Modded TA vs stock viper

[FLATOUT]

Is 1BADGTS a VOA member? I recall reading that he knew these guys very very well.

LOL he was the Evan Smith Nut Swinger.

[Snakebit10]

Just for reference heres a link to FiskeGTS stock MP4-12C 1/4 mile run on Dragtimes. Car did 10.2 @ 135mph stock according to the link. Notice the stock 60-130mph time is 6.5 secs.

http://www.dragtimes.com/Mclaren-MP4...lip-26246.html

And here it is with just a Fabspeed tune doing 60-130 in 5.9 secs:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wW7D5J_-W4

It will be great to see where the Viper is 60-130mph with HPT's tune.

[v10tt]

Man, that GTR runs good!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34gj...lW2KEyhhAgIQjA

[v10tt]

Just to show MPH (trap speed) not always tells you who will win from a roll. Both cars belong to Brooks (Fikse GTS)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=in2s...vdzXwnCDxVyNEg

[Malu59RT]

I hope not otherwise we'll have to start another club again hope that he doesn't find it.

I laughed

[mjorgensen]

Awesome to have the visual to go with my feel between the stock and modded, it is an insane difference.

If anyone is itching I keep the Belangers and various catbacks in stock all the time, buying the tuner/tune through Torrie is the way to go.

[pdv25]

Awesome to have the visual to go with my feel between the stock and modded, it is an insane difference.

If anyone is itching I keep the Belangers and various catbacks in stock all the time, buying the tuner/tune through Torrie is the way to go.

Thanks for all your help and advise.

[FLATOUT]

Awesome to have the visual to go with my feel between the stock and modded, it is an insane difference.

If anyone is itching I keep the Belangers and various catbacks in stock all the time, buying the tuner/tune through Torrie is the way to go.

Thanks Mark,

And I just flashed in the HPTuners operating system this morning and did the TB relearn. I will start installing my headers tonight!

[tmcphail]

Woohoo!

[FLATOUT]

Although you are correct your premise is somewhat flawed since both of those cars "best 1/4 traps" were run on two seperate occasions with different weather affecting the outcome and possibly traction.

And the discusion in the other thread was only about wether a Gen V could possibly trap 137mph with boltons and a tune. So yes I understand what you are saying but unless both cars are run on the same day at the same time it will very. And that video absolutely proves it. That FGT and McLaren running right then would have proven that the FGT had a higher trap speed on those pulls as it was still walking away from the McLaren, same day, same time, same race.

Just to show MPH (trap speed) not always tells you who will win from a roll. Both cars belong to Brooks (Fikse GTS)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=in2s...vdzXwnCDxVyNEg

[pdv25]

Woohoo!

Make sure Andy's car comes out just a bit slower than mine.

[FLATOUT]

Make sure Andy's car comes out just a bit slower than mine.

HAHA Well I weight 250 and my wheels are a little heavier than yours so you should be just fine LOL

[pdv25]

HAHA Well I weight 250 and my wheels are a little heavier than yours so you should be just fine LOL

I'm only 25lbs lighter, but I am going on a cruise next week so we might weigh the same by next Sunday lol.

[FLATOUT]

I'm only 25lbs lighter, but I am going on a cruise next week so we might weigh the same by next Sunday lol.

LOL very true.

[Jack B]

Remember the bolt behind the sill that is accessed by partially pulling the rear wheelwell liner.
.

Thanks Mark,

And I just flashed in the HPTuners operating system this morning and did the TB relearn. I will start installing my headers tonight!

[FLATOUT]

Remember the bolt behind the sill that is accessed by partially pulling the rear wheelwell liner.
.

Thanks Jack, and yes Morgan and I were discussing that this morning. Sounds like there are a few new little nuances to the install over the Gen IV's and III's.

[ViperSmith]

Remember the bolt behind the sill that is accessed by partially pulling the rear wheelwell liner.
.

I think that is the hardest thing on the car to get off.

[Jack B]

If you remove just the bolts on the front of the liner, you can pry the bottom of the liner out enough to access the hidden bolt, it is like removing a tire from a wheel, you have to work the liner out of its position

I think that is the hardest thing on the car to get off.

[Simms]

Thanks Jack, and yes Morgan and I were discussing that this morning. Sounds like there are a few new little nuances to the install over the Gen IV's and III's.

Care to share? I'm about ready to dig in.

[FLATOUT]

Care to share? I'm about ready to dig in.

I'll do a write up as I go. Most notable is the sill bolt that Jack mentioned, a small heatshield down low on the frame rails that were'nt on the older cars, different engine mounts (not difficult though), a trick or two to remove the PCV valve to get it out of the way. Nothing major, just little differences.

I should get started tonight so I will start a thread.

[Simms]

I'll do a write up as I go. Most notable is the sill bolt that Jack mentioned, a small heatshield down low on the frame rails that were'nt on the older cars, different engine mounts (not difficult though), a trick or two to remove the PCV valve to get it out of the way. Nothing major, just little differences.

I should get started tonight so I will start a thread.

Perfect! Your writeups are always very informative. I have a full American Racing setup waiting.

[Jack B]

1. Remove cross brace.

2. Remove engine covers.

3. Dr side oem header comes out from the top. I could not get it out without pulling the valve cover. Another option might be to jack that side of the engine, the motor mounts are viscous and will allow the engine to lift. You can also get the header out thru the bottom, however, you have to remove the starter.

4. Unbolt the reservoir on the pass side, you do not need to remove hoses. This is also top removal.

5 You might want to buy some high temp insulating sheet. It will be a good time to add insulation. Make sure you add insulation around the channel for the clutch hyd line. There is a sheet metal heat barrier for the hyd line, however, it has gaps.

6. At the rear where the muffler exits, there are some uninsulated body parts near the seat back, I also insulated those.

Everything else is obvious

Care to share? I'm about ready to dig in.

[Steve M]

Thanks for getting this compare done. I thought you would get 3 lengths 60-130 mph. but looks like you put 5-6 on him. That equates to about 100-120 hp increase real world not just dyno numbers. Great job representing the Gen V.

I think you're seeing two things here...if the IATs on the stock car were even remotely high (like above 86°), the PCM starts pulling timing, and lots of it. As a reference, this is the IAT timing adder from the Gen 4 calibration:



This table is unchanged in the 2013+ calibration...so when you hit that magic number, that's how much timing gets pulled.

The other thing I think you're seeing is the legit power increase from getting the AFR and timing in line with the headers...so you add power and get rid of the power robbing modifiers that pull timing at even the slightest hint of heat, and you get what you see in this video (which is damn impressive, and makes me want headers for my Gen 4 even more).

[Simms]

1. Remove cross brace.

2. Remove engine covers.

3. Dr side oem header comes out from the top. I could not get it out without pulling the valve cover. Another option might be to jack that side of the engine, the motor mounts are viscous and will allow the engine to lift. You can also get the header out thru the bottom, however, you have to remove the starter.

4. Unbolt the reservoir on the pass side, you do not need to remove hoses. This is also top removal.

5 You might want to buy some high temp insulating sheet. It will be a good time to add insulation. Make sure you add insulation around the channel for the clutch hyd line. There is a sheet metal heat barrier for the hyd line, however, it has gaps.

6. At the rear where the muffler exits, there are some uninsulated body parts near the seat back, I also insulated those.

Everything else is obvious

Thanks Jack! Did you use clamps on the cat back or tack weld?

[Jack B]

The pcm also has a very aggressive cat-protect program that activates after a wot shift, that program drops the afr almost 2 points, into the high 9's. You are totally correct, the overall power increase is the result of restricting the nannies, plus, the tune itself. My guess is that on a very cold day, you would not see such a drastic difference.

Another issue that has not been brought up is the afr. I cannot find a table for afr versus ambient air temp. Just because your afr is perfect at 70 deg (dyno tuned at that temp), does not mean it is perfect at 90 degrees. I will know a lot more in the spring time when I have time to play. This may be similar to the Gen2, where we needed tunes for different temps. That was the reason for the VEC3.

I think you're seeing two things here...if the IATs on the stock car were even remotely high (like above 86°), the PCM starts pulling timing, and lots of it. As a reference, this is the IAT timing adder from the Gen 4 calibration:



This table is unchanged in the 2013+ calibration...so when you hit that magic number, that's how much timing gets pulled.

The other thing I think you're seeing is the legit power increase from getting the AFR and timing in line with the headers...so you add power and get rid of the power robbing modifiers that pull timing at even the slightest hint of heat, and you get what you see in this video (which is damn impressive, and makes me want headers for my Gen 4 even more).