770hp SC Viper ?

[Resident Alien]

Why does it have to be a conventional supercharger or turbocharger?

Here is an example of a very interesting new technology that combines the best of both worlds, and may be where most of the furture high performance engines are headed: hybrid turbos

http://www.aeristech.co.uk/full-elec...ger-technology

Will there be expensive R&D involved? Most certainly, but it appears that the upper boundary of the N/A engine output has already been reached. Some of the costs might be offset by downsizing to the core Hellcat engine.

[Steve M]

That isn't the best of both worlds...that's just a different take on a turbo. Instead of using the exhaust gas energy to simply drive the compressor, they are converting some of that energy to electrical power. That makes perfect sense when you have a hybrid that uses a combo of gas engine and electric motors, but the Viper is missing the latter.

[Resident Alien]

That isn't the best of both worlds...that's just a different take on a turbo. Instead of using the exhaust gas energy to simply drive the compressor, they are converting some of that energy to electrical power. That makes perfect sense when you have a hybrid that uses a combo of gas engine and electric motors, but the Viper is missing the latter.

Agree in part and disagree in part. The exhaust energy converted to electric power can simply be stored and fed back into the compressor side to spool a very large turbo immediately (within 500 ms), until the turbine catches up. No need for a separate electrical motor, just a temporary storage of electricity like a battery pack.

Additionally, the divorce of the turbine and compressor from the traditional common shaft allows for the physical separation of the two - the compressor can be mounted very compactly in the front of the engine and away from the hellish temperatures of the exhaust gas turbine, signifficantly alleviating heat soak, and allowing for very short inlet tubing into the compressor, further reducing lag. The electrical linkage can be located in the middle of the V for additional compactness.

For those that follow F1, this particular technology is Mercedes's dirtiest secret to their incredible succes - they intentionally faked the original announcement of the engine details, saying it had a conventional turbo at the back of the engine. The truth was that it was a hybrid turbo (separated into the front and back of the engine) all along.

[Steve M]

Interesting...I'll have to watch the video later.

[Resident Alien]

The F1 car has that additional (160 hp) electric engine that you thought of, but it's a separate system powered by excess braking energy (and partially by the excess energy from the turbo). It is not necessary to have that in a viper, as the hellcat engine combined with a monstrous turbo would be more than sufficient for 1000+ whp stock (with N/A type torque and responsiveness and very little heat soak).

[Viktimize]

yada yada

That's funny, as I was reading the first bit of your post I was thinking that R&D should be significantly reduced considering this is what F1 is already doing. Good to see you closed it up with that. Great video though, thanks for posting. Haven't seen that one yet.

[Snakebit10]

Well good thing the Viper is currently testing the composite blower with near zero heat soak. That should keep the naysayers at bay. It is going to ge a game changer and varients will show up in the complete dodge lineup as a halo car should do.

???? Link or is this a joke.

[Viktimize]

???? Link or is this a joke.

Just another rumor that was floating around with this whole HellFire package rumor.

[kdaviper]

If these rumors come to fruition, they should make the trim designation "BMF"

[slowhatch]

Well good thing the Viper is currently testing the composite blower with near zero heat soak. That should keep the naysayers at bay. It is going to ge a game changer and varients will show up in the complete dodge lineup as a halo car should do.

[Vprbite]

Slowhatch, I think we are going to have to have an intervention for your gif habit.

[2snakes]

I hope it happens in 16.. I hope its priced right

[Coloviper]

Rumors or not, my guess is for the 2017 model year, 25th Anniversary year.

And while it WAS mentioned to me in Detroit at NVE1, everyone jumped on me for posting anything about that so I am not going into anything beyond the statement I made. Yes I have put a few things together outside of that experience but will just mention this......Is there a reason the Chrysler purchase of the two (2) Composite Blower patents can no longer be found on the internet, anywhere? This was not some bs site reporting rumors but actual factual information of the purchases of those two patents?

[Coloviper]

One was an "Electric" driven composite supercharger (looked like a centrifugal blower housing) to provide on-demand boost. Use it when you want and don't use it when you don't. It was also intercooled and very lightweight!

Second one was a smaller composite supercharger that fit within the entirety of a air intake tube, which in this case was powered by electric again but I guess could be off of the motor, if needed on that one. It reduced a lot of the heat soak as there was no housing on the top of the motor nor constant run equipment to extend the heat soak. As it was Electric, it was also On Demand Boost so not spinning up all the time adding heat.

These two patents go back a ways to the Daimler days BUT were recently transferred or acquired into FCA however I can no longer find THAT paperwork on the internet from this year or whenever it was.

Maybe something will make production, maybe not, but something is going on fellows and if it is a composite option like these above which FCA owns the patent, then that is a game changer. Either way, both of these require no repackaging to "fit" in a Viper. They could also be complementary as using both to get the boost up. One feeds into the next. If successful, they could be transplanted to any of the Dodge line-up which is what you want your Halo car to do.

Anyway flame on, but my money is on the electric driven variety as above, as if you are road racing, and even stage them so they only come on at a certain range for boost, there would be virtually zero heat soak, at least compared to how we are blowing the cars today and yester-year as they are on-demand. It is a ECU programmers wet dream to make that all work though.

[Coloviper]

And finally:

One had a Magnetically Loaded Composite (MLC) rotor and was driven off the motor belt pulley system.

Second one required a second and dedicated alternator to feed the electric motors which appeared to be electrically coupled and managed or staged to the alternator through RPM.

Anyway......