2 pound battery install in 2016 ACR

[Arizona Vipers]

Here's a quick and cheap ($209.99) way to drop 22 lbs off of your ACR and also have a more stable battery overall.
Lithium batteries provide the same output voltage regardless of how much the battery is charged/discharged.
The factory ACR battery weighs 24.34 lbs. (the ACR battery is already 7 lbs lighter than non-ACR's)


I used this battery-
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
It's about 1/3rd the price of the Braille lithium batteries I've used in the past.

If you are going to hook this up to a tender, you'll need this as well-
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I used these terminal adapters for the negative side- (I cut the black plastic part off)
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

For the positive side you can just unscrew the large round connector off the positive cable and screw the cable right to the battery.

I glued a thin pad to the bottom of the battery just for added protection of the battery.

I used this strap to secure the battery- https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I put the factory screws through the strap with a large washer. I have this setup on my '13 too so I can swap batteries if needed.

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[Pappy]

Nice job!

Pappy

[FLATOUT]

Nice! Interested to see how these perform over time.

[Martin2000GTS]

That's funny. I just bought that exact same battery for My Harley Road King. Literally the same model number. The stock battery in the Bike was 22lbs. That battery actually weighs a tad over 3lbs (I weighed it on a digital postal scale). Didn't think it would start a big viper engine. Very impressive!

[Arizona Vipers]

Nice! Interested to see how these perform over time.

I did a test trying to simulate real world conditions (for me) and left the car off with radio on medium volume, doors open with interior lights on for about 15 minutes and the car still fired right up.
I don't forsee any situation where i would use more reserve than that. A non-ACR with a bigger stereo in it might see different results...

[TrackAire]

I have the same battery in my track Vette for over 8 months. I've not only tracked it, but had daily driven it to car shows, etc. I'm pleased to say it has held up great with no issues. We'll see how long it lasts.

When not driving the car, I keep a lithium battery maintainer connected to it.

[sharmut]

Nice info. May give it a try on my TA.

[Martin]

Interesting. Any worries of it exploding or catching fire when charging? These batteries are very charge-current sensitive, and it looks like this one has a maximum of 10A charge rating. If it's run down pretty far, the alternator will most certainly deliver a heck of a lot more current than that. Could potentially be an issue unless the battery is always kept at maximum voltage via a tender.

[TrackAire]

Interesting. Any worries of it exploding or catching fire when charging? These batteries are very charge-current sensitive, and it looks like this one has a maximum of 10A charge rating. If it's run down pretty far, the alternator will most certainly deliver a heck of a lot more current than that. Could potentially be an issue unless the battery is always kept at maximum voltage via a tender.

Deltran has a tech guy there that answers the phone and is named Tim. I told him what I wanted to do, if there were any concerns, etc. He told me that although these batteries were designed for the powersports market, he has a lot of customers that use them on vehicles, etc. He also said that if I'm not happy, I could return the unit. He said they have a very lenient return policy and just appreciate the truth, even if the customer screws up they'll stand behind at least one battery.

I too have concerns about catching fire, etc. I built my mount so it bolts into the stock location and can be swapped out in just a few minutes with the stock battery. Having said that, the Deltran worked so well that I've never put the stock battery back in. I don't know if I'd run a cheap Chinese lithium battery like the Deltran in a $300k Ferrari, but for a disposable track car I'm not too concerned. My only real fear is if it caught fire when in storage or in the race car trailer....that I still think about.

If I did want to run the Deltran lithium in a Viper, I would probably mount two units side by side in parallel for additional reserve amps if I was leaving them in full time. For the track, one would probably get the job done.

I've also read posts of people using these for trade show displays, running ARB refrigerators, etc and no problems with taking in more than 10 amps during recharging even when the unit is discharged.....user beware.

[Arizona Vipers]

Interesting. Any worries of it exploding or catching fire when charging? These batteries are very charge-current sensitive, and it looks like this one has a maximum of 10A charge rating. If it's run down pretty far, the alternator will most certainly deliver a heck of a lot more current than that. Could potentially be an issue unless the battery is always kept at maximum voltage via a tender.

Very good point! I've read lithium batteries take 80% less power to charge over lead acid batteries. Do you still think there would be situations where the battery would see more than 10 amps?
The corvettes (and most other brands) guys have been running these for years and I've never heard of one blowing up.

[1ststrike]

Keep us up on how it works for you long term.

[SSGNRDZ_28]

I don't know speciifcly what's inside the Deltran battery but overcharging a lithium phosphate battery is a real concern and fires can occur under the right conditions. I personally know of several instances of this with another battery I'm familiar with. Too much voltage or current lead to issues. A proper charger is a necessity.

Some batteries have nothing more than a huge fuse inside, way larger than the max current (because more discharge is OK) some have intelligent circuitry to keep them from overcharging and draining too low. Might be worth contacting Deltran to be safe. Just because nothing has happened yet that we know of doesn't mean it isn't possible under the right circumstances. This said perhaps Deltran has it covered with the proper protection inside.

All of this said, awesome weight savings for the money!

[Jack B]

I ran the same battery over this summer, it never missed a beat.

Nice! Interested to see how these perform over time.

[FLATOUT]

I ran the same battery over this summer, it never missed a beat.

Awesome! Love the Braille I had but very very pricey.

[ViperGeorge]

I personally can't get over the "Dreamliner" or the Samsung Note 7. My Vipers sit in my house's garage and if a battery ever did go when I wasn't home, so goes the house. Not worth it to me. I'd sooner go on a diet and drop a few pounds than use a Lithium Ion battery, I don't care what brand it is.

[Arizona Vipers]

I personally can't get over the "Dreamliner" or the Samsung Note 7. My Vipers sit in my house's garage and if a battery ever did go when I wasn't home, so goes the house. Not worth it to me. I'd sooner go on a diet and drop a few pounds than use a Lithium Ion battery, I don't care what brand it is.

The same thing happens with lead acid batteries all the time. I've had a lead acid battery explode on me while charging it. It didn't catch fire though.
The actual battery inside most of these lithium car batteries are similar in size/energy storage to the laptop batteries in everyone's house.

[ViperGeorge]

The same thing happens with lead acid batteries all the time. I've had a lead acid battery explode on me while charging it. It didn't catch fire though.
The actual battery inside most of these lithium car batteries are similar in size/energy storage to the laptop batteries in everyone's house.

Lead Acid batteries can explode but they generally don't catch fire. When a Lithium Ion battery catches fire it is almost impossible to put out until all the fuel in the battery is consumed. By this time the car is probably a blaze.

[viper04]

Thanks for sharing the info. Maybe good for track day use.

[SSGNRDZ_28]

There are tons of "lithium" battery types and the chemistry is different in them. Some are more stable than others. Lithium Phosphate (LiFePO4) is what is typically used in automotive type batteries such as this one and is more stable and able to take abuse than the others such as what was used in the dreamliner, phones, etc.

The fact is that all lithium ion batteries require more attention to them than lead acid, but some are far more stable than others. The tolerances are narrow for what a lithium battery requires for charging. If the voltage and current requirements are ignored in lithium batteries the consequences can be greater (permanent damage to the battery for undervoltage, deep discharge, or over voltage, fire when overcharged, etc.). Get the correct charger, and correctly size the battery for the application and the risk is greatly reduced or eliminated. Even better, get a battery with internal intelligent protection and they can be very safe.

[AZTVR]

Get the correct charger, and correctly size the battery for the application and the risk is greatly reduced or eliminated. Even better, get a battery with internal intelligent protection and they can be very safe.

The big question is: "Is the Viper charging system designed to accommodate maintaining a Lithium Iron Phosphate battery safely and properly on a daily use basis?"

I find it interesting that the ACR was advertised as coming with a Lithium ion battery; but, ended up with only a Lead acid battery, I believe. I would guess that was most probably because they found that the Lithium battery CCA was not adequate for all possible street use environmental conditions. Or it could have been due to the legal liabilities. Or it could be due to the charging system design not covering all possibilities of battery charge condition.

[Jack B]

The viper has an over temp sensor that is in contact with the battery, does that help the sky from falling.

[SSGNRDZ_28]

The big question is: "Is the Viper charging system designed to accommodate maintaining a Lithium Iron Phosphate battery safely and properly on a daily use basis?"

I find it interesting that the ACR was advertised as coming with a Lithium ion battery; but, ended up with only a Lead acid battery, I believe. I would guess that was most probably because they found that the Lithium battery CCA was not adequate for all possible street use environmental conditions. Or it could have been due to the legal liabilities. Or it could be due to the charging system design not covering all possibilities of battery charge condition.

Voltage: Lithium Phosphate batteries are (generally) designed to be charged between 14.4-14.8V (ideal). Over 15V is (generally) bad, less than 14.4V is OK just not ideal for quick charging. Not sure what the Viper alternator voltage output is or more importantly what the actual voltage (after losses) would be measured at the battery (varies by battery current draw).

Current: I would not expect the current to be limited by the alternator so this would be the largest risk. A heavily drained battery could be charged over its recommenced limit which could be an issue. This is why putting a super small (capacity wise) battery with a small charging limit isn't as safe as a larger capacity battery with a larger charging limit.

I don't exactly know the function of the temp sensor, Jack, but it would need to remain in contact with the new (smaller) battery to be effective if it is indeed intended for thermal runaway protection.

[AZTVR]

I am not concerned about the Lithium battery since I have no reason to use it. I'm just interested in the engineering side of things.

Voltage: Lithium Phosphate batteries are (generally) designed to be charged between 14.4-14.8V (ideal). Over 15V is (generally) bad, less than 14.4V is OK just not ideal for quick charging. Not sure what the Viper alternator voltage output is or more importantly what the actual voltage (after losses) would be measured at the battery (varies by battery current draw).

What I was thinking of, was what about common failure modes? For instance, I don't think that a alternator/regulator set-up failing and putting out +16V is very unusual. What happens to the Lithium ion battery then? Jack's input about the temp sensor sounds like one designed in fail-safe. However, dramatic, catastrophic failures usually occur because there are more than one failure modes in play at the time. So, it ends up as a design and manufacturing cost trade off versus safety and cost of litigation. The ignorant public gets all upset when they see the rare dramatic failure, even though most everything we do or use has a catastrophic failure mode risk.

My judgement from what I have read is that using the Lithium Iron Phosphate battery is low risk. Lower than running a Viper to 150+ mph on a regular basis.

[SSGNRDZ_28]

What I was thinking of, was what about common failure modes? For instance, I don't think that a alternator/regulator set-up failing and putting out +16V is very unusual. What happens to the Lithium ion battery then?s.

The real "do not exceed" is typically 15.6V. In mild cases reduction of capacity and life span of the battery over time (cells are damaged). In more extreme cases, potential for explosion of cells.

[Jack B]

My G1 and G2 also had a thermal sensor. It has to be part of the regulator circuit, I will look in my G2 shop manual, since only the dealers get a real G5 shop manual.

Voltage: Lithium Phosphate batteries are (generally) designed to be charged between 14.4-14.8V (ideal). Over 15V is (generally) bad, less than 14.4V is OK just not ideal for quick charging. Not sure what the Viper alternator voltage output is or more importantly what the actual voltage (after losses) would be measured at the battery (varies by battery current draw).

Current: I would not expect the current to be limited by the alternator so this would be the largest risk. A heavily drained battery could be charged over its recommenced limit which could be an issue. This is why putting a super small (capacity wise) battery with a small charging limit isn't as safe as a larger capacity battery with a larger charging limit.

I don't exactly know the function of the temp sensor, Jack, but it would need to remain in contact with the new (smaller) battery to be effective if it is indeed intended for thermal runaway protection.