Take out spare tire at the track?

[Martin2000GTS]

Hey Guys,

Just trying to plan my trip to Tail of the Dragon and VIR. Since Ill be on the road for literally 2 weeks in my viper I was looking at options to make more space in my trunk. I drive my car around with a spare tire in the trunk all the time but in reality the spare would not even fit on my car because of my big brakes. Is it important to keep the spare in there for a rear end collision? (I thought I read about that somewhere) Would VIR not let me race if I didn't have the tire in there? Am I just worrying over nothing? Id like to take the spare out to give me more cargo room for my trip. What do you guys think?

Martin-

[GhostStalker27]

I travel without a spare, I also track without it.

[ViperTony]

From JonB in 2011:

"If you have a roll bar or cage, no worry. HOWEVER

Some history: When Vipers were first crash-tested by Fed mandate, it was discovered that the RT/10 TRUNK LID can dislodge in a rear crash. If the spare is not in the trunk, the trunk lid can intrude into the cockpit thru the rear window. The rear sport hoop acts as a blade-guide and the trunklid edge becomes a guillotene. The INFLATED Spare Tire, if BOLTED IN, becomes a great shock-absorber and rear tub stiffener and prevents the decklid from moving forward and therefore prevents head loss.

Team Viper members attending the FIRST EVER VIPER NATIONALS DRAG RACES in TX in 1995 pointed this out to the the TECH INSPECTOR there, and spares have been madated in RT/10s ever since. I am fairly certain that tech inspector was the same guy who informed SKIP THOMAS at VIPER DAYS. That tech inspector was me. At the fisrt VOI-sanctioned drags {VOI-4 Orlando} we required Spares in RT10s only.

If you have a ROLL BAR in the car, this prevents the trunk intrusion, so the spare was less important, but still a functional rear-crash safety device preventing more serious frame collapse. So VRL maintained the requirement in non-roll-cage cars, even tho federal REAR CRASH DATA on GTSs was not as forboding results as RT/10.

I think the SRT Spare tie-down is to prevent its mounting-point ejection, not to make it a structural component; But if it stays in place it certainly helps absorb impact. SRT10 frames are carry-over to 2008, and there is NO SPARE in the 08. I am curious about any crash-test results and steps taken for 08."

Maybe JonB can chime in and provide more valuable detail as this spare tire question relates to the GenII GTS?

[99RT10]

From JonB in 2011:

"If you have a roll bar or cage, no worry. HOWEVER

Some history: When Vipers were first crash-tested by Fed mandate, it was discovered that the RT/10 TRUNK LID can dislodge in a rear crash. If the spare is not in the trunk, the trunk lid can intrude into the cockpit thru the rear window. The rear sport hoop acts as a blade-guide and the trunklid edge becomes a guillotene. The INFLATED Spare Tire, if BOLTED IN, becomes a great shock-absorber and rear tub stiffener and prevents the decklid from moving forward and therefore prevents head loss.

Team Viper members attending the FIRST EVER VIPER NATIONALS DRAG RACES in TX in 1995 pointed this out to the the TECH INSPECTOR there, and spares have been madated in RT/10s ever since. I am fairly certain that tech inspector was the same guy who informed SKIP THOMAS at VIPER DAYS. That tech inspector was me. At the fisrt VOI-sanctioned drags {VOI-4 Orlando} we required Spares in RT10s only.

If you have a ROLL BAR in the car, this prevents the trunk intrusion, so the spare was less important, but still a functional rear-crash safety device preventing more serious frame collapse. So VRL maintained the requirement in non-roll-cage cars, even tho federal REAR CRASH DATA on GTSs was not as forboding results as RT/10.

I think the SRT Spare tie-down is to prevent its mounting-point ejection, not to make it a structural component; But if it stays in place it certainly helps absorb impact. SRT10 frames are carry-over to 2008, and there is NO SPARE in the 08. I am curious about any crash-test results and steps taken for 08."

Maybe JonB can chime in and provide more valuable detail as this spare tire question relates to the GenII GTS?

Might be tough for me:



I guess my only option is not to crash.......................

[ViperTony]

Might be tough for me:



I guess my only option is not to crash.......................

Damn that's sexxy. You got me thinking now which means my wallet is hurting.

[thetalonguy]

Hey Martin,

I just so happen to have the NARRA US PDE and SOLO Regulations in my office at work:

"Before going on track ensure the following items are removed from your car:
....
i) Spare Tire

So it's actually a requirement to remove the spare before racing on a NARRA course.

:-)

[Martin2000GTS]

Hey Martin,

I just so happen to have the NARRA US PDE and SOLO Regulations in my office at work:

"Before going on track ensure the following items are removed from your car:
....
i) Spare Tire

So it's actually a requirement to remove the spare before racing on a NARRA course.

:-)

Awesome that's good news! thanks !

[Leslie]

I remember reading something about the design of the GenII and the spare tire, protection from the fuel tank...?

Hopefully someone will chime in on this.

When I had a GenII I would always leave it in and just take it out at the track.

[GTS Dean]

twscrash.jpg

The spare serves as a crash attenuator. This crash happened at Viper Days' first event at Texas World in '97. He was glad to have the spare in the trunk.

If you are looking for extra trip space, you can put things under the spare center, over the spare center and below the cover, around the spare in the trunk pan. Under the seats you will find a surprising amount of volume. Beside the seats and the exhaust sills are spaces. What you're looking for is VOLUME, not just area.

[Patentlaw]

twscrash.jpg

The spare serves as a crash attenuator. This crash happened at Viper Days' first event at Texas World in '97. He was glad to have the spare in the trunk.

If you are looking for extra trip space, you can put things under the spare center, over the spare center and below the cover, around the spare in the trunk pan. Under the seats you will find a surprising amount of volume. Beside the seats and the exhaust sills are spaces. What you're looking for is VOLUME, not just area.

Totally correct.

[Camfab]

I also thought this was the case, however someone noted that it was specially for the RT/10 and not the GTS. Why this would be the case, baffles me. I believe the frames are the same although updates to the frame occurred with time.

[slovenom]

My gts 200 has a spare ?

[XSnake]

yes, take it out

[GhostStalker27]

The spare is secured by a wing nut...It'll decapitate you before it ever provides any protection. The average spare weighs about 25lbs..would you want a 25lb bar bell in your cockpit if god forbid you rolled? No car should ever count on a spare as impact control. As anyone whose ever tracked - you remove all 'loose' items, including your spare.

[Matt M, Pa]

I've had a Viper since 1998 and I remember very well these discussions over the years on the other forum. I had to search, but found a thread from 2002 where Chuck Tator wrote..."All Vipers...the spare is there for safety! Do not remove!". Also Roy Sjoberg was quoted as saying that something similar.

[whitebluevipe]

I've had a Viper since 1998 and I remember very well these discussions over the years on the other forum. I had to search, but found a thread from 2002 where Chuck Tator wrote..."All Vipers...the spare is there for safety! Do not remove!". Also Roy Sjoberg was quoted as saying that something similar.

chuck told me the same thing as well. i would trust him more than anyone when it comes to Vipers.

[ViperTony]

The spare tire is an integral design of the rear impact-crumple zone. The spare tire hold down rod has a cable running through it and the cable is tied to either side of the frame. In a rear-end collision, on the RT-10, the trunk lid hinges give way and the trunk lid slices into the passenger compartment through the RT/10's sport bar. The spare tire is supposed to prevent a complete rear-end crush and keep the deck lid from moving forward. During Viper Days I couldn't run without the spare in my RT/10 for this reason. Every track day I go to the spare is required to say anchored in my RT/10 trunk. No exceptions. On the GTS, not sure if the spare tire is part of the rear-end crumple zone safety or not.

[ACRSNK]

Martin you have plenty of room in trunk. I saw what you had in there yesterday at the dyno. Never knew a Viper trunk was so big. Coolers, DJ equipment, chairs, food, more food.....Dang!

[ViperTony]

Martin you have plenty of room in trunk. I saw what you had in there yesterday at the dyno. Never knew a Viper trunk was so big. Coolers, DJ equipment, chairs, food, more food.....Dang!

Let me guess Martin had 3-4 coolers full of lobster in his GTS trunk?

[Stretch]

Chuck Tator himself told me never to remove the spare tire for the exact reason that ViperTony mentioned above. I always traveled with it in the car.

[GhostStalker27]

Chuck Tator himself told me never to remove the spare tire for the exact reason that ViperTony mentioned above. I always traveled with it in the car.

Maybe it's an RT/10 thing, he also worked on my car (was aware there was no spare) and never mentioned anything about needing it. Just seems odd they'd design a car that'd compromise your safety if you needed to use it. Can anyone confirm this is also true with a gts?

[Thawk97]

Maybe it's an RT/10 thing, he also worked on my car (was aware there was no spare) and never mentioned anything about needing it. Just seems odd they'd design a car that'd compromise your safety if you needed to use it. Can anyone confirm this is also true with a gts?

I think the assumption is that if you're running with the spare you already need to be driving with extra caution - the spare certainly isn't designed to hold up to regular driving. It's the same thing with limp mode - when the car isn't working properly, they want to enable you to get it somewhere to resolve the issue, but that doesn't mean it's safe to try and drive it normally.

[Bugman Jeff]

Maybe it's an RT/10 thing, he also worked on my car (was aware there was no spare) and never mentioned anything about needing it. Just seems odd they'd design a car that'd compromise your safety if you needed to use it. Can anyone confirm this is also true with a gts?

It's likely assumed that if you're using the spare, the original wheel is in the trunk. If it is there to prevent the rear from crumpling, it's the solidness of the wheel, not the air in the tire doing the work anyway.


I'm curious about the GTS question as well. My '97 didn't come with a spare, and I haven't really gone out of my way to find one. If it turns out to be a non-issue with the GTS, I suspect the roof helps distribute impact energy around the cockpit. Or, it could be strictly trunk lid related as stated above, making it irrelevant on the GTS.

[BadAndy]

Stretch busted me out a few years ago. I put mine back in and have left it ever since.

[Red Kaos]

Just an observation and a bit rhetorical…there are a number of warning stickers on the GTS as well as warning notices contained within the manual. However, I have yet to find one regarding the operation of the viper without a spare tire.