on the output of the can and "Y-ing" the lines on the input or were the internals of that can more complex?

[Steve M]

The ACR-X can required modified valve cover pickup points correct? Did these translate to the Gen V?

Yes they did...Arrow modified the Gen 4 valve covers to pick up the fumes from the sides of the covers rather than the front as it came from the factory. The Gen 5 valve covers incorporated this change, but you can only tell if you can find a pic of the engine with the engine covers removed.

[Steve M]

Found a decent shot showing the passenger side valve cover:

[Steve M]

Agree 100%, but this takes me back to my question, how can a single inlet/outlet Radium unit work on our cars? Would you not need two?
The ACRX unit has two inlets/one outlet so it follows your logic and plumbing description but is vented to atmosphere.

For a closed system, you really only need one - you just hook up the passenger side valve cover vent to the can, and then run a line from the can back to the intake manifold. The driver's side is the make up air side of things, and pulls air from the non-vacuum side of the inlet (at the air box)...in my experience, the driver's side line collects little to no oil, at least not on my particular car. If you wanted to be safe, you'd need a second can if you wanted to maintain a closed loop system.

If you want to run a breather type can, you'd run both lines to the catch can (requires two inlets) - one from the passenger side, one from the driver's side. The breather in this case acts as the vent as well as the source of make up air for the system.

Under no circumstances would you bring in the lines from the passenger and driver's side valve covers to the same can in a closed loop system - you'll end up with all sorts of weird stuff because the make up air portion of the system (driver's side line) would now be under vacuum. In order for a PCV to properly work, you need to pull the air out of the crank case - in the case of the Viper, this is done on the passenger side valve cover. The line runs from there straight to the intake manifold, putting that line under vacuum...this vacuum is restricted, however, by the PCV valve (that's the silver thing in the pic above). The other thing you need is a source of air to replace what is pulled out under vacuum - this is done on the driver's side valve cover. That line connects to a non-vacuum air source (the air box).

Hopefully that makes some sense. I've been running my closed loop can on my Gen 4 for quite some time, and it seems to have effectively stopped oil ingestion on my mainly street driven car. If you were going to track it, I'd likely run an open breather type of setup (like the ACR-X catch can system) so you could 100% eliminate the possibility of oil ingestion. The only byproduct of a system like that is the potential for fumes...some are more sensitive to it than others.

[Jack B]

I was surprised at the raw oil inside the air box from the drivers side connection. Although not a huge volume, it was not an oily film, however, it was droplets of engine oil. i just wonder, if the baffling in the valve cover could be improved.

I think a passenger side can would collect the majority of the oil for most owners. If you wanted to add a drivers side can to cover your bases during the scenarios Jack is describing you could.

If you want a vented system radium offers optional filters you could add instead of plumbing the lines back into the manifold or airbox. So vented or closed systems are both an option.

The brackets should work on the crossmember and side brace bars so in theory the flexibility is there for each owner to create a system that suits them best. Hence why I have no plans to sell plumbing kits or cans. The idea is just to allow people to clamp these on easily and create their own solution.


https://www.radiumauto.com/Blog/Post/Catch-Cans-101-102

[ACRucrazy]

Radium catch can, DSE bracket & 2000 miles on my Gen IV

[SSGNRDZ_28]

Just a quick update update. Here are the prototypes, hope to arrange a test fit soon.

image1.jpg

[timberwolf]

Nice parts!!

[ViperPete]

Is it possible for the container to be blue?

Id like a catch can system.

[1.8t]

I will be buying one as well when these are released.

[ViperGeorge]

Is it possible for the container to be blue?

Id like a catch can system.

Sure, paint it.

[SSGNRDZ_28]

You'd have to contact Radium, maybe they would anodize it blue or send an unfinished can? I'd be willing to send an unfinished bracket.

Is it possible for the container to be blue?

Id like a catch can system.

[ViperPete]

You'd have to contact Radium, maybe they would anodize it blue or send an unfinished can? I'd be willing to send an unfinished bracket.

Yeah anodized blue would be the ticket

[Unorthodox]

I'll take one.

Should be enough interest to justify a group buy.

Michael

[ddominator1]

Ok guys. Can someone explain to me in simple terms how this works and why needed ? Sorry I'm sort orlf a newbie to this stuff. Are u saying that oil backs up and splashes onto manifold or something? Where exactly is this conneced to? Sorry if seems like dumb questions.
Thanks !

[Steve M]

I'll take a stab at it:

Piston rings make a seal with the cylinder walls - the rings don't seal 100% (they have gaps to allow for expansion/contraction), so inevitably combustion by-products (known as blow-by) make it past the rings into the crankcase/engine block. Those gases inevitably make contact with your engine oil, and those two things don't belong together (you want to keep your engine oil as clean as possible); it also increases the pressure in the crankcase, and that's not good for making sure the rings seal properly. In order to mitigate this problem, engine designers use something known as positive crankcase ventilation (PCV) systems to evacuate these gases. In the most basic sense, the intake manifold vacuum is used to pull the gases out. This vacuum is very restricted...otherwise, you'd end up pulling oil along with it. On a Gen 5 Viper, that's the line that runs from the passenger side valve cover to the intake manifold...the valve that's there is the PCV valve. In addition to restricting the flow, you also need a source of make-up air to be drawn in to the crankcase...essentially, this replaces what the PCV system draws out. On a Viper, that is the line that runs from the airbox to the driver's side valve cover. This line is not under vacuum. These two components (vacuum side with a restrictor valve and a make-up side with the fresh air) make up the PCV system.

Even with baffling in the valve covers, there's still enough oil spraying around in the top end of the heads that you will inevitably end up pulling an oil mist into the PCV system...the more oil that's splashing around (like with high RPM driving), the more this becomes an issue. Due to emissions regulations, any combustion byproducts must be dumped back into the intake manifold to be burned off rather than venting them to atmosphere. At the end of the day, this oil mist gets dumped in your intake manifold, and that can cause all sorts of issues. The main issue is that this oil makes its way to the intake ports and valves, and effectively lowers the octane of the gas that it mixes with as the injectors are firing. If I'm not mistaken, oil has an octane rating of around 50 or so, so although I don't know how much it would take down the octane rating of 93 gas (depends on the volume ratios of both), it is enough that it can cause pinging/detonation.

An oil catch can allows a place for the oil mist to cool down and condense into droplets, so they can effectively drop out of the crankcase fumes they are suspended in. This allows the oil to collect in the can instead of it going into the intake manifold. If you don't mix the oil droplets with the gas, you don't end up lowering the effective octane rating of said gas, giving your engine the best chance to not have any knock/pinging/whatever you want to call it. Basically, you end up getting the maximum amount of performance and durability out of your engine as possible because you aren't allowing garbage back into the combustion chamber to be burned off.