Upgrade from Gen III to Gen IV

[dbow119]

I currently have a Gen III and would love to own a Gen IV. A few years ago I saw a 2008 Viper Red with White racing stripes and the red and black interior at a local dealership with less than 900 miles on it and I fell in love...that is my dream Viper and if I had $80k at the time, it would have been mine lol. Despite the prices dropping quite a bit since then, being in grad school and working part-time at the moment means I will probably have to wait a few years before I can think about trading up to a Gen IV. What I love about the Gen IV is the extra 100 horsepower, 202 mph top speed for a roadster, and more aggressive hood (I read the Gen IV also helps reduce the cabin heat, but that honestly doesn't bother me since I'm rarely in bumper-to-bumper traffic).

I know a lot of you currently own multiple Vipers or have owned several Vipers so to Gen IV owners who also own or have owned a Gen III, is the Gen IV really worth the extra $20k+? I suppose I could get a Gen IV hood for my Gen III so that would solve that problem in the looks department, but is the extra 100 hp really worth it? Do you think within the next 5-10 years the Gen IV will drop down into the $30k range where I could pick one up while keeping my Gen III?

Thanks for your advise!

-Derek

[Timnineside]

I currently have a Gen III and would love to own a Gen IV. A few years ago I saw a 2008 Viper Red with White racing stripes and the red and black interior at a local dealership with less than 900 miles on it and I fell in love...that is my dream Viper and if I had $80k at the time, it would have been mine lol. Despite the prices dropping quite a bit since then, being in grad school and working part-time at the moment means I will probably have to wait a few years before I can think about trading up to a Gen IV. What I love about the Gen IV is the extra 100 horsepower, 202 mph top speed for a roadster, and more aggressive hood (I read the Gen IV also helps reduce the cabin heat, but that honestly doesn't bother me since I'm rarely in bumper-to-bumper traffic).

I know a lot of you currently own multiple Vipers or have owned several Vipers so to Gen IV owners who also own or have owned a Gen III, is the Gen IV really worth the extra $20k+? I suppose I could get a Gen IV hood for my Gen III so that would solve that problem in the looks department, but is the extra 100 hp really worth it? Do you think within the next 5-10 years the Gen IV will drop down into the $30k range where I could pick one up while keeping my Gen III?

Thanks for your advise!

-Derek

Derek,


There is a lot more to the Gen 4 then the hood and HP. Different rear end, gear box and depending on year tranny amongst several other things.

It depends on each persons wants and needs for a car. The Gen 3's can be modded as the computer is not a mess to work with which some people find the biggest benefit. That and all the Gen 4 things can be easily done to the gen 3 for extra cash.

If your looking for a great car to hold value and you don't wish to mod then go with a gen 4. If you like the looks and styling of the gen 4 but don't want to pony up the cash just slowly mod your gen 3. Start with the hood and go from there.

-Tim

[The_Greg]

Derek,


There is a lot more to the Gen 4 then the hood and HP. Different rear end, gear box and depending on year tranny amongst several other things.

It depends on each persons wants and needs for a car. The Gen 3's can be modded as the computer is not a mess to work with which some people find the biggest benefit. That and all the Gen 4 things can be easily done to the gen 3 for extra cash.

If your looking for a great car to hold value and you don't wish to mod then go with a gen 4. If you like the looks and styling of the gen 4 but don't want to pony up the cash just slowly mod your gen 3. Start with the hood and go from there.

-Tim

From what I understand Tim has it best. To echo:

Desire more than Gen IV power levels - Gen III
Looking to stay relatively stock - Gen IV

I personally would be happy with a stock Gen IV, I can't see me feeling I need much more than that for a while. However, it would be cheaper to mod the Gen III to get to that power level (or beyond) than two switch cars. Adding 100+hp on a Gen III is pretty quick and easy, and will cost you less than the $10k premium on trading up (and registration fees, etc.). Think cam/tune and full exhaust upgrade.. I think that will put you over 600 bhp.

The reason I, personally, would like to go witha Gen IV some day is because the differential is stronger and improves 'feel' in cornering, the trans is better, swinging oil pickup, VVT, the hood, ACR, and of course the factory 600 bhp (there are more). If you want all those nit-picky small things the Gen IV has over the Gen III then its worth the vehicle trade.

[ACRucrazy]

600+ whp in a Gen IV is pretty easy. (over 700 at the engine)

Headers, exhaust, mopar PCM and maybe a ported manifold/gen V manifold and you should have no problem with 600 to the tire on a stock driving car.

Like others mentioned the Gen IV is more than hood and HP. The HP comes from the cam with in a cam setup and computer. Another advantage the Gen IV has is the oiling setup, which if tracked or driven hard a Gen III should have upgraded, if I recall it's something like 2-4k? That's 2-4k in your pocket if you have Gen IV, along with the trans, clutch, rear end etc.

If you want 700+ bolt on HP a Gen III with a Paxton is the way to go. I have a feeling we may see a few 700+ NA Gen IVs in the future though..

[Smog Dog]

Had 2 G3's and 2 G4's. I agree with what the rest have said. One thing I would add is the shift linkage is so much more precise in the G4. Unless modding to get the real high horsepower is important to you, save your money and buy a G4.

Bill

[slitherv10]

If you can spend 20K 'WISLEY" in your Gen 3, you could make that car far better than a Gen 4. Just do some homework. Ask the Dan's and some of the reputable Modders around here and they will point you in the right direction. Might even be less than 20K. If you look at what a Gen 3 is worth today and add the 20K to it, you will have a better car for less. The styling of the two is very similar. So you already have that down.
Now , if you were trying to compare a Gen 2 to a Gen 4 it would be a lot more difficult to reach the goals. Gen 2's need too many upgrades to get to the HP and the technology,, brakes, gears etc...list goes on on the car. Now, to the defence of the Gen 2, it has a whole different style. So the moral of the story is that you're more than halfway there, to a Gen4, whereas a Gen 2 car offers a lot less yet has the stylling that may be a trade off.

Keep your car and make it the Gen 4 your looking for , for a lot less and you'll get a lot more.

[Resident Alien]

Maybe the best option is to get a Gen IV that's already been modified, there are plenty to choose from. That might save you up to another almost $10k in mods and labor to get it to 600ish whp territory. Mods generally don't increase the price of a gen IV nearly that much. Probably much easier to trade up for a gen V later if you go gen IV.

If trying to stay N/A and want 600 - 650 whp, best bang for the buck will be to stay Gen 3 and do head/cam + supporting bolt-ons. There are multiple gen 3 owners who got there for under $20k.

[ACRucrazy]

Also don't forget if you want a coupe, you are stuck getting an 06 Gen 3. These are typically about 10-15k less than a Gen IV coupe.

IMO if you go that route you will be money ahead getting a Gen IV if you are staying NA coupe. Gen 3 + oiling mods + rear end + trans + clutch you are near Gen IV territory and you haven't even touched the engine.

[slitherv10]

Also don't forget if you want a coupe, you are stuck getting an 06 Gen 3. These are typically about 10-15k less than a Gen IV coupe.

IMO if you go that route you will be money ahead getting a Gen IV if you are staying NA coupe. Gen 3 + oiling mods + rear end + trans + clutch you are near Gen IV territory and you haven't even touched the engine.

But d you really need all those upgrades? That is the first question you need to ask yourself. In my opinion the only real upgrade that is obvious on the Gen 4 over the gen 3 is the HP. Brakes aer great on the 3 and the tranny is only important if your adding power as that tranny is 33% stronger and that's it. I know the feel is different and the clutch is softer and so on but, not to the point where your trading in your Gen 3 for a 4. Hp difference and the 5th gear in the 10 but then again you can add that gear for a small amount of money when your servicing your tranny or what not. Otherwise, who really uses 5th to excelerate? Or race for that matter. The really difference at this point is the capabilities of the PCM over the Gen 4. Big difference when looking into modding your car.

[ViperGeorge]

I've had 2 Gen 3s and now have 2 Gen 4s. Agree with everything that's been said. Here's a couple of other points. Depending on the year of the Gen 3, the Gen 4 colors are much better. SSG, VBB, VVO, etc. The Gen 3s can be modded more easily for crazy horsepower, my 06 B/W coupe had a Paxton and it was wicked fast in a straight line. On a road course though, my 09 ACR is faster. Now my ACR does have ported heads, ported intake, mopar controller, headers, and high flow cats so it probably has more power than the stock 600 but not as much as the 750 or so my Paxton 06 had.

Re shifter, one of the best things you can do to either Gen is to replace the stock shifter with the MGW one from Woodhouse. Awesome shifter and you will never miss a shift again unless you truly are an idiot. My 06 also had the Gen 4 hood. It was like $1200 plus paint. After the hood it was hard to tell the difference between the Gen 3 and 4 unless you knew the stripes were of different width.

[Smog Dog]

Pour all the money you want into modding a G3, and how much of it will you get back when it comes time to sell the car? The more you mod, the less percentage wise, you get back.

Bill

[BillyC]

I currently have a Gen III and would love to own a Gen IV. A few years ago I saw a 2008 Viper Red with White racing stripes and the red and black interior at a local dealership with less than 900 miles on it and I fell in love...that is my dream Viper and if I had $80k at the time, it would have been mine lol. Despite the prices dropping quite a bit since then, being in grad school and working part-time at the moment means I will probably have to wait a few years before I can think about trading up to a Gen IV. What I love about the Gen IV is the extra 100 horsepower, 202 mph top speed for a roadster, and more aggressive hood (I read the Gen IV also helps reduce the cabin heat, but that honestly doesn't bother me since I'm rarely in bumper-to-bumper traffic).

I know a lot of you currently own multiple Vipers or have owned several Vipers so to Gen IV owners who also own or have owned a Gen III, is the Gen IV really worth the extra $20k+? I suppose I could get a Gen IV hood for my Gen III so that would solve that problem in the looks department, but is the extra 100 hp really worth it? Do you think within the next 5-10 years the Gen IV will drop down into the $30k range where I could pick one up while keeping my Gen III?

Thanks for your advise!

-Derek

Derek, Derek, Derek,
If you have a Gen III, and it's in good condition, you already are in an excellent position to "trade up".
IMHO, if you mod the III, it will lower the resale value if you trade at a dealer.
I suggest that since you want a GEN IV for whatever reason, just do it!
Make a list of the specs on the GEN IV you want.
Search locally, and on line and make an offer using your trade in.
Check Ebay. I got a 2009 Coupe, SSG, 840 miles with a sticker of $106,995 for $76,000. Not sure if that was a sweet deal, but it is exactly what I wanted. You only live once.
PS - I have had all GEN's, a SRT-10 truck and several Prowlers. This SSG GEN IV is a seriously different animal.
BillyC

[dbow119]

I have gotten far more responses than my email has told me. Thank you for everyone who has responded. Honestly, I'm not interested in modding the car for the exception of maybe some very subtle changes like the hood and some other light stuff that I could take off and switch back to stock if I decided to sell it. I know I'll never get anywhere near my money back if I modify it and a lot of owners want an all original car for collecting purposes or the fear that since it was heavily modded then it must have be raced and abused even if it was never on a track.
Considering I am finishing school and only working a part-time job at the moment, I wouldn't even have $10k to put into modding my Gen III even if I wanted to. Probably the best thing for me to do right now is hold off for another maybe 5 years and then buy a Gen IV (at that point they will be 10+ model years old and I will probably be able to pick one up for the cost of a Gen III today. That way I should also be able to keep my Gen III and I can have a Viper collection!
Again, thank you everyone for responding and making me aware of all the changes the Gen IV has!

[Lawrenzo]

I'm a bit of a dissenter on this. After not owning a Viper for about 4 years I went looking for a Gen 4 and test drove a 2009 VOI car. In the first 5 seconds it brought back all that I didn't like about the electronic throttle. It felt disconnected, and disappointing to me. Maybe they fixed that on the Gen 5, but the Gen 3 definitely had a much better feel to it.

[FLATOUT]

I went from an 03 gen III Vert to an 08 Gen IV ACR. That was a switch worth making My gen III was a full bolton car without cats making 500rwhp, my Gen IV has a Gen V manifold only, and makes 570rwhp. I think going from a Gen III Vert to a Gen IV Vert would be a nice step up but getting into and ACR is a whole nother ball game.

Good Luck

[Back In Black]

If you can spend 20K 'WISLEY" in your Gen 3, you could make that car far better than a Gen 4. Just do some homework...

slitherv10 FTW.

Obviously there are variables. The main variable being how you intend to use the car.

Knowing what I know now about the Gen4, if I were to do it over again, I would buy a Gen3 and modify the crap out of it. I modified my Gen4 the same way I would have with a Gen3. But I'm stuck with drive-by-wire and an ECU I can't control.