BJ auction

[nitromilt]

It got to be so obvious that the commercial were bordering excessive.... so each time they when on commercial break I timed them... (timer on my iPhone) the commercials were any where from 4+ minutes each time with the longest going just a tick over 5 minutes.... I understand that commercials pays the bills for tv stations.... but 5 minutes was nuts...

[ViperNC]

'05'06 FGT shows us all we need to know. 4000 total cars in the two years, 340 heritage edition cars, the only LE (about 8% of the total production). The FGT LE had unique color scheme, unavailable to anyone else, but was otherwise the same exact car as the non-LE cars. Nearly 15 years out of production, and a low mile LE fetches anywhere from 10-20% more money than a non-LE car ($330k vs. $400k). But all are quite a bit more valuable than they sold for, primarily because they are all awesome, highly desirable and obviously quite a rare sight (especially these days).

Our Vipers are on a similar trajectory -- some would even argue are destined to shoot much higher just based on production volume alone (only about 750 ACR-E ever made). But LE is not going to be the massive differentiator alone. I think you will see some very unique, true 1-of-1 color combinations that will get big dollars as well (think Stryker colors, which none of the LE's took advantage of for some reason or another).

Before I make my comment on your logic here, please know I LOVE the Viper and also love the Ford GT. I seriously doubt our Vipers will ever be on the same trajectory as the Ford GT. Very few cars are and the main reason is the history, heritage, and pedigree of the GT40 and Ford GT. Viper didn't win LeMans 4 years in a row beating Ferrari. Ford did. Viper didn't come back 50 years later and win LeMans. Ford did. Any speculation of the Viper being held in such high regards and on par with the Ford GT will leave that person wanting. I do think we'll see increased values for low mileage Vipers in the future, but time will tell if it will be anything of great significance. Both cars are awesome and I'm not putting down the Viper or its racing achievements. I'm lucky to have owned two Vipers thus far and will probably never sell the Gen 5. Hopefully one day I'll be able to afford the elusive Ford GT or at least a Superformance GT40.

[Exhlr8n]

True. I think the most expensive one i saw was a white ACR-E, Matte White It sold at BJ for $286,000!

By the way, I was surprised at the rather pedestrian cars that populated Saturday's docket. Maybe it is just my opinion but I thought there were many better cars earlier in the week that normally would have been sold on Saturday. Instead they were selling cars for $40-$50K on Saturday. Weird.

My thoughts exactly. A lot better cars too.

[Policy Limits]

not sure how a car approved and built by SRT/Dodge is a Dealer Slapper Sticker Car.

Did woodhouse put the ACR/TA sticker on the car? Did the manufacturer?


Love that orange paint & glad that it brought big bucks at a previous auction. Definitely not bad mouthing the car, or any snake. Just pointing out that there were 6 manufacturer special Edition cars and that wasn't one of them. It reminds me of the numbered Gerry Wood solid Edition cars.

[Policy Limits]

I seriously doubt our Vipers will ever be on the same trajectory as the Ford GT. Any speculation of the Viper being held in such high regards and on par with the Ford GT will leave that person wanting.

We must not be watching the same market.

[Voice of Reason]

Did woodhouse put the ACR/TA sticker on the car? Did the manufacturer?

Bills refusal time and time again to answer this simple yes/no question is answer enough.

[St Pete Viper ACR E]

True. I think the most expensive one i saw was a white ACR-E, Matte White It sold at BJ for $286,000!

By the way, I was surprised at the rather pedestrian cars that populated Saturday's docket. Maybe it is just my opinion but I thought there were many better cars earlier in the week that normally would have been sold on Saturday. Instead they were selling cars for $40-$50K on Saturday. Weird.

Yes I was just looking at the docket myself and thought the same:

https://www.barrett-jackson.com/Even...020/01-19-2020

[Bill Pemberton]

Well since according to two very high up FCA Execs , it was definitely a " Limited Model," made for a Dealer and they had to approve it . I think I will go with their approval and the Dodge build and let the money Collectors are willing to pay define things - instead of listening to the conspiracy theories you love to stir.

I am getting too mellow, all Vipers are getting worth more and more, and arguing about things I am fully aware you know nothing about is childish on my part, my apologies.

I need to grow up and not bait you , I just find your insinuations about Vipers other than yours, not being as genuine or valuable a bit silly.
Yet, I am being foolish because we are all passionate and for years I have commented on the best Viper out there is the one in the owner's garage. Time to move on, we are all passionate and of course the best Viper is what we have , though I think many of us are enjoying the rise in pricing --- since so many felt it would not happen.

Have a nice weekend.

[ViperNC]

We must not be watching the same market.

OK walk with me on this. The 2017 Red Ford GT sold for almost $1.5 Mil last night and dealer invoice is $450,000. A 2005 Ford Gt Blue/Silver Stripes sold for $450,000 yesterday and original sticker around $160,000. I recently saw a 2006 Ford Gt with 30,000 miles sell for $230,000. How many Vipers have you seen sell for an appreciated amount with that many miles? Have any 2017 ACR's tripled in value in 3 years? Or any Viper triple in value in 15 years for that matter?

Once again, not knocking the Viper. Just doing the math. I would love to be able to put 30,000 on my Viper and then sell it for more than I paid for it.

[ACRSNK]

I don’t think the stickers and contrived Bernie “numbering” added a thing to the hammer price. Factory installed options and decals make a world of difference obviously. A dealer slapping them on and doing their own numbering.....not so much.

Agreed as subtle as it may be it is more than obvious factory designations DO make a difference

[ACRSNK]

OK walk with me on this. The 2017 Red Ford GT sold for almost $1.5 Mil last night and dealer invoice is $450,000. A 2005 Ford Gt Blue/Silver Stripes sold for $450,000 yesterday and original sticker around $160,000. I recently saw a 2006 Ford Gt with 30,000 miles sell for $230,000. How many Vipers have you seen sell for an appreciated amount with that many miles? Have any 2017 ACR's tripled in value in 3 years? Or any Viper triple in value in 15 years for that matter?

Once again, not knocking the Viper. Just doing the math. I would love to be able to put 30,000 on my Viper and then sell it for more than I paid for it.

The blue silver FGT was a unique car with a unique story and owner and to answer your question regarding any Viper selling for triple its value the answer is YES and on more than one occasion

[ViperJon]

Look at the bright side. We could own McLaren's.

[Policy Limits]

Bills refusal time and time again to answer this simple yes/no question is answer enough.

Bingo.

[Policy Limits]

Look at the bright side. We could own McLaren's.

That's funny. And true. Holy depreciation batman

[zee]

That's funny. And true. Holy depreciation batman

It really is ridiculous. 1 year of ownership and it is pretty sad how bad these things hold value. The car is incredible though . Having a tough time figuring out what to replace it with...

[commandomatt]

OK walk with me on this. The 2017 Red Ford GT sold for almost $1.5 Mil last night and dealer invoice is $450,000. A 2005 Ford Gt Blue/Silver Stripes sold for $450,000 yesterday and original sticker around $160,000. I recently saw a 2006 Ford Gt with 30,000 miles sell for $230,000. How many Vipers have you seen sell for an appreciated amount with that many miles? Have any 2017 ACR's tripled in value in 3 years? Or any Viper triple in value in 15 years for that matter?

Once again, not knocking the Viper. Just doing the math. I would love to be able to put 30,000 on my Viper and then sell it for more than I paid for it.

Cant do that walk with you. The NFGT was very limited from the get go with more orders than production. This car will most likely never see a depreciation but hard to compare it to much else other than limited Italians.

The 2005-6 Ford GTs are now 10 +years old. In the first few years there was zero increase in value. As a mater of fact, many dealers had a problem getting them sold and many did cut the cost in order to do so.

So if we compare the Gen Vs to this, they are doing better. I am not talking about the entire production but the later years. Special editions, well put together 1 of 1s and powerful colors like the Strykers will be seeing an increase over time and in 10 plus years could very well be up there with the Ford GTs (as they are today) values.

Thats my take

[ViperGeorge]

Bingo.

You guys are really missing the point with the ACR/TA. Whether the factory installed the TA decal or not who cares? They supplied it whether they installed it or not. Manufacturers regularly do this. It was common back in the day for them to deliver antennas and other stuff in the trunk for the dealer to install. Would you consider an ACR with the splitter extension installed not factory correct? It was supplied in a bag in the car.

Would you consider a Yenko Chevy a poser because the dealer did the work? Get real, I'd love to have one of those posers.

The real question is did the factory authorize the car as special. With the ACR/TA they did. They had to allow 10 identical GTC cars to be built. Unlike the Gerry Wood cars where he simply painted different stripes on each of his Black Strip edition cars so he could get them under the GTC program. You've heard Bill say that the factory had to authorize the car and was actively involved. So you are either calling Bill P. a liar or the car is in fact special.

We shall see which car is worth more over time your Roanoke Special Edition or the ACR/TA. I'm betting on the later.

[FrankBarba]

I love to drive my FGT, i'd trade my 96 GTS for something newer, but you know me....
I just talk....

[Patentlaw]

I find it all hilarious....

We have people who complain bitterly about others causing low prices through negative comments.
Then the same people go out.....and make negative comments on the possessions of others.

You can't make this stuff up.

[Voice of Reason]

George there has never been any proof that the TA badge was delivered with the car, before today no one has ever even said that. Obviously it was delivered somehow from FCA, but that delivery was in the form of a parts order for 10 TA badges. FCA allowed 10 identical ACRs to be made so that Woodhouse could have their own special edition. Theyre awesome cars and Im glad theyre resealing so well. I even think the orange looks better on the ACR. But since you called it out yes I think Bill is lying by omission where the TA badge came from.

I think I will go with their approval and the Dodge build and let the money Collectors are willing to pay define things

is some pretty good politician bullshit if you ask me.

Ive posted for a long time if anyone has actual facts to the contrary Ill shut up and apologize. But those involved with the build wont refute it. Im a data guy and facts not political bs matter to me.

Edit - formatting sucks on Bills quote above because this damn forum doesnt handle quotes or apostrophes correctly on iPhones.

[AZTVR]

I find it all hilarious....

We have people who complain bitterly about others causing low prices through negative comments.
Then the same people go out.....and make negative comments on the possessions of others.

You can't make this stuff up.

Exactly my thoughts while reading the discussion of how other people's Vipers are not worthy, especially when the differentiators seem to be color combinations and the number of those combinations sold.

[Scott_in_fl]

ViperGeorge is correct that many special edition decals were provided in the trunk and not installed (think Corvette Pace Cars). But I also hear the point that others are making about the decal not coming "with the car" from the MFG. However, who cares? What if Woodhouse provided 10 other stickers with the car, that said "special edition" or "Woodhouse Special" or "Billy P Signature Series"??? The fact of the matter that it is a genuine ACR-E configured in a form that nobody else could configure. That enough is alone to make it official and collectible. Nobody else could configure 10 GTC cars exactly the same, and the color became locked out for them only -- one of the best colors available, btw and better than any LE color but for the snakeskin cars. Gerry Wood could not configure 10 identical cars. Nobody could.... But for the ACR/TA.

Call me crazy, but I do sincerely believe that this "story car" will end up being the most valuable series of them all (including all "official" LE cars).

[IHOP]

Exactly my thoughts while reading the discussion of how other people's Vipers are not worthy, especially when the differentiators seem to be color combinations and the number of those combinations sold.

I also agree! We need to be happy these cars are bringing good money no matter what year or model. It helps us all! On a side note some of the other saturday cars were horrible and I rally think if they would have run all the vipers on saturday the prices would have been even better!

[ViperNC]

Cant do that walk with you. The NFGT was very limited from the get go with more orders than production. This car will most likely never see a depreciation but hard to compare it to much else other than limited Italians.

The 2005-6 Ford GTs are now 10 +years old. In the first few years there was zero increase in value. As a mater of fact, many dealers had a problem getting them sold and many did cut the cost in order to do so.

So if we compare the Gen Vs to this, they are doing better. I am not talking about the entire production but the later years. Special editions, well put together 1 of 1s and powerful colors like the Strykers will be seeing an increase over time and in 10 plus years could very well be up there with the Ford GTs (as they are today) values.

Thats my take

Totally respect where you are coming from and I think you better illustrated my point even though you may not have realized it. You are correct the Ford GT is a very limited production run compared to the Viper and pretty much ALL of the available 2005-2006 cars available today have appreciated greatly in value. Even owners of higher mileage Ford GT's are making substantial money when they sell the car. Doesn't matter if it was a base model Ford GT, equipped with all four options, heritage GT, GTX1, etc: They all appreciated in value. You can't say that about the Viper as most have depreciated with a small percentage holding values/hopes of appreciating and a much smaller percentage have gone up in value. So looking at the total production run of each car and not just a few special cars, the Ford GT has a much higher yield percentage that can't be matched. That was my point.

I hope I'm wrong because I own a 1 of 1 car, but not thinking I'll ever make money on it. One can always hope though! And yes we're all very fortunate we don't own McLaren's!

[ViperJon]

and better than any LE color but for the snakeskin cars.

Wow I didn’t know that.