Picked up a gen 3 coupe **arrest me red**

[Detroit Muscle]

Man, you guys know how to party

[slowhatch]

So remember when i said i had ordered some custom built spacers and adapters for the snake about a month and a half ago? Well, it has been quite the saga.

The box arrived about a month ago, after a 2 week wait. I immediately set out to put them on--piece of cake i thought. Get the car in the air, all the goods unpacked, and both wheels off on one side so i could mock fit everything before cleaning the surface rust on the hubs.

In the box;

12X - 1/2x20 Chrome ET Lugnuts
2X - Adapter - Hub & Wheel Centric .750" Thick, 6x4.5 71.5 to 6x4.5 71.5
2X - Spacer - Hub & Wheel Centric 3/8" Thick, 6x4.5 71.5 to 71.5





Test fitting the adapter to the rear wheel;





Test fitting the front spacer;




Immediately i realize that 1. They sent me 2 extra front spacers, and 2. I'm missing the nuts to bolt the rear adapters to the oem studs. The latter sucks, and it means i cant get them on tonight, so i decide to just do the fronts. Mount the fronts up, and realize that the 1/2-20 ET nuts, are actually 7/16-20 and wont thread up, furthermore, they only sent 10 nuts. I guess they forgot the vipers are 6 lug (i reminded them during the order process). Someone at the company responsible for filling orders needs to lay off the sauce. I reluctantly put the car back together and fire off an email to the company.

Fast forward a week and a half...

I get another box, with the correct 1/2-20 ET nuts, and the open ended nuts for the rear adapters. Yet again i get the car in the air, and start cleaning and lightly sanding the hub surface--all in anticipation of smooth sailing.



Mocking up the rear adapter;




I bolt up the adapter finger tight, and proceed to check fitment with the wheel. No go. The wheel wont sit flush up against the adapter. I pull the wheel off, and take a gander at the back hub surface. Everything seems fine, so i try to fit it again. Again, wont sit flush. So i look closer... and closer, and scratch my head until it hits me. I felt like an idiot for not noticing this earlier, but the since the adapter is not thick enough to envelop the entire oem stud (you can see in the mock up picture about .250" sticks past it into the wheel hub surface), the wheel obviously has to be clearanced for it. I never thought this was a problem as i knew the factory alcoa's have lightening pockets which are plenty deep, equally spaced between the lug holes. I guess i should of opened my eyes a bit more, because what i hadn't noticed, is that the lightening pockets sit on a bolt circle whose diameter is larger than the stud holes. I've illustrated the issue in the pic below;



So, I sit there for a second, having no one but myself to blame for the shortsightedness, and yet again, put the car back together without the spacers and adapters.

[slowhatch]

Fast forward another 2 weeks...(life happens)

After a chat with a few local viper guys about which machine shop could take care of the wheels, I settled on 'Nicken's Brothers Racing Engines' to perform the task (thanks for the contact Tony W.). I pulled the wheels for a 3rd time and brought them to their shop. David Nickens has to be one of the nicest car guys I've ever met and i was immediately awestruck by the shear amount of NHRA trophies he had displayed as i stepped into his office. I made the mistake of striking up a drag racing related conversation and quickly realized this chap has forgotten more about drag racing than I'll ever learn. He started telling me stories about him and his good friend John Force--ever heard of him? haha--and i sat there slack jawed listening to the tales. I literally could of sat there and picked the mans brain all day, but i unfortunately had to return to the office from my "lunch". We discussed what was needed to be milled off on the wheels (I asked for a 5/8" hole, depth of .750", indicated off the oem thru holes, equally spaced), and i was on my way. He had them ready the next morning, and for a more than reasonable price. I wish all of my impromptu adventures played out so smoothly.

I picked up the wheels and started up on the car yet again; third times a charm right?



Washed the wheels, and made sure to get out all of the shavings from the freshly milled holes.



Notice the clearancing done on the oem lightening holes;




Starting with the rears, i sand and clean both hub surfaces (wheel and car), and proceed to bolt up the adapter (finger tight) in a star pattern to ensure proper hubcentric fit.





After the gradually tightening the nuts by hand and centralizing the adapter to the hub surface, i began to torque the nuts (star pattern of course), first to 75-lb ft, and finally to 100-lb ft.



Put the wheel on, and it sits perfectly flush against the adapter. Perfect. Proceed to run up the lug nuts and torque in a star pattern as usual (100-lb ft).



You can see the rear adapter thickness in this pic;



All done, and torqued down.



I step back to pat myself on the back and check the fitment. Looking hella flush as the kids say LOL. I am even more excited to get the car on the ground at this point so i proceed to perform the same task on the other rear.



Right rear, adapter mounted, and torqued.



I set the car down and proceed to the fronts. Much easier on the fronts, remove wheel, clean both hub surfaces, slap on the spacer, and re-install wheel. I perform the steps and start putting on the new ET nuts on the oem studs (for those that dont know, 'ET' stands for 'extra turns', and provides extra thread engagement to balance the loss from the spacers). I run up the first, then the second, but the 3rd wont go. I look down at the nut, 7/16-20. Silly me, must of grabbed the old bag with the wrong nuts, so i grab the other one. Pull a nut out, 7/16-20, another, 7/16-20, another, 7/16-20, faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaacccccckkkkk. For the third time, they sent me the wrong ET nuts. But I'm no idiot, when i got the new bag 2 weeks ago, i reached in, and pulled out 2 nuts (at random mind you) to check to make sure they were the right ones. The chances of me pulling out the 2 1/2-20 nuts out of a full bag of 7/16-20s was quite small; i accomplished the feat. At this point i couldn't even get mad, I just laughed at how the whole situation played out. I decided that i had come too far at this point, and decided to install the spacers anyway. I checked the thread engagement with the spacers and oem nuts, and although not ideal, they still offered plenty of engagement length. I tossed 1 correct ET nut on each front, and oem's on the rest. Once again, another email to the company requesting the proper product, for real this time.

Both fronts mounted and torqued;



Front spacer thickness;



Pulled the car out to check fitment and its absolutely perfect. Just like i imagined, flush front and rear

[slowhatch]

Last Friday the guys dragged me out to baytown, and although i wasn't planning on running the car, the promise of negative DAs made me ambitious to push the car deeper into the 11s. I know the car has 11.30s@125 in it as it sits, i just have to make a clean pass in good air.

Hit the track straight from the office as usual, arrived early, and were first in the staging lanes;




My buddy mikes bolt on cts-v (made a damn fast pass that night 11.5@123).



My other buds bolt on GT500.






Saw a sick cobra jet there as well (dont know if it was real or not)...




The three stooges;



Checking the air




We started making passes at 7pm when the DA was around -200ft, and as the temperatures dropped, the DA progressed down to around -650ft at the end of the night. I made 3 passes that night, all of which were a disappointment.

1st run (slip with the 1.92 60')

Car wheel hops like crazy in first, i get in and out of it, in both 1st and 2nd gear. Low trap, meh ET, dissapoint.

2nd run (slip with the 1.78 60')

3K rpm, slip it out and it bites down and comes out of the hole like a bat out of hell, this is the launch i've been trying to extract; then, i miss 3rd. I find it and keep going, but the damage to the ET and mph is done. Why, why did i have to botch this up. I rarely, if ever, miss shifts, (humblebrag i know), I missed 2 shifts on 3 passes that night. Completely disappointing. That run, if clean, would of been a deep 11 pass @ 124-125.

3rd run (slip with the 1.88 60')

I thought this was going to be the one, did everything as usual, wheelhop. Then i miss 4th, wtf. Sigh, after that pass i figured it just wasn't my night, so i called it quits.




All in all, was a not so fun track time (I'm very competitive with myself and get pissed off when i dont hit the marks i set in my mind). At least i proved that it is possible to cut 1.7x 60' on the factory run flats. The air was right to get the time and traps i needed, my driving just wasn't there that night. Maybe next time

[slowhatch]

So after i got suspension and spacers on i figured it was time to do big red justice with proper photography. So last weekend I enlisted the help of a good buddy (Malcolm P.), and we set off into downtown to shoot some shots. I was extremely pleased with the outcome, Malcolm is a very talented individual, and although I am quite bias, the car looked breath taking!

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[slowhatch]

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[Fatboy 18]

What a great write up and pics, have to say reading of your troubles I thought it was going to end badly at the track with sheered wheel bolts or something! Phew....A happy ending

I'm sure there are many out there that would not want to get the machine work done that you did.

Great job and thank you for the detailed write up, Awesome pics,
Enjoy your ride.

[The_Greg]

19.

Funny, this parking structure looks JUST like that one you were near!
005.jpg

Thank you for taking the time to write about your car and experiences so thoroughly. It probably take s you a little longer than we might think but it gives us northerners something to do in the cold. I don't want to turn this into a weather thread but it might be the coldest high temp for any Feb. 27th on record here in WI so... yeah.

Also, your car looks like a copperhead in some of these pics.

[slowhatch]

Funny, this parking structure looks JUST like that one you were near!
005.jpg

Thank you for taking the time to write about your car and experiences so thoroughly. It probably take s you a little longer than we might thinkbut it gives us northerners something to do in the cold. I don't want to turn this into a weather thread but it might be the coldest high temp for any Feb. 27th on record here in WI so... yeah.

Also, your car looks like a copperhead in some of these pics.

It takes me hours! But it's all worth it if it helps someone or inspires someone to do something on their vehicle. I know cubican's thread on the other site inspired me to go the spacer/adapter route and i couldn't be happier. I love reading build threads, and have done so for many years while learning many things; It's time to pay it forward!

And greg, how dare you pollute my thread with my #1 choice of colors When i was shopping i was looking for a GTS blue stripe delete coupe, stars just didn't align. That car is beautiful!

Ps. The car looks solid red on all of my monitors/laptops, so if its looking orange on your end, time to adjust those color saturation settings on that monitor

[The_Greg]

#1 choice of colors When i was shopping i was looking for a GTS blue stripe delete coupe, stars just didn't align. That car is beautiful!

Ps. The car looks solid red on all of my monitors/laptops, so if its looking orange on your end, time to adjust those color saturation settings on that monitor

You and I both. There were no blue/stripe deletes for sale when I was buying. Blue/silver was a second option, but there weren't any in my price range. No regrets in the end

Yeah, I have a dual monitor setup and have also viewed this thread on multiple computers, still looks slightly orange to me. Even compared to your avatar. Maybe it's the slight desaturation the photographer applied to the pictures working weird with my brain.

[Fatboy 18]

Fast Red on my HP Laptop running windows 8

[cmilviper]

Great pics indeed!

[Nine Ball]

To cut a 1.7x 60' on the crap-tastic run flats is good driving. That wheel hop you are experiencing is 100% tire related. I know you lift when it happens, but sometimes the damage is done if you do it too many times. I'd strongly advise getting rid of those tires, especially as much as you enjoy racing. The main issue with them is that they hit their traction limit instantly, which causes most Vipers to spin out aka "Snake Bit".

What mods are next?

I work in that shiny building in the photos.

Tony

[No hemi]

Very good thread, can you tell me where i can get the spacers and adapters , i have H spokes on my car and Love the way the wheels look in yours!!, thank You..

[C.J]

Very thorough write up -- thank you for taking the time to do that! Had to laugh when you checked two nuts out of the bag. Incredible odds of doing that, but you're the lucky guy. But, persistence paid off.

Are the spacers purely a cosmetic modification, or is there some advantage of having the wheels a little further out? Does this change the load on wheel bearings at all?

Your Viper has a really great stance!

[slowhatch]

To cut a 1.7x 60' on the crap-tastic run flats is good driving. That wheel hop you are experiencing is 100% tire related. I know you lift when it happens, but sometimes the damage is done if you do it too many times. I'd strongly advise getting rid of those tires, especially as much as you enjoy racing. The main issue with them is that they hit their traction limit instantly, which causes most Vipers to spin out aka "Snake Bit".

What mods are next?

I work in that shiny building in the photos.

Tony

Yeah, i need to pony up and get rid of them. I've been apprehensive about it because the rears are brand new. Andy mentioned that he has a set of cups he may part with, how do you think those will fare with my extracurricular activities. I really don't plan on going back to the strip unless i do something else to the car (power wise), i know what it's capable of at this point.

Next mods, I wouldn't really call mods, more like fixes. First, I have to get the A/C fixed. I remember a month ago I noticed the A/C was blowing hot (it used to be ice cold), so i visually checked the system and found a spot of impact damage on the condenser (most likely from a nasty rock). I'm not looking forward to getting bent over at Tomball for diagnostics, a new core, and a re-charge. I've been getting by as we haven't got out of the 70s in a month or two, but i think that gravy train has run its course. Secondly, I need to do something about the audio in the car, its abysmal. The woofer has been blown since day 1, and even faded all the way to the front stage and bass turned to -8 it still rattles (sounds like the surround on the cone has left the building), making it essentially un-listenable. I want to get a replacement box from ntense-autoworks which will contain a sealed and poly-filled shallow mount 8", and replace the front stage and rear fill. Anyone know the impedance on the factory setup? Is it 4 or 8 ohm?

Wish list after the necessities; gen 4 hood, and a used paxton setup with a proper fuel system.

Ps. If you're in that building I'm gonna guess, PM for Shell?

Very good thread, can you tell me where i can get the spacers and adapters , i have H spokes on my car and Love the way the wheels look in yours!!, thank You..

I got them from http://www.motorsport-tech.com/. Shoot them an email and they'll set you up.

[slowhatch]

Very thorough write up -- thank you for taking the time to do that! Had to laugh when you checked two nuts out of the bag. Incredible odds of doing that, but you're the lucky guy. But, persistence paid off.

Are the spacers purely a cosmetic modification, or is there some advantage of having the wheels a little further out? Does this change the load on wheel bearings at all?

Your Viper has a really great stance!

There should be a nice mechanical grip advantage to increasing your track width .75" in the front and 1.5" in the rear, in addition to the cosmetic benefits. As far as the negatives, the only thing I could think of was the fact that you are essentially moving your rotating mass further out from the bearing surface and increasing the bending moment on the wheel bearings. I am sure the increase is fairly minute, but its an increase nonetheless. This increase could be akin to purchasing wheels with a lower offset (as many do). Obviously its not a direct correlation as the calculations are shape specific (differing wheel designs have different mass moments), but i digress. Point is, they are fine, I have seen them used countless times on race tracks for years, with no issues.

As long as you make sure the adapters and spacers are made of a proper material (T6-6061 Aluminum with grade 8 hardware) and they are hub-centric to the wheel and car, the assembly is properly torqued (and the mating surfaces are true and clean), you maintain proper thread engagement length of the stud (either through adapters, or ET nuts) they shouldn't pose any issues.

[slowhatch]

Here are a few of my untouched behind the scenes pics from the shoot. I took these to highlight the wheel fitment after the spacer/adapter install.

[brifri11]

All these pictures are great! But I do agree with Greg. The first set of "touched" up pictures makes it look like a copperhead, you "untouched" pictures on the other hand are the natural red. Still looks phenomenal either way, and very clean!

[IndyRon]

Very nice pics and good work on doing the spacers the right way. Just make sure you have at least 7 turns on those front lug nuts if you haven't replaced them yet.

[The_Greg]

All these pictures are great! But I do agree with Greg. The first set of "touched" up pictures makes it look like a copperhead, you "untouched" pictures on the other hand are the natural red. Still looks phenomenal either way, and very clean!

I'm on my brand new Mac at home, and its red as red can be. Bizarre.

[slowhatch]

Been enjoying taking the car out for some leisurely and spirited drives over the past month or so. TX2K14 was fun, although the weather spoiled the weekend events.

On to the updates; Ever since i purchased the vehicle, I had been wanting to give it a proper wheels off detail, correction, and sealant. Although I give my best effort to keep her pristine (car never sees rain) and employ the best washing practices (3 bucket washes, proper drying techniques, etc), there were some things that needed undoing from the previous owner. It was obvious the car was garaged all of its life, however, i doubt the previous owner knew how to really take care of paint. There was some holograming, a few RIDS here and there, swirls on the hatch, etc. All things that most wouldn't notice nor give any credence to, but they always stood out to me whenever I'd get the car out into some harsh light. Everyone else saw it as pristine example, all I could see are the flaws. Sometimes, I honestly wonder what it would be like to be an average human being, and not be consumed by OCD idiosyncrasies.

I had been deferring my detailing plans out of laziness but was sprung into action by two unfortunate occurrences. To start, I picked up a nasty chip on my front fender which drove me nuts. A week later, another--even worse one--on my hood. Once seen, it could not be unseen; I would literally go into the garage, stare it, piss myself off, and pace about the garage. This went on for about a week, until I finally tracked down a local detailer that I felt could be trusted enough to rectify said predicament. Curtis, from Clarity Auto Detailing, an engineer by day, and detailer by night. Sharing a common background and a seemingly overbearing attention to detail, he seemed like the man for the job. We had some conversations about what I wanted out of the finished product, and we settled on a wheels off detail, full correction, interior and engine bay cleaning, and a nano ceramic sealant to finish it all off (C-Quartz Finest). He was also going to build up the chips I had picked up, layer by layer, with some touch up I had procured from the local dealer and seal them with a few coats of C-Quartz.

On to the culprit of this rejuvenation;





I dropped the car off at Clarity at the top of the week, with plans to pick it up on the weekend. They were on time, and their attention to detail far exceeded any expectations I had for this service.

The car started off with a wash and a decontamination (clay).





The chips were analyzed with the help of a microscope to be actively filled in, layer by layer, as the detail progressed.

[slowhatch]

Results of the chip repair--on the hood.



On the front fender.



Then the interior was tackled. Leather was steamed, suede cleaned, carpets cleaned, etc.




Focus returned to the exterior, where some test spots were performed for the correction. Final verdict was a white pad and Wolfgang TSR, using a yellow pad on stubborn spots, and finishing with a Black pad and CG V38.




The hatch was by and far, the worst panel on the vehicle.





Wax residue from previous work.



Taillights and headlights were polished using a white pad and Wolfgang TSR.



All glass was polished with CG V34 and an orange pad.

[slowhatch]

Wheels come off to address the wheel wells, suspension, calipers etc. Steam was used along with some general purpose cleaners as well as a heavy degreaser.










The wheels are tackled next;



Iron-X to deironize the wheels, and Chemical Guys AllClean to finish them off.






After a good cleaning, any grease and oils were removed using Eraser to prep the wheels for sealant. CG Jet seal was used.




Wheels are sealed and beading.



Wheels back on;



Curtis gave me a shout and asked if I had his blessing to play with the valve covers, I told him to do his thing.

"The Viper valve covers come with a roughly machined surface and it tends to grab dirt and grime and stain. I sanded it down with 400, 600, 1000, 2000, 3000 grit papers then used a metal polish and a sealant so the aluminum wouldnt oxidize."

[slowhatch]

After the paint was corrected, the wheels, wheel wells, suspension, interior, and engine bay were complete; It was time for coating. Surface was prepped with eraser, and then on went C-Quartz.




"After the coating was done this car just popped and even impressed us."









"When we pulled the car out in the sun, it was actually challenging for me to get a decent photo of it. The paint was just screaming bright red and glowing. It looked fake in person."



I cannot express how good the car looks in person. It looks like liquid red glass. The amount of work Curtis and his team put into the car the past week was nothing short excessive, nothing was overlooked, no imperfections left unfettered. I am above and beyond enamored with the outcome and if i told you guys how much i was charged you wouldn't believe me. I felt like I was ripping them off. If you are local, do yourself a favor and give Clarity a phone call.