Oil Cooler Lines

[Old School]

When I was replacing mine with roll-your-own I considered adding a remote oil filter at the same time.

[Gen5snake]

Those steel braided lines are nice...but what ever they touch, vibration turns those things into saws. They seem to cut through anything. On race cars, you usually don't have to worry about much as there's not much to cut through. Make sure there are no wires or anything resting on them.

[TRH62]

NOTED.

Those steel braided lines are nice...but what ever they touch, vibration turns those things into saws. They seem to cut through anything. On race cars, you usually don't have to worry about much as there's not much to cut through. Make sure there are no wires or anything resting on them.

[Steve M]

Those steel braided lines are nice...but what ever they touch, vibration turns those things into saws. They seem to cut through anything. On race cars, you usually don't have to worry about much as there's not much to cut through. Make sure there are no wires or anything resting on them.

Yes...the Viper Specialty lines come with covers to prevent exactly this.

[TRH62]

I was able to put the lines on myself tonight. I will say it was a little tedious and tight doing it at the engine area. I ended up taking the oil filter off for easier access. But I got it done and and I'm happy about it. I drove the car for about 5 miles and I'll go back and check everything later. Thanks for everyone's input.

[SLP]

I was able to put the lines on myself tonight. I will say it was a little tedious and tight doing it at the engine area. I ended up taking the oil filter off for easier access. But I got it done and and I'm happy about it. I drove the car for about 5 miles and I'll go back and check everything later. Thanks for everyone's input.

Good work! How was accessing the lines with the pan still on? Doable? Tools used?

[swexlin]

I was able to put the lines on myself tonight. I will say it was a little tedious and tight doing it at the engine area. I ended up taking the oil filter off for easier access. But I got it done and and I'm happy about it. I drove the car for about 5 miles and I'll go back and check everything later. Thanks for everyone's input.

I assume you have a lift in your garage? And let's see some pics!

[TRH62]

Definitely doable using a 1in socket and driver putting the new fittings on. I disconnected the hose in front the oil pan by removing the two screws so that I could get my hands in there to screw the fittings into the oil pan once I removed the old lines and also removed the oil filter. Once I got starting with it all it was a breeze. Just be sure to look at how the lines are routed from the cooler down to the oil pan. I ended taking off the top coolant line to the cooler so that it wasn't in the way when I was tightening up the fitting for the top oil line to the cooler.

Good work! How was accessing the lines with the pan still on? Doable? Tools used?

[blingnoring]

Good work! How was accessing the lines with the pan still on? Doable? Tools used?

I also did it myself, used a 1' open end wrench for the lines at the oil pan. I didn't need to remove the oil filter, but I did undo the coolant lines at the other end to make it easier to undo oem and tighten the new oil lines. I also took those 'panty hose' sleeves from the oem lines and put them over the new ones, i'm guessing they protect the lines from heat. if you take your time, its pretty straight forward. I enjoyed it cause it was the first time I got to look under the car. Thanks SLP for recommending the RSI oil cooler lines, much better.

[ViperTony]

Yes...the Viper Specialty lines come with covers to prevent exactly this.

I ended up making my own on my Gen2 at the time because there were no aftermarket and Dan didn't have them. But will go with VSP's lines on the Gen5....his quality is second to none.

[Viper Specialty]

Hey everyone,

First off, for any of the guys in this thread using our lines- thanks, and you surely can see first hand what sets ours apart from the other options out there. For those who are arguing the price point, its a free country, you can install any type of lines you would like to install... but don't for one second think you are getting the "same thing" for less money.

For anyone who doesn't know how I do things, I purposely go out of my way to look for problems, and solve them before they become an issue. Proper design & engineering is all I choose to do, and cost be damned. Our lines are significantly more expensive than the competition. What you probably don't know is, that our lines are one of the lowest margin items we sell. I literally sell them for parts cost, plus assembly labor time, plus whatever the shipping costs were to get the parts here on average. We assemble our crimped lines using a nearly $8000, Electro-Hydraulic crimping machine with XRP specific dies, hose cutter and table. Needless to say I don't even think I've even paid off that equipment yet building oil lines... but I use it for Fuel Lines all the time, and was planning on getting dies for brake lines and similar at some point as well... so I suppose I wont beat myself up too badly over buying it.

So, the reason our lines are more expensive? Because the parts we use are more expensive. The hose we use is more expensive. The coverings we use are more expensive. Those thousand dollar oil lines? Yeah, that's what happens when they are constructed with four feet of $50 a foot hose, (4) $50 fittings, (4) $35 adapters, and $250 in QD clamps for every set... not to mention the O-Rings and the sockets! If Viper Tax now equates to making less than 20% on a product you have to physically build for a customer... then I guess I am guilty as hell. LOL

The lines that EVERYONE else sells are regular old JIC hose end Stainless Braided oil lines. These are cheap as hell and can be found anywhere. I could have gone that route, but chose not to. No name hose and fittings are a pain in the ass, and the tolerances are horrible for assembly. Even if they are brand name, JIC hose ends and adapters have a finite lifespan, as ANYONE who deals with these fittings knows, the lock-ring in the nut is only good for a few assembly/disassembly cycles before it galls, and your hose end is shot. These are non-swivel JIC's [or single at best], meaning that when the engine torques, the hose is pulled against the JIC compression fitting. This can cause them to come loose eventually, and fatigue the fittings. When you combine the fact that they fail faster when tight, but also leak when loose... its a double edged sword. Competitor hoses are bare stainless, or bare aramid braid. Bare stainless scratches and damages anything it touches or vibrates against, while aramid fiber frays like crazy when it vibrates against something else that is rough or sharp. All of these line types require getting either an open end or crows foot up on the inlet port to the block... and that is the most fun of the entire installation process.

Then there are the "hydraulic hose company" creations using 10,000 PSI hoses that are stiffer than Peter North after confusing Viagra for skittles in the dark. These have a whole list of other potential side effects, not the least of which is fatiguing the oil cooler I/O ports until then eventually crack.

So, what does VSP do different?
-ALL of our lines use either dual-swivel O-Ring Boss fittings, or full-swivel Quick Connect fittings- all lines are designed to swivel at the port.
-NONE of our lines use JIC fittings, or any kind of lock-ring based compression fitting. They are either Direct-Port O-Ring Boss fittings, or Tool-Less Quick Disconnects.
-ALL of our lines are sold with a permanent protective cover to prevent them from damaging anything else in the engine compartment, or themselves.
-ALL FOUR higher end line versions use Quick Connects at the engine side, eliminating the main install hassle.
-NONE of our hose ends are "torque dependent" for leak-prevention. They are all O-Rings based and full swivel. Whether they are fully torqued or finger tight, they will not leak.


So, in closing, its not such a simple problem when you actually consider the full set of ramifications. That said, I get it. This market for the most part is all about dollars and cents these days, and everyone is free to do as they wish of course... just try to keep an open mind about the fact that some people prefer to do things 100%, and that's not a bad thing.

[ViperGeorge]

Hey everyone,

First off, for any of the guys in this thread using our lines- thanks, and you surely can see first hand what sets ours apart from the other options out there. For those who are arguing the price point, its a free country, you can install any type of lines you would like to install... but don't for one second think you are getting the "same thing" for less money.

For anyone who doesn't know how I do things, I purposely go out of my way to look for problems, and solve them before they become one. Proper design & engineering is all I choose to do, and cost be damned. Our lines are significantly more expensive than the competition. What you also probably don't know, is that our lines are one of the lowest margin items we sell. I literally sell them for parts cost, plus assembly labor time, plus whatever the shipping costs were to get the parts here on average. We assemble our crimped lines using a nearly $8000, Electro-Hydraulic crimping machine with XRP specific dies, hose cutter and table. Needless to say I don't even think I've even paid off that equipment yet building oil lines... but I use it for Fuel Lines all the time, and was planning on getting dies for brake lines and similar at some point as well.

So, the reason our lines are more expensive? Because the parts we use are more expensive. The hose we use is more expensive. The coverings we use are more expensive. Those thousand dollar oil lines? Yeah, that's what happens when they are constructed with (4)$50 a foot hose, (4)$50 fittings, (4)$35 adapters, and $250 in QD clamps for every set... not to mention the O-Rings and the sockets! If Viper Tax now equates to making less than 20% on a product you have to physically build for a customer... then I guess I am guilty as hell. LOL

The lines that EVERYONE else sells are regular old JIC hose end Stainless braided oil lines. These are cheap as hell and can be found anywhere. I could have gone that route, but chose not to. No name hose and fittings are a pain in the ass, and the tolerances are horrible for assembly. Even if they are brand name, JIC hose ends and adapters have a finite lifespan, as ANYONE who deals with these fittings knows, the lock-ring in the nut is only good for a few assembly/disassembly cycles before it galls, and your hose end is shot. These are non-swivel JIC's [or single at best], meaning that when the engine torques, the hose is pulled against the JIC compression fitting. This can cause them to come loose eventually, and fatigue the fittings. When you combine the fact that they fail faster when tight, but also leak when loose... its a double edged sword. Competitor hoses are bare stainless, or bare aramid braid. Bare stainless literally scratches and damages anything it touches or vibrates against, while aramid fiber frays like crazy when it vibrates against something else that is rough. All of these line types require getting both an open end or crows foot up on the inlet port to the block... and that is the most fun of the entire install process.

Then there are the "hydraulic hose company" creations using 10,000 PSI hose that is stiffer than Peter North after confusing Viagra for skittles in the dark. These have a whole list of other potential side effects, not the least is which is fatiguing the oil cooler I/O ports until then eventually crack.

So, what does VSP do different?
-ALL of our lines use either dual-swivel O-Ring Boss fittings, or full-swivel Quick Connect fittings- all lines are designed to swivel at the port.
-NONE of our lines use JIC fittings, or any kind of lock-ring based compression fitting. They are either Direct-Port O-Ring Boss fittings, or Tool-Less Quick Disconnects.
-ALL of our lines are sold with a permanent protective cover to prevent them from damaging anything else in the engine compartment, or themselves.
-ALL FOUR higher end line versions all use Quick Connects at the engine side, eliminating the main install hassle.
-NONE of our hose ends are "torque dependent" for leak-prevention. They are all O-Rings based and full swivel. Whether they are fully torqued or finger tight, they will not leak.


So, in closing, its not such a simple problem when you actually consider the full set of ramifications. That said, I get it. This market for the most part is all about dollars and cents these days, and everyone is free to do as they wish of course... just try to keep an open mind about the fact that some people prefer to do things 100%, and that's not a bad thing.

I will say this. If you switch to Viper Specialty's oil lines it will be the last time you have to change lines. OEM lines leak, get replaced, and leak again. Ok, I guess when they are under warranty it doesn't matter but if your warranty is done bite the bullet and get the best. Yes they are bloody expensive but as Dan says they are top notch and made from top notch parts. I've used them on three of my cars over time. Just had them installed on my ACR/TA along with the 9 liter extreme.

[Steve M]

I will say this. If you switch to Viper Specialty's oil lines it will be the last time you have to change lines. OEM lines leak, get replaced, and leak again. Ok, I guess when they are under warranty it doesn't matter but if your warranty is done bite the bullet and get the best. Yes they are bloody expensive but as Dan says they are top notch and made from top notch parts. I've used them on three of my cars over time. Just had them installed on my ACR/TA along with the 9 liter extreme.

Knowing what I know now, and being an avid DIY'er, I'd still use Dan's lines even with all the other options out there today. Not the uber expensive quick disconnect ones, just like the ones I already have that he made back in 2012 when my stock lines started leaking. I've made quite a few fuel lines, and a handful of oil lines in the past, and the difference between the good stuff and the cheap stuff is night and day. I've also had to redo lines that were made with the cheap stuff when they eventually failed. He's not kidding about the prices of the fittings he uses - as I've said before, I've tried to source them myself, and they were $$$.

[gpbtt]

Ok,
I will take a set!

[Viper Specialty]

Ok,
I will take a set!

For info: http://viperspecialtyperformance.com...hp/cPath/22_34

To order: ViperSpecialty@Gmail.com

[Bryan Savage]

+1 for the VSP lines. I put the 4x HS79-CSM set on my car because I only want to do the job once. It's worth it to me to not have to struggle ever again with hoses like that which are so important. Once the awful OEM lines were off, the VSP lines were very easy to install.

As mentioned above, exposed stainless braid is just another failure waiting to happen. It will destroy anything it touches, and especially in this case, your engine oil pressure is a tiny fraction of what these hoses can hold. It's overkill.

[Viper Specialty]

+1 for the VSP lines. I put the 4x HS79-CSM set on my car because I only want to do the job once. It's worth it to me to not have to struggle ever again with hoses like that which are so important. Once the awful OEM lines were off, the VSP lines were very easy to install.

As mentioned above, exposed stainless braid is just another failure waiting to happen. It will destroy anything it touches, and especially in this case, your engine oil pressure is a tiny fraction of what these hoses can hold. It's overkill.

Believe it or not, the HS79 and Pro Plus are rated "relatively similarly" to Stainless braid, they are in the 400-600psi operating pressure range [compared to 800-1000 for SS depending on manufacturer], with burst pressures 1600-2000 [about 2500 for SS Braid]. Kevlar is nearly as strong as Stainless in the Pro-Plus, and the HS79 actually does have a SS reinforcement as well as aramid. On the other end, the Teflon/silicone/aramid constructions actually have a higher temp rating by over 100 degrees compared to rubber/stainless, without the permeation issues, breakdown/cracking from exposure to high temps and chemicals, etc.

Long and short of it, is that it is still WAY overrated on pressures for the actual application, but it has better specs where it matters, which is temp and chemical resistance.

[TRH62]

Great info, Dan! If I end up having to replace mine again, I'll be happy to pay a little more for the next lines.