Anyone Have Input on Plug Wires

[Jack B]

After Alex posted about his problems with the oem plug wires I did a little research.

1. The actual oem wire assembly is a total of 11".

2. The coil side is a 135 degree boot and the plug side is a straight boot.

3. The actual wire is approximately 9".

4. I do not know whether a resistor is placed in the plug boot or whether they use a resistor wire. The total resistance of the wire assembly in 2,300 ohms. I did a google to see if that was the norm, it seems too high for those manufacturers that actually use a resistor approach to limiting the RF coupling issue.

5. The high end wires like the Moroso Ultra 40 Race product do not totally use the resistor approach, their wire is 40 ohms/ft, they use a canceling/shielding approach to control the RF interference.

6. Moroso part #75535 is an eight piece set and it looks like it would work, I have to get a clarification on the exact measurement. The other problem, we would have to buy two sets for our cars and they are $115/set.

7. I tried the AB Quality Wire route, but, no response on my order after three weeks. The other problem is, there is no description or spec on the web site.

Does anyone have any additional input on another source or something that is unique to the oem wires?? Lastly, has anyone else had a wire issue similar to Alex's misfire problem.

[1of1TA1.0]

subscribed, thanks for the tech data you provided as well Jack

[kriskyk]

Very interested as well

[Scot@Prefix]

Check out Magnacore, very good wires but pricey.
We carry their full line, but they are available direct or from several sources
https://www.magnecor.com/magnecor1/main.htm

[A2008]

Jack: Try Jon B on the AB Quality wires. Like you, I recently tried to purchase a set straight from Adam but got no response as well. I then found that Jon B stocked these wires. I called him and he shipped them right out to me.

[Jack B]

Jack: Try Jon B on the AB Quality wires. Like you, I recently tried to purchase a set straight from Adam but got no response as well. I then found that Jon B stocked these wires. I called him and he shipped them right out to me.

thanks, did you see a spec for the wires

[Jack B]

I just talked with Moroso; they actually have a G5 race set. The part # is 73512.

[J TNT]

I have talked to 2 members in Ontario were there ab wires had issues, creating miss fire .
I've had good luck with moroso , just not sure about noise suppression on modern car radio's ?

[Bryan Savage]

I just got a set of AC Delco wires from Amazon for $26.67. The look identical to OE wires and snapped right on. Car fired up fine but I've not driven it, as I'm getting over a fever.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Also picked up ten Champion RE10PMC5s at $3.02 each.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

37,500 miles on the original plugs and wires. Lou Belanger reminded me it was about time.

2018-04-21 10.55.55.jpg

[Jack B]

I have talked to 2 members in Ontario were there ab wires had issues, creating miss fire .
I've had good luck with moroso , just not sure about noise suppression on modern car radio's ?

The 40 race series has excellent noise suppression spec's. I think Doug Shelby is either stocking them or is going to stock them. Moroso does not sell direct.

[Jack B]

I just got a set of AC Delco wires from Amazon for $26.67. The look identical to OE wires and snapped right on. Car fired up fine but I've not driven it, as I'm getting over a fever.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Also picked up ten Champion RE10PMC5s at $3.02 each.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

37,500 miles on the original plugs and wires. Lou Belanger reminded me it was about time.

2018-04-21 10.55.55.jpg

You have to be careful, the firing of a plug creates a radiated rf transmission, this can cause an upset of of the car's on board systems. At that price they are probably a resistor wire type. Check the ohmic value, you will want it close to 2300 ohms. If the value is much higher or lower you could have issues

[Arizona Vipers]

The 40 race series has excellent noise suppression spec's. I think Doug Shelby is either stocking them or is going to stock them. Moroso does not sell direct.

Yeah Shelby sells them- http://www.dougshelbyengineering.com/viper.html

[J TNT]

Good info , thanks Jack !

The 40 race series has excellent noise suppression spec's. I think Doug Shelby is either stocking them or is going to stock them. Moroso does not sell direct.

[Jack B]

I installed the Moroso wires last night. I had noticed near the end of last year the engine had picked up an irregular idle, it was hardly noticeable and did not seem to affect anything else. The PCM still maintained the idle, but, you could tell it was working harder to keep the programmed rpm. Again, unless you had the hood open (watching the engine movement) and paid close attention, the anomaly is easy to miss.

After installing the Moroso wires, the idle instability stopped. At this point I do not know much more about the new wires.except the issue is solved. The marketing brochures are kind of evasive (the same for Magnecore). They like to talk about the low resistance, but, that is not the whole story, with a fast rising waveform (like the spark initiation) it is not all about wire resistance, you also have to consider inductance. To measure that you would need an oscilloscope attached to the plug wire during the spark event.

To make a long story short, it appears the high end plug wires do not use the resistor wire approach, they use a combination of inductance and RFI/EMI cancelling techniques to protect the car's electronic communications pathways. The shielding/cancelling of RFI/EMI is probably the most important function of a plug wire in today's cars, the second function being a reliable spark path. The oem plug wires are the resistor approach, that method has always been prone to longevity issues especially with high heat.

This thread started when I saw Alex's post about his issues with his plug wires. The next question is, how many more cars (right now two) have these almost undetectable, but, critical issues. The signs (in my case) come at the low end, however, what is happening to power at WOT. In my case, the Arrow Stage II reflash turns off misfire detection, therefore, the issue becomes virtually undetectable.

[ViperGeorge]

I installed the Moroso wires last night. I had noticed near the end of last year the engine had picked up an irregular idle, it was hardly noticeable and did not seem to affect anything else. The PCM still maintained the idle, but, you could tell it was working harder to keep the programmed rpm. Again, unless you had the hood open (watching the engine movement) and paid close attention, the anomaly is easy to miss.

After installing the Moroso wires, the idle instability stopped. At this point I do not know much more about the new wires.except the issue is solved. The marketing brochures are kind of evasive (the same for Magnecore). They like to talk about the low resistance, but, that is not the whole story, with a fast rising waveform (like the spark initiation) it is not all about wire resistance, you also have to consider inductance. To measure that you would need an oscilloscope attached to the plug wire during the spark event.

To make a long story short, it appears the high end plug wires do not use the resistor wire approach, they use a combination of inductance and RFI/EMI cancelling techniques to protect the car's electronic communications pathways. The shielding/cancelling of RFI/EMI is probably the most important function of a plug wire in today's cars, the second function being a reliable spark path. The oem plug wires are the resistor approach, that method has always been prone to longevity issues especially with high heat.

This thread started when I saw Alex's post about his issues with his plug wires. The next question is, how many more cars (right now two) have these almost undetectable, but, critical issues. The signs (in my case) come at the low end, however, what is happening to power at WOT. In my case, the Arrow Stage II reflash turns off misfire detection, therefore, the issue becomes virtually undetectable.

Jack, as usual a great analysis. I am truly jealous of your knowledge of all these things and wish I could do a Vulcan mind meld to pick up 1/10 of what you know.

How hard is the wire install? I haven't looked, I know on the Gen 4 it was a pain as the coil packs were under the intake if memory serves.

[slowhatch]

I told you Jack!

Night/day difference for me when I swapped mine. Car revs smoother, pulls harder, and no more intermittent hesitation up top, etc.

[serpent]

Okay, now I want to get these wires too, but question is, what plugs do I match them with for my setup (stock motor)?

Wires: https://www.jegs.com/i/Moroso/710/73512/10002/-1

[SSGNRDZ_28]

I can’t advertise a lower price but will refund $10 if ordered through me. Have several sets on the way and will keep them in stock for quicker shipment.

Doug

[J TNT]

I can’t advertise a lower price but will refund $10 if ordered through me. Have several sets on the way and will keep them in stock for quicker shipment.

Doug

Doug do you sell them for Gen 3 as well ?

[Jack B]

I told you Jack!

Night/day difference for me when I swapped mine. Car revs smoother, pulls harder, and no more intermittent hesitation up top, etc.

I have not been able to go wot yet, it is still winter in NE Ohio. We are getting snow tomorrow

[Jack B]

Jack, as usual a great analysis. I am truly jealous of your knowledge of all these things and wish I could do a Vulcan mind meld to pick up 1/10 of what you know.

How hard is the wire install? I haven't looked, I know on the Gen 4 it was a pain as the coil packs were under the intake if memory serves.

Simple to install, the only trick is getting the old wires off the coil packs. Use a door panel removal tool for that part, merely push the top of the boot down.

The two upper engine covers must come off. You can slide those off, I put masking tape on them so they do not get scratched. It really is easier to loosen one side of the xbrace at a time for the cover removal.

[Steve M]

Jack, as usual a great analysis. I am truly jealous of your knowledge of all these things and wish I could do a Vulcan mind meld to pick up 1/10 of what you know.

How hard is the wire install? I haven't looked, I know on the Gen 4 it was a pain as the coil packs were under the intake if memory serves.

You must be thinking of a Gen 3 - the Gen 4 is a similar layout to the Gen 5.

I can’t advertise a lower price but will refund $10 if ordered through me. Have several sets on the way and will keep them in stock for quicker shipment.

Doug

Doug,

Do they come with heat shielding on the spark plug end? Also, what color? Hoping for the Henry Ford answer here...

[Jack B]

You must be thinking of a Gen 3 - the Gen 4 is a similar layout to the Gen 5.



Doug,

Do they come with heat shielding on the spark plug end? Also, what color? Hoping for the Henry Ford answer here...

Steve:
They have the same protective metal cylinder that the oem wires have. I am fairly sure that is more than a heat shield, I believe that is part of the RFI shielding, there is no other reason to have the the spring contact on the plug end.

[ViperGeorge]

You must be thinking of a Gen 3 - the Gen 4 is a similar layout to the Gen 5.

You are correct. I meant the Gen 3.

[Jack B]

Steve

is the coil pack location the same on the G4.