How to lose weight quickly

[Blue96GTS]

New diet plan for you and your car:

Looks like these new MCS beauties will chop some fat from Violet (cars name).

Buying these new beauties chopped some fat from my wallet....

Since my wallet is skinny, looks like I'll be on a diet also.

See how buying new shocks is good for your health??

Anyway, when the new shocks arrived, I thought I'd been duped! No stinkin' way that this box was heavy enough to hold 4 shocks. As it turned out, I was wrong. Check out the weight savings over the original units. The difference is, well, shocking! Way to go technology!


Original Rear Shock, weighing in at > 15 lbs. That's about 1 stone if you're across the pond...
1 old rear weight.jpg


2 New rear shocks, totaling < 15 lbs!
2 new rear weight.jpg

Original front shock - almost 12 lbs on it's own.
1 old front weight.jpg

2 new front shocks - less than 1 original shock.
2 new front weight.jpg

[GTSilver]

I just installed MCS on my TA as well and the weight savings is significant but what was outstanding is the performance on track and how the car's handling has been transformed.

[AZTVR]

I just installed MCS on my TA as well and the weight savings is significant but what was outstanding is the performance on track and how the car's handling has been transformed.

Which type? Stage 1, single adjustable, like above, or stage 2 or 3?

[GTSilver]

Which type? Stage 1, single adjustable, like above, or stage 2 or 3?

2 way adjustable.

[BrianACR]

Wow that's a huge difference!

[LifeIsGood]

Damn, those are pretty. My birthday was yesterday...anybody want to send me a set.

[Fatboy 18]

Damn, those are pretty. My birthday was yesterday...anybody want to send me a set.

Happy Birthday Ken, I would have thought you would be more a KW fan seeing as their coils are normally Yellow

[Fatboy 18]

Those Shocks and Springs may be light but I bet they were heavy on the wallet!

[Viper98]

https://motioncontrolsuspension.com/pricing/

[Fatboy 18]

Out of my budget

[daveg]

Out of my budget

Cheaper to go on a diet!

[slitherv10]

Question is....where did the weight savings come from?

Question/Answer 2...so its a total of around 20 pounds savings (give or take). Depending on whose driving the car and their weight over yours, it may not be such a saving to be honest.

Answer 3....They are nice though. And if they were do to be changed, then delete above.

Answer 4...It may have been cheaper to lose weight then buys these. Healthier on your pocket and yourself

[Blue96GTS]

Hopefully the price-per-pound will work out with the weight savings and smiles-per-gallon when it's done.

These buggers are not cheap. MCS stage 1, single adjustable, single reservoir. I thought long and hard comparing these to the BG setup, which is a lot cheaper. I did not much consider purchasing original replacements, due to the lack of easy adjustability. Many searches and consumed posts later, with a bunch of questions/answers sent to Mark, I went this route. I had planned on this upgrade this year, after having done brakes/bushings 2 years ago, so although it was a "Shock" to the wallet, I know I won't regret my decision. My old shocks were apparently quite worn out, as best described by the sounds and performance the car displayed when going over bumps in the road. By comparison, the performance of the Viper was a huge upgrade to my 70's muscle car (duh), but is (hopefully was) a bit underwhelming when compared to newer stuff with good suspension. SO... I'll consider it an investment in the performance of a performance machine, and I'll definitely let you know the outcome. Shocks are in the car, but now have to go thru the adjustments before she can hit the road. Some snow needs to melt as well.

We just all need to agree that these shocks were my only option if my wife brings up the subject at NVE3, OK???????

[Dan Cragin]

For anyone with questions about MCS systems, I am happy to help. 310-597-6295

Systems are available for Gen 2-5 in single, double and triple adjustable systems. I have spring rates compatible for all applications.

Coming from the Penske product, I am super impressed with the MCS systems and support. What makes these suspensions so nice is that the valving has a wide adjustment range which will work with a large combination of spring rates, so most applications do not need custom valving. The result is a system that does not need to be custom built and is readily available.

The MCS crew is there for product support, if you do have an issue, it's taken care of right away.

All the parts are made either in the US or Europe and everything is assembled and tested in the MCS Georgia Plant before shipping.

Having taken over for Mark Jorgensen, I have some big shoes to fill. I have been in involved in all aspects of Viper racing and chassis setup since the beginning, so I have a good idea of what works and what does not. I always make myself available and am there after the sale. I also offer below retail pricing on all MCS systems.

[Blue96GTS]

Thanks Dan!

Mark Jorgensen was/is a great guy to work with. For those of you who didn't see Mark's farewell post, he's only leaving us for greener car pastures, he's still on this earth. Of course, he let me know that you were taking over his MCS duties and that we could count on you to help with purchases as well as technical support as you likely would anyway. We appreciate your time and experience, Dan.

While we're on this shocking subject, I'll assume these things won't work very well unless properly installed..... I found a snippet from an Alley post that Mark had responded to regarding the installation and adjustment of these units. I ran this snippet by Mark last week to see if he was still OK with his advice, and to see if he had anything to add. He only reiterated that the rear settings will likely need to be a bit firmer than the front. I'm copying his reply to the post here for future reference, and to see if you (or anyone else) might have any additional useful advice:

Whatever height you set it at you need to measure from the frame rails to the ground between the front tires and then at the rear tires. You should keep at least 3/4" higher in the rear. Shock settings should start at 7-8 clicks from full soft in the front and 9-11 in the rear. Works best if there are at least 2 clicks higher in the rear since there is more spring to manage back there.

Ride height, I would not set the front frame measurement lower then 4" on the street if it was me.

Initial setup, flat ring first with shoulder up, then the spring seat ring; leave about 1.5" of threads below to get started. Next is the helper spring then the small flat spacer. The next thing is to install the plastic cylinder to protect the top of the threads on the shock. After that the main spring, 500# front and 800# rear. Compress this all down with your hand and then install the top spring seat (has the slot cut in it to go around the shaft.

Remove and install the same as the stock stuff, you can tighten all bolts now except the "fork" bolt (it has to be set on the ground and rolled back and forth before this can be tightened.

Set your ride heights using the frame to ground at the center of the contact patches across the front and then across the rears. It is advisable to not go lower then 4" for the front measurement to protect the frame and Pan. The rear should be at least 3/4" higher then the front to keep handling progressive, the lower you go the more it seems to want to over steer on throttle. Corner weighting will help handling, but for the street is not really needed.

Set alignment

You can start with front shocks at 8 from full soft and the rears at 10-11. Try and keep the rears 2-3 clicks stiffer because they have more spring to control.

[Blue96GTS]

Anyone with experience on approximate start point for ride height adjustment?? I currently have the helper springs collapsed at full suspension droop. Although I'd like to nicely tuck the wheels, the practicality of the local roads dictates it probably shouldn't be much lower than stock. Hoping to at least get close-r to the approximate ride height before the wheels go on and I'm adjusting shocks under the car.

Front Installed 2.jpg

Rear Installed 2.jpg

[GTS Dean]

You are going to have to get tires on it and put it on the ground. Start with your bump and rebound at zero. Makes it easier to jounce and settle the car for accurate frame-ground readings.

[Blue96GTS]

Lesson for today is on "helper springs". Apparently installed in this position, they're called "teenager springs", as they mostly are sitting around doing nothing to actually help out. I suppose I could have had this epiphany before I put the car on the ground and determined the ride height would be perfect if I were going off-roading...

Measurement from the bottom of the shock threads to the bottom of the retainer ring is 2.5 inches in this picture for reference.

No Helper Spring.jpg

Front wheels with this setting - too much gap.
Front Too Tall.jpg

Rear wheels with this setting - too much gap.
Rear Too Tall.jpg



So, lowered all shocks by 1". Teenager springs have been kicked out, and some actual help by these springs is being provided. Found adjustment on the fronts pretty easy access if I raised the car a bit. Found it just as easy to remove the rear wheels to adjust the rear shocks, but I'm working without a lift.

Shocks measured at 1.5" from bottom of threads to bottom of retainer ring. Getting closer to a good stance.

1.5 inches front shock - a bit too tall still.jpg


Front wheel @ 1.5" of shock - dropped the wheel gap same amount
Front at 1.5.jpg

[Blue96GTS]

Continued...

Here's a pic of the rear gap at 1.5" of shock:

Rear at 1.5.jpg


Here's the overall car at 1.5" of shock. Stance is getting better, still too much overall gap. Going back out to make some more adjustments, probably down to 1" and see what it looks like. Attempting to get the stance close before I actually put it on something level and start taking measurements.

Car at 1.5.jpg

[Blue96GTS]

Thought I might as well slam the thing just to see what it looks like. I don't recommend this, as Mark said you'd need a longer main spring. Makes sense, as fully slammed, not even the helper springs are loaded on the front shocks. If Bo or Luke Duke were driving your car, the top spring keeper could bail out on you as you were airborne.

Personally I think it looks cool, but measured I'd have < 2" of front ground clearance, not to mention some rubbing issues.

Slammed 3.jpg


Slammed 2.jpg


Only 1" of front wheel gap fully slammed:

Slammed Front.jpg


1.5" of rear wheel gap slammed:

Slammed Rear.jpg

[Blue96GTS]

Final adjustment, for now at least.


22 full turns from bottom on the front springs gave 1.25" raise of shock tube, and produced 2.5" of front wheel gap. Estimated 4.5" of front frame/ground clearance.

18 full turns from bottom on the rear springs gave 1" raise of shock tube, and produced 2.75" of rear wheel gap. Estimated 5.25" rear frame/ground clearance.


22Front x 18Rear - 1.25 x 1 from front.jpg


22Front x 18Rear - 1.25 x 1 from back.jpg


2.5" front wheel gap:

Front at 1.25 x 22 turns.jpg

[Blue96GTS]

Before I went too crazy randomly picking an approximated length of adjustment, I did a bit of testing to produce results a bit more suitable for the field in absence of a measuring stick.

There are 8 holes in each adjuster ring. By my calculations, it takes 18 full turns of the adjuster ring to equal 1 inch of adjustment on the shock tube, thereabouts. Could be a RCH less, but let's go with 18 turns. The shock came with 2 spanner tools that work well to help with adjustment.

The 7" springs that were included are accompanied by the helper springs which are easily compressible. If you adjust the height of the shock while compressing the helper spring only, the accompanying height adjustment is linear to the length of adjustment. Once the helper springs are compressed, the length of adjustment is more exponential in nature as the larger spring is being compressed. The point here is that the rear spring setup ended up with the helper spring fully compressed, while the front spring setup ended up with some spring left in the helper spring (all at droop). This should mean that if adjustments are made to the rear currently, it would have a greater impact than the front.

I ended up with a calculated number of adjuster ring turns (from bottom) per shock to set my desired ride height. I also was hoping to also take into account Marks recommendations of no less than 4.5" clearance for the street, and 3/4" rake to the car. Although I'm not working on a perfectly flat surface, I did rig a GEGW jig in hopes of measuring frame to ground clearance. A bit redneck, but it should get me close and goes well with my "4 post lift".

Final adjustment was set at 22 full turns from bottom for the front shocks, which gave me 1.25" between bottom of shock threads, and bottom of lower adjuster ring. The rear shocks were adjusted at 18 full turns from bottom, which gave me 1" between bottom of threads and bottom of lower adjuster ring. As it sits currently, this is giving me 2.5" of front tire gap, and 2.75" of rear tire gap (accompanying reference pic). According to my kite string calculator, this gave me 4.5" of clearance between the frame and the ground as measured behind the front wheel, and 5.25" of clearance between the frame and ground as measured in front of the rear wheel.

Seems a start anyway. Accompanying pics:


Measuring jig with 4 post lift:

Measuring setup.jpg


8 holes per adjuster ring with accompanying spanner tool:

8 holes per full turn with spanner tool.jpg


18 complete turns of the ring equals 1" of tube height:

18 turns is 1 inch of tube.jpg


Wheel gap reference. Wheel gap was measured top of the center of the wheel, between the bottom of the fender, and the dark line of rubber that stands out around the tire:

4 inch front.jpg