Do we know invoice & hold-back numbers yet?

[Dman]

Those numbers are right off a dealer invoice. It includes all options and fees in the msrp. Ep is employee price.

The reason I ask on these boards is because online systems are as good as .. whatever. When I deal on buying I ask the dealer to show me the invoice & the HB, since I know invoice is a bit of a joke. It's info like this from Ohiotj that is definitive, straight from the dealer paperwork is what I'm looking for and find so useful from folks here in the know. Otherwise using the online stuff is pretty iffy.

Some might put more weight on an Edmunds, I put more weight on guys that quote the paperwork they see. Not saying one is better or worse, just explaining why I'm asking actual people vs the online stuff, which I'm being asked in another post.

Thanks, Ohio, that's very valuable intel to have in the pocket for future reference.

[1Koolasp 16ACR]

I paid 115k for my wht T/A , so i feel like i got spanked, hearing all these numbers,you guy's will be paying ,or will be trying to pay , oh well, i gotta suck it up and move on. my butt is killing me now ,lol, will say this, the car is awesome !!!!!!!!

[Policy Limits]

What's invoice on GTS? If u think u got spanked at 115k which is 5k below MSRP then imagine paying 130's on a non numbered car; spank central.

[Shooter]

I paid 115k for my wht T/A , so i feel like i got spanked, hearing all these numbers,you guy's will be paying ,or will be trying to pay , oh well, i gotta suck it up and move on. my butt is killing me now ,lol, will say this, the car is awesome !!!!!!!!

You did ok imo. Heck, there are dealers out there asking 130K plus for the TA's. Thankfully none of the site sponsor's though.

[Policy Limits]

MSRP is a scam; even selling at invoice stealers make thousands; I paid a high price to be one if the first couple hundred people in the world to own one (8 months in the garage already) but that comes with juice.

How much is reasonable to make on a new Viper? I'd say 5 grand IMO. But based upon what's on here eskers selling at MSRP made a lot more than that.

[08viperviolet]

Guys I think that you are forgetting dealers are in the business to make money not sell cars at 0 profit. What ever you pay has to be reasonable to the person who paid it. Enjoy the cars you have.

[1Koolasp 16ACR]

Your right on that one 08viperviolet,we all have to eat and pay our bills, also traded the gen 2 in for 35k which i thought was fair money,with mods and 11k on the clock, so at the end all partys were happySee i'm smiling in my new T/A

[Policy Limits]

The issue is the reasonableness of the profit. To make 10-20k on a Viper is excessive IMO and my Maserati dealer didn't even make that much off the Maserati I pulled off the showroom floor. With dealer cash back, even selling at invoice gives a dealer thousands

[Shooter]

The issue is the reasonableness of the profit. To make 10-20k on a Viper is excessive IMO and my Maserati dealer didn't even make that much off the Maserati I pulled off the showroom floor. With dealer cash back, even selling at invoice gives a dealer thousands

Dealers are free to charge whatever they want. It's up to us (consumer)whether we want to pay it. It's a slippery slope. Next thing you know, people will be telling you how much is "reasonable" to be in a 401K.

[Policy Limits]

Obama is working on that

All I'm saying is the best thing a consumer can be, is informed. And yes that's his responsibility

[Bill Pemberton]

There is no Employee Pricing or Friends and Family on a Viper. Listing on an invoice has been there for years, but once into the system trying to select a control number the employee will get
an exclusion. No number , no pricing. Frankly some Dealers have accidentally taken the word of an employee, as it will even go through the incentives system, but once applied for a control number
the wall is up - if the Dealer took Employee's word and did not request said control number he is flat out. Already had two Chrysler Employees try to buy Vipers under the Plan and SRT actually sent one a note to verify ineligibility.

[Policy Limits]

Bill how much is dealer cash back? Does it vary dealer to dealer based on quantity of allocations or is it a flat rate across the board?

[Bill Pemberton]

Not exactly sure what you are asking , but regardless all Dealers are treated the same, allocation means nothing. I will leave with my learned fellow member Jon B's comment," Making nothing is a
formula to fail."

[Policy Limits]

As is a supply without a demand; a product's worst predicament

[Policy Limits]

**ps you should get into politics! Decades in the sales industry & claims not to know what dealer cash back from a manufacturer is! Classic dodge (pun intended). 8-p

[Shooter]

**ps you should get into politics! Decades in the sales industry & claims not to know what dealer cash back from a manufacturer is! Classic dodge (pun intended). 8-p

I laughed when I read that too.

[Ohiotj]

I can not verify if there is really an employee price on these cars or not. What I looked at to give the msrp, invoice, friends and family, hold back, and employee price is called a price Order confirmation or something to that affect. It may be true that no ep is available on these cars. All I did was a locate on dealerconnect and found a 2014 viper ta and listed what it said on the poc. That is always within a few dollars of true dealer cost. This is also what dealers work off of when doing dealer trades to locate a car for a customer.
I was just offering an answer to a question which I actually had a good answer to. I know chrysler offers employee price on vipers sometimes and then not other times. Usually not until after the market has slowed down.
Also to qualify my response I worked for two dealers over seven years and my father was a line worker at twinsburgh plant in ohio. I have bought off the ep plan for my whole life. There is also a 75 dollar doc fee when buying with an ep number.
I brought up the idea of selling vipers to the club at a transparent price and no members seemed interested. I spoke with my dealer principle and based off the clubs reaction we decided it wouldn't benefit either groups in the process.
If I can be of a reasonable assistance to anyone buying a viper I am happy to help. Of course it would be strictly on a friendly basis and I can not gain anything from the transaction. Let me know if there is anything I can clarify on this.

[Policy Limits]

The only person who scored with the Gen V was the guy who won the raffle. That way when your doors pop open on the highway, when your horn sounds in the middle of the night and when your check engine light comes on, you don't feel so bad. LOL

[Ohiotj]

To clarify of on dealers getting money back... There have been many different programs which chrysler has paid its dealer. From Daimler, cerubus, fiat, and the old Chrysler each program differed. Sometimes it was a step program and based off how many cars you sold each month. Other years they went away from that and gave you money on each car. It varied and the money for each cars usually wasn't in the thousands but usually a few hundred. Also I have been out of the business for 18 months now with my daughter so this info is outdated.

[Dman]

Just to clarify also, as there are a lot of great vendors I respect posting, I'm not looking for numbers so I can put a business out of business. I own a business and know how that all works, lol. I'm trying to calc a reasonable offer on a couple options as I figure whether I want to go for it while I wait for vert news, mitigating the loss if a vert comes and I need to flip early, etc. I'd assume no dealer would see at a number that will kill him, and I don't want to offer a ridiculous number to someone, it's just about being informed.

[Policy Limits]

The issue is the reasonableness of the profit. To make 10-20k on a Viper is excessive IMO and my Maserati dealer didn't even make that much off the Maserati I pulled off the showroom floor. With dealer cash back, even selling at invoice gives a dealer thousands

Just to clarify: I'm not saying the profit margin is 10k-20k at MSRP; Instead i was hypothesizing as a premise that if it were such then in my opinion that would be unreasonable as a profit. Also, I in no way want to discredit guys like Bill; most know I bought from him and I've publically stated several times that since he owns & races the product he sells he is the real deal & has lots of credibility in that regard. I in fact just recently referred someone in the market for an orange TA right to him. Another plus with a real dealer like Woodhouse: competent guys like Mark who do an inspection of the car and check steering and alignment among other things after shipment. You won't get that service just anywhere, trust me.

[Bill Pemberton]

Dealer Cash has been a term more recently tied to rebate programs, and many consumers call Holdback this, ( so just trying to be polite as was not really clear what was being asked ) when in reality it is extremely varied as Ohiotj listed above. It could be nothing, it could be a step program,
it usually over the years is on select vehicles only, and it has never been understandable and consistent. Vipers for the bulk of the time I have been selling did not count towards almost any of the programs for years. They simply existed
on their own, no sales professional programs, nothing. I can remember times when sales of Vipers would have put the Dealership over a quota that might have been in place that month , but they did not count.The most common program was a sales quota, but many Dealers never made that figure , so any extra funds were never acquired. Hence this is not a given figure, not consistent with all Franchises, and impossible to quantify when so changeable. Vipers are definitely not on any EP Plan at present, were primarily only on during the Bankruptcy years, and supposedly have no intention to go back to said program
per SRT.

[Policy Limits]

Also my bad in utilizing the terms dealer cash back & hold back interchangeably.

I hate it when my clients want everything for free; it's an awful American attitude. On the other hand I do respect someone who comes to my office who compares and researches and is an educated consumer. Buying a car is no different is all

[Ohiotj]

Bill, do you remember when chrysler gave the dealer an ungodly amount of money to take prebuilt vipers. I want to say it was around 09 or 10. If my memory serves me we got 25k on each viper we took. Both were red, one conv and the other coupe and both were equipped the same. That was during the bankruptcy time.
Also Bill is correct About the time when I saw ep on the vipers. It was during their bankruptcy.
As a side note when the challenger was still very hot they were not offering ep to even a Chrysler Employee. However they slipped up for a two week period and while they only meant to offer ep on the rt and sxt to the general public they opened up the srt too. We had a customer offer us a number and we told him that we had to sell it for about 2k less then his offer. He got a deal.

[Policy Limits]

At 7% sales tax I bet the State of RI made out better on my car than my dealer did lol