The VIPER TAX

[ViperRyan]

Well this thread went awry rather quickly, which was expected. I've been a Viper owner since last August, but an enthusiasts since I was a kid. As I’ve stated in other threads, if you come into the Viper expecting this completely refined, highly engineered, subtle car, you're going to be disappointed(earlier Gen's especially). Prior to buying mine, I had driven a 96 RT/10, I had an idea of what I was getting myself into, right before my Viper I had a Cobra replica, which was about as bare and hardcore as you can get. I've always had a love with Vipers, I love mine, even it's faults. It's always hot, rides rough, it's loud and obnoxious(not a negative), it's not cheap to work on or fix if something breaks, but that's what it is. Owning these cars, is not just owning a car, it's a love you have for the car and all they represent. Out of all the car communities I've been around, this is by far the best. There aren't too many places where you can tie together people from all over the world who own the same car, that highly range in value, but yet all maintain a reasonable amount of respect for one another.

I see where you're coming from, about trying to save money when buying parts, everyone likes to save money. I think you came on this thread and completely started it off with the wrong tone, just sharing the knowledge of the savings found is all that was needed, not necessarily bashing a supplier which was been good to the Viper community, and then continue to bash the car, the history, the design of which is the reason we are all here.

If you come into owning a Viper and expect the cost/parts/labor etc. to be just like owning a Hyundai or a the like, then this isn't the car for you. Someone who truly loves and respects these cars, just doesn't behave the way you have, so hence all the negative feedback.

[ViperRT98]

There's absolutely zero benefits for anyone joining VOA and VCA... When we were able to get the tire discount that was a benefit... however there is absolutely nothing else that we really get and most of the events are planned by non-paying members... so if you want to add me and that makes go right ahead... I'm not paying for a membership because I own a particular car .... this isn't the NRA...

[City]

Amazing how participants here seem to take so many opposing opinions to heart and then go off on absurd assumptions, i.e., if you've recently bought a GEN V then you "have little respect for a hard earned dollar" or at least less respect than owners of earlier less expensive Gen's. What's with some of you folks???!!!

This thread SHOULD be an informative discussion about all aspects of finding and obtaining alternative, less expensive "like or identical" Viper parts for your car. It should NOT be about the denigrating of participants who may have no issue with paying a "Viper tax" and those that make every effort to avoid paying said tax.

Anyway, several folks here need to take a breath and reread their posts BEFORE posting. Any further lack if reasonable civility is going to cause us to edit posts and consider suspension(s). PLEASE don't force our hand here. We are at our best when we do nothing other than cashing our moderator checks.

[daveg]

There's absolutely zero benefits for anyone joining VOA and VCA...

I have to say I disagree. For years the Corvette club wanted me to join and I refused. When I purchased the Viper, I felt the same way you do.. But when I met the folks in the New England region, I decided to join and I am glad I did.. Met some Awesome people and I am proud to say they are now my friends! The New England chapter has events almost every weekend and they are a great time!!!
May I suggest that you try it (like me) and if you decide its not for you, simply don't renew next year..
That's just my 2 pennies..
Good luck with your Car!

[Bill Pemberton]

Well , pretty impossible to say you have zero benefits , because if it wasn't for those members who pay and join you wouldn't have this website, which allows you to find out things about your car and even express your views.

[bluesrt]

I don't evan get the guest free deal, should be a 15 day free guest,then pay to be on this forum if you want to have the perks of valuable info,outbursts of foul idiots ect..

[ViperRT98]

What pays for this is the sponsors like your self that advertise their business... Most of us use Facebook to get help when needed... I'm sure some of the membership fees may go towards the maintenance of this website... however in the region we are in there's not many activities, unless we non-members set up local meets... what is funny is we actually get contacted by VCA to attend their functions even though we are not a member... To me that's what's important it's not about VCA or VOA... It is about getting Viper owners together to enjoy their vehicles... and when I have purchased my vehicle two years ago I had seriously thought about joining VOA... but there's no benefits to paying a membership.... Sorry it is the truth...

[Bill Pemberton]

Sorry , been a member since inception and sponsorship will not remotely pay the bills, and frankly if you see no value , why are you even on the Forum then? Simple question , but makes no sense to me why folks who think there is no value even come here?

[ZZ SRT]

I'm not a member because I was member of the VCA, and we all know how that worked out.

I don't need a club specific to my vehicle. I'll leave that to the Corvette dweebs. I actually prefer some variety when cruising with fellow enthusiasts anyway. I mean isn't that why a lot of us drive a viper anyway? To be different?

[COI]

This thread SHOULD be an informative discussion about all aspects of finding and obtaining alternative, less expensive "like or identical" Viper parts for your car. It should NOT be about the denigrating of participants who may have no issue with paying a "Viper tax" and those that make every effort to avoid paying said tax.

I agree - and there isn't a "Viper tax" per se. I'd call it more a "rare car" tax. Like many others on this forum I have a number of other special interest cars and in every case there is some form of unreasonable mark-up on what ends up being somewhat generic parts. As many have noted this is a lot more common with the higher volume automobile manufacturers as they definitely reuse parts across their line. It would be great to know that fellow Viper owners would share this knowledge constructively - but unfortunately, that doesn't seem to be in our DNA judging from how Viper owners treat each other on the three primary Viper forums. I also appreciate that parts dealers need to make money to stay in business and to the extent paying a few extra $'s enables them to be there tomorrow - I'm happy to do it.

I think the Viper is one of the most enjoyable cars out there but I tend to keep my Viper ownership quiet as Viper owners definitely have a bad rap. With that said, I do pay my dues to ensure sites like this continue and to support the local club.

[ViperRT98]

Sorry , been a member since inception and sponsorship will not remotely pay the bills, and frankly if you see no value , why are you even on the Forum then? Simple question , but makes no sense to me why folks who think there is no value even come here?

As you can see how inactive I am on this website I don't come here very often.... However if you feel non members are receiving benefits for having access to VOA should be limited sounds like VOA needs to limit all sections to paying members and also limit how often someone can post... Then that problem will be solved...

However I'm still in the same set of mind that just because we on a particular car doesn't mean we need to join a particular Club... Certain areas the VOA is very active and pay the membership fee would make probably good sense... our location it does not at least not to me not when we're the ones trying to set up functions and gatherings... then have individuals trying to act like they're better because they are members and telling individuals that are not members that they're cheap not you others have...

That will put a sour taste a lot of our mouth... And if we were looking to buy a new Viper personally I probably would now avoid your dealership... good thing that's not the case...

[Rich Detert]

one would think if you ran a part number off a bearing of the same brand, how many different ones could there be? different ones mean different part number, 1234- for 03 viper, 1234ab 03 super fast option -lol 1234ab-tt super fast racer

Anytime Chrysler superseded to a newer part number on the assembly line such as 1234AA to 1234AB it was because there was some type of change, even if it was just a vendor change.
It was a way to keep track of each generation of a specific part used in the assembly plant.
Sometimes the number change was just because it was a new model year.

[Bill Pemberton]

The Viper is done , and I want to see this Forum and the Club continue. So many will have to pay to keep it alive, so the simple question I asked was if you see no value, why do you come here? The value in joining is to make sure , as COI mentioned , that sites like this continue, as you also apparently do find it beneficial at times . No need to argue, I asked a simple question as I don't understand why folks do anything in life if they don't appreciate it or see the purpose of it's existence. If membership only supports this Forum , I am in still as it will be a resource for Viper owners for years to come, and it will be more valuable for members to contribute and help others than even now.

[Viper98]

Hi follow Viper owners,
To start, this reply is entirely friendly and on neutral ground.

I agree with both sides of the Viper tax. Some things are understandably priced, and some overly priced. This is where some type of "library" or whatever name it is given, could/would be very helpful. As many know there was a thread started recently, and most likely there was another in the past, that suggested a "spread sheet" to help with part interchange. Some items, like the oil filter should not be compromised on, while others: grommets, interior door handle bezel, power window clips, and many other parts that are not Viper specific can be used with no worries. A useful "spreadsheet" or "library" or even just a simple sticky could solve the "Viper tax" threads and not lead to the bashing OR cause the moderators to step in.
I agree that it would have been a better start to the thread as suggested above, but Jersey guy was understandably upset at the extra $ tagged on to the grommet. A day or two to calm down always helps me see better and not be so perturbed before I speak(text, mail, etc)
I believe we got a little off target on this thread when the bashing started. Everyone, Viper owner or otherwise, has an opinion and opinions can not be wrong. Maybe not agreed with, but not wrong. They are just the way someone sees things. I love my Gen ll and don't get upset when anyone says anything "non-positive" about it, it's their opinion and not an attack on me. Jerseyman has a Viper and he has opinions. Certainly nothing wrong with either of those. Sometimes people just need to vent.
I would like to believe that we Viper owners, members or not, can rise above banging on anyone or any sponsor.
I am a Mamba member and very happy to be a part of the VOA. Having so many Viper bros(and Sistahs), especially, with such a "rare", gorgeous and sometimes PITA car is a beautiful thing. If someone doesn't want to be a member that is their prerogative. We can't do anything about it, anyway, and I would like to believe that even non-members contribute here. Likewise of the reverse; many members don't contribute, yet, are still welcomed.

If this thread continues can we, plz, make it civil and help one another. The banging and bashing does NO ONE any good.

If a bunch of "back-in-the-day" hotrodders go on a cruise and one car breaks down, the fellow rodders HELP the guy/gal get back on track. Sounds pretty cool to me.

I suspect many will not agree with me on this and that's fine, that is your opinion.

In the wise words of Rodney King, "can't we all just get along?"

Luv and peace, my fellow Viper owners.

VIPERS RULE!!!

Jer

[Bill Pemberton]

Well said Jer, time to get back to the main question ...............

If anyone ever finds a cross reference for the fuel pump relay on the Gen 1s that would be worth it's weight in gold , as that is an item that is becoming quite problematic.

[Patentlaw]

Amazing how participants here seem to take so many opposing opinions to heart and then go off on absurd assumptions, i.e., if you've recently bought a GEN V then you "have little respect for a hard earned dollar" or at least less respect than owners of earlier less expensive Gen's. What's with some of you folks???!!!

This thread SHOULD be an informative discussion about all aspects of finding and obtaining alternative, less expensive "like or identical" Viper parts for your car. It should NOT be about the denigrating of participants who may have no issue with paying a "Viper tax" and those that make every effort to avoid paying said tax.

Anyway, several folks here need to take a breath and reread their posts BEFORE posting. Any further lack if reasonable civility is going to cause us to edit posts and consider suspension(s). PLEASE don't force our hand here. We are at our best when we do nothing other than cashing our moderator checks.

City,

I understand your post above, however, I would like to make a clarification. The original poster complained about Viper Specialty shops for not giving him the best price. Some, including me, stated that there was value in these vendors and there was convenience in their services. The original poster then went out to clarify where he got the parts and while the place may be have been "local" (New Brunswick) and that the service was actually "on-line". While the original post was clearly negative (out of frustration), his later defense actually provided some benefit to the community and changed the thread somewhat. I agree with you that people need to take a breath and read before they put down information. It is understandable, however, that people will get defensive about their posts and point out the negativity. Anyway.....thanks for letting the discussion progress, even though it has gotten wildly off track.

Lastly, to me, Viper Tax is completely different. You can't have a "Viper Tax" on a part from a specialty vendor. A part is a part for them. To me, a "Viper Tax" is an upcharge that comes from Dodge and they charge values for that part (which is identical to other vehicles) at wildly inflated prices. $300 vs. 15. If a specific vendor is a "specialty shop" and that means that they do not deal with any other parts other than Viper so they are not charging two prices for the same component.

Plaw

[ACR_VP]

Well said Jer, time to get back to the main question ...............

If anyone ever finds a cross reference for the fuel pump on the Gen 1s that would be worth it's weight in gold , as that is an item that is becoming quite problematic.

Arrow just sent me a drop in replacement for my gen2 that was very recently developed (like my car may has one of the first couple) and flows way way more fuel, and they MIGHT have one for the gen 1, doesn't hurt to ask.

[Bill Pemberton]

Sorry , typing too fast did not get in that extra word , relay, so my note was misconstrued - but corrected. Thanks for the note, as we all love Arrow and all they do for our beasts.

[Sybil TF]

Sorry , been a member since inception and sponsorship will not remotely pay the bills, and frankly if you see no value , why are you even on the Forum then?

Ugh, free information?

[plumcrazy]

<<---waiting on moderator checks

[06SRTCoupe]

Some of these people need the good old Viper Alley treatment. Come on Plum, can we? Can we can we? Plllllleeeeeaaaaassssseeeee?????

[Sybil TF]

Some of these people need the good old Viper Alley treatment. Come on Plum, can we? Can we can we? Plllllleeeeeaaaaassssseeeee?????

How about we start with you first then? But no we don't.

[06SRTCoupe]

How about we start with you first then? But no we don't.

The funny thing about your comment is...I never even thought of you when I made it. Your paranoia is entertaining though...I got a good laugh out of it. Maybe you need a safe space?

[AZTVR]

The funny thing about your comment is...I never even thought of you when I made it. Your paranoia is entertaining though...I got a good laugh out of it. Maybe you need a safe space?

Who really wants the teenager patter from the Alley over here? Plenty opportunity there and on the Civic forums.

[Sybil TF]

The funny thing about your comment is...I never even thought of you when I made it. . Maybe you need a safe space?

Why would you? I'm haven't been on there for years I have a safe space of about 10 feet in diameter around. I'm good.