Gen 4 plus Arrow Race Controller ARH Headers and Woodhouse Mounts

[parabs]

I have read the Woodhouse mounts are stiff enough they can trigger the knock sensor into a CEL/limp on the factory computer. What about the Arrow PCM?

Also, I'm planning the gen 5 intake and a DSE heat shield, Ipsco underdrive pulley..any other suggestions for quick and easy mods?

[Garron]

I have read the Woodhouse mounts are stiff enough they can trigger the knock sensor into a CEL/limp on the factory computer. What about the Arrow PCM?

Also, I'm planning the gen 5 intake and a DSE heat shield, Ipsco underdrive pulley..any other suggestions for quick and easy mods?

We have several gen 4 cars in our local club with Woodhouse engine mounts a stock PCM. We have never had this problem.

[BlknBlu]

No issues here either.

Bruce

[RedTanRT/10]

Paul, I never had the Woodhouse mounts so can't help you there.

No real issues with the Arrow ECU. I had a couple times when it would go limp after repeated trips to the redline at the track. Dan Cragin told me that was common. But, with their "reflash" it didn't happen although I only hit the rev limiter a couple of times. Definitely get them to reflash to their latest version.

All the other mods you listed are good. If you're going to road race I'd suggest a catch can, you might even want to do that just for the street. You'l be surprised how much oil you'll have in your intake when you remove the stock unit. I have a DIY that works well, I have maybe $200 in parts, I'd sell it to you for $50.00 plus shipping as a way of saying thanks for the splitter purchase. I have detailed instructions, pretty simple to install. Won't pass smog as it bypasses the PCV, but you can remove/swap when you need to.

The only other motor mod would be porting the heads. Dan did them for me on my old G4. Picked up 25 rwhp, but all in cost with porting and labor was over $4k, not sure if I'd do that again.

One other item is a good cat back exhaust. I had Belangers set up, Corsa is a good option with low restriction cats. If you interested, Lou built me a special G4 exhaust, uses his regular muffler but substitutes a small resonator for the cat.

Last note, throw on some SS brake lines. Very reasonable from StopTech (or from JonB) Low cost upgrade that will help you stop better.

BTW, did you buy that ACR????

Best wishes, Mike

[TooBlue]

No issues here either.

Bruce

We have several gen 4 cars in our local club with Woodhouse engine mounts a stock PCM. We have never had this problem.

I have the Woodhouse engine AND trans mounts on three cars.

One car is a 06 TT W/O any problems. (This car originally had the stock ECU with an AEM controller) Regardless the WH mounts didn't trip any codes.

One is an 06 with the same mods you are considering w/o any Cel problems due to the WH mounts.

The other is a Gen 4 dedicated track car with an Arrow PCM. The car also has an Arrow built forged engine with higher compression and a Gen 5 cam, a Gen 5 intake, smooth tube intake pipes with a DSE heat shield, ported heads, under drive pulley, headers with no cats and 1 "muffler" etc.
The car takes a beating and usually running the majority of the time above 3,000 RPMs.
The reason I am telling you the mods to the car is to let you know the Arrow PCM has't been a problem with the Woodhouse mounts and a fair amount of mods.

I doubt you will have a problem. You should know the car will ride a little bit different. The car will feel a little bit "stiffer" is the best way I can describe it. Shifting gears feels more positive if you also go with the trans mounts. All positive changes in feel IMO.

FWIW...From my experience, chances are if your engine mounts are bad, your trans mount is bad too. If your engine mounts are OK and you just want to upgrade, I would do it. Like I said, you might consider the Woodhouse trans mount as well.

Good luck

[Steve M]

The problem I see here is being able to actually verify that you aren't getting any additional knock with the Woodhouse mounts...if you really wanted to know, you'd have to log some data, and the stock PCM won't allow you to log knock. There are other ways to tell, but not easily. One thing I know for certain is this: the stock PCM will log a fair amount of knock even with the car completely stock. Arrow addressed this in their tune; when the details were first released, they stated that they totally disabled the knock sensors, but then came back and said that they were desensitized by some undisclosed amount (not just completely ignored). HPTuners eventually added this functionality as well.

How this will show up in the real world is a reduction in power. When the PCM detects knock (done by individual cylinder), it does two things: it pulls timing, and adds fuel proportional to the amount of timing pulled (e.g. it will add more fuel if it pulls 2° of timing than if it only pulls 1°). That combination will kill power in a big hurry, but not everyone will notice. My Viper, even at its worst, still feels infinitely more powerful than my wife's Mazda CX-5 kid hauler.

Bottom line: Arrow's calibration accounts for the known issue of Gen 4 false knock by desensitizing the sensors, so it probably won't matter what motor mounts you run, but knowing 100% whether or not you are getting additional knock with the stiffer mounts is difficult at best.