It should be worse!

[Voice of Reason]

On second thought I don't know why we're arguing with you. Enjoy your Porche and best of luck in your future endeavors.

[BLUETA#1]

ViperExchange should hire this guy to drive their GT3 car next year! Ultimate driver

That is a ridiculous assumption and its pointless. My car overheats when on the track and I am not a newbie who is clueless. "My car does not overheat does not help me." This last post was a culmination of months of posts on this issue.

[BLUETA#1]

On second thought I don't know why we're arguing with you.

I have asked that question myself.

[ViperDC]

I have asked that question myself.

So whats the point of the thread? To let us know youre buying a Porsche? Go for it, cool story brah

[FLATOUT]

My only comment is that at this point it has not overheated. Elevated temps yes but we know the Viper V10 lives just fine with the temps you have seen thus far. We also know that the Gen V race cars handle endurance racing quite well and just won the Patron Endurance cup so we know it can live without incident for extended periods of time at lap times quicker than you're seeing, so there's hope

[fuggles]

Congratulations to the #93 Riley Motorsports/TI Automotive/Viper Exchange Dodge Viper for winning the Tequila Patrón North American Endurance Cup Championship.
First at the 24hr at Daytona
First at the 6hr at the Glen
Fourth at the 12hr of Sebring
First to the 4hr mark of the Petit Le Mans at Road Atlanta
http://www.imsa.com/articles/no-5-ac...-endurance-cup

Awesome!

[Nambo]

My only comment is that at this point it has not overheated. Elevated temps yes but we know the Viper V10 lives just fine with the temps you have seen thus far. We also know that the Gen V race cars handle endurance racing quite well and just won the Patron Endurance cup so we know it can live without incident for extended periods of time at lap times quicker than you're seeing, so there's hope

Andy,

Wasn't Ben running 2:22:xx laps in his white TA on street tires at the COTA VOA event? He didn't mention any cooling issues at the time did he?

JD

[kaamacat]

Congratulations for the run at Road Atlanta this past weekend...!!! I was lucky enough to be there in
at the SRT trailer, meet the drivers... and have a good talk with BenK about what I really need to
ask the wife for this xmas with regards to a suspension upgrade! The wife and I had an outstanding
day despite the weather. (My car and one of the past ViperExchange cars had the whole parking area
to ourselves)

[FLATOUT]

Andy,

Wasn't Ben running 2:22:xx laps in his white TA on street tires at the COTA VOA event? He didn't mention any cooling issues at the time did he?

JD

No he went 2:29 that day on street tires, ARROW ECU, and boltons, basically just like you and I were setup that day. Ben did run some incredibly fast laps in that TA at MSR as well and he never had any issues heat. I do think some of it could be happening with sustained really high RPM driving or just general driving style.

I want to rule out the Arrow ECU though so hopefully he swaps the stocker back in and gives it another go.

[nuviper]

Hi Blue TA#1, I'm the Blue TA#7 and I also tracked my car this summer. I tracked with my friends' Z07 and new 991 GT3 on the same track at the same day and we ran 30 min a session. I had a very similar lap time with the Z07 and when his temp reached 270F, mine never exceeded 200. I also compared it with the GT3 (sorry that I forgot his temp because this guy did not get overheat issue either) and we both agreed that the viper's cooling is as good as, if not better than, the GT3's. I know that lap time will affect you cooling a lot. And I believe you are a very quick driver. If my memory works well, you TA#1 was bought from Woodhouse and it got update when it arrived the dealership in preparation for the Pike Peak hill climb race (read from their Facebook page). But I do think that at the stock stage, this car's cooling is not very far behind the one of the new stock 911.

best,
nuviper

[BLUETA#1]

No he went 2:29 that day on street tires, ARROW ECU, and boltons, basically just like you and I were setup that day. Ben did run some incredibly fast laps in that TA at MSR as well and he never had any issues heat. I do think some of it could be happening with sustained really high RPM driving or just general driving style.

I want to rule out the Arrow ECU though so hopefully he swaps the stocker back in and gives it another go.

I was in the car with him. He ran 2 great laps then got off.

[BLUETA#1]

My only comment is that at this point it has not overheated. Elevated temps yes but we know the Viper V10 lives just fine with the temps you have seen thus far. We also know that the Gen V race cars handle endurance racing quite well and just won the Patron Endurance cup so we know it can live without incident for extended periods of time at lap times quicker than you're seeing, so there's hope

Now we are comparing the cooling system of a race specific car to a street car. It's time to punch out. You guys win…

[BLUETA#1]

I was posting in the wrong forum….I need to move this over to the track forum. It’s a bit more informative over there. For example:

Track High Plains Raceway near Byers, CO. Altitude is 5088 feet. Both test days were clear and nice with low humidity.

Baseline - Last time I was at the track
Ambient Temp 77
Stock Pulley
10-40 Mobil 1
Headers
No insulation on anything except O2 wires
Doug Shelby air box shield
95 Octane
Arrow PCM
2 tow hooks
Coolant Max 243 after 15 minutes
Oil Max 263 after 15 minutes
IAT 95
Testing had to be halted due to melted wire harness

First run today
Ambient 73
Underdrive pulley
Doug Shelby air box shield removed
Headers
15-50 Mobil 1
Water Wetter
95 Octane
Arrow PCM
2 tow hooks
Insulation on most everything including cooling lines, PDC, and harness
Coolant Max 225 after 30 minutes
Oil Max 240 after 30 minutes
IAT 95

Second run today
Ambient 86
Same mods as first run except
OEM PCM
Coolant Max 226 after 30 minutes
Oil Max 246 after 30 minutes
IAT 104

Third run today
Ambient 89
Same mods as first and second run except
Arrow PCM reinstalled
Coolant Max 240 after 30 minutes
Oil Max 258 after 30 minutes
IAT 105

A friend was also at the track today with his 2014 GTS. It is bone stock. He is a comparable driver to me at this track. He was running 238 coolant with oil around 250. Seems too hot even for a bone stock car.

[Darius]

My only comment is that at this point it has not overheated. Elevated temps yes but we know the Viper V10 lives just fine with the temps you have seen thus far. We also know that the Gen V race cars handle endurance racing quite well and just won the Patron Endurance cup so we know it can live without incident for extended periods of time at lap times quicker than you're seeing, so there's hope

Exactly, look the car has a 5 year warranty if left stock. Who cares if it's running hot. Run it as hard as you can and if it blows up take it back to the dealer and let them deal with it. That's what I do, seems to work

[FLATOUT]

Now we are comparing the cooling system of a race specific car to a street car. It's time to punch out. You guys win…

Don't get mad lol. You're running your TA on Hoosiers, with the Arrow ECU, on Motons. Your car has far exceeded what the factory engineers designed it to do so why would you not start looking into the Viper Race cars cooling system? Also the other TA you mentioned doesn't run anywhere near the times you do. And also that car IS NOT OVERHEATING even with it running 2 tow hooks in front of the radiator.

[FLATOUT]

Exactly, look the car has a 5 year warranty if left stock. Who cares if it's running hot. Run it as hard as you can and if it blows up take it back to the dealer and let them deal with it. That's what I do, seems to work

Bingo.

[Nine Ball]

I was posting in the wrong forum….I need to move this over to the track forum. It’s a bit more informative over there. For example:

Track High Plains Raceway near Byers, CO. Altitude is 5088 feet. Both test days were clear and nice with low humidity.

Baseline - Last time I was at the track
Ambient Temp 77
Stock Pulley
10-40 Mobil 1
Headers
No insulation on anything except O2 wires
Doug Shelby air box shield
95 Octane
Arrow PCM
2 tow hooks
Coolant Max 243 after 15 minutes
Oil Max 263 after 15 minutes
IAT 95
Testing had to be halted due to melted wire harness

First run today
Ambient 73
Underdrive pulley
Doug Shelby air box shield removed
Headers
15-50 Mobil 1
Water Wetter
95 Octane
Arrow PCM
2 tow hooks
Insulation on most everything including cooling lines, PDC, and harness
Coolant Max 225 after 30 minutes
Oil Max 240 after 30 minutes
IAT 95

Second run today
Ambient 86
Same mods as first run except
OEM PCM
Coolant Max 226 after 30 minutes
Oil Max 246 after 30 minutes
IAT 104

Third run today
Ambient 89
Same mods as first and second run except
Arrow PCM reinstalled
Coolant Max 240 after 30 minutes
Oil Max 258 after 30 minutes
IAT 105

A friend was also at the track today with his 2014 GTS. It is bone stock. He is a comparable driver to me at this track. He was running 238 coolant with oil around 250. Seems too hot even for a bone stock car.

Those temps do not look bad at all. Do you have catalytics on the car? Most have been known to melt at around 550-600 rwhp. I had it happen on my Paxton Gen 3 before, as well as a supercharged Z06 I had. Ditch the cats, they also trap heat in the engine. And, remove one or both of those tow hooks. Every square inch of grille opening matters.

[ViperGeorge]

Blue TA#1 is not the only person having or reporting heating issues. I posted the following in the Track Temps Revisited thread in the Track section.

Track High Plains Raceway near Byers, CO. Altitude is 5088 feet. Both test days were clear and nice with low humidity.

Baseline - Last time I was at the track
Ambient Temp 77
Stock Pulley
10-40 Mobil 1
Headers
No insulation on anything except O2 wires
Doug Shelby air box shield
95 Octane
Arrow PCM
2 tow hooks
Coolant Max 243 after 15 minutes
Oil Max 263 after 15 minutes
IAT 95
Testing had to be halted due to melted wire harness

First run today
Ambient 73
Underdrive pulley
Doug Shelby air box shield removed
Headers
15-50 Mobil 1
Water Wetter
95 Octane
Arrow PCM
2 tow hooks
Insulation on most everything including cooling lines, PDC, and harness
Coolant Max 225 after 30 minutes
Oil Max 240 after 30 minutes
IAT 95

Second run today
Ambient 86
Same mods as first run except
OEM PCM
Coolant Max 226 after 30 minutes
Oil Max 246 after 30 minutes
IAT 104

Third run today
Ambient 89
Same mods as first and second run except
Arrow PCM reinstalled
Coolant Max 240 after 30 minutes
Oil Max 258 after 30 minutes
IAT 105

A friend was also at the track today with his 2014 GTS. It is bone stock. He is a comparable driver to me at this track. He was running 238 coolant with oil around 250. Seems too hot even for a bone stock car.

[FLATOUT]

Those temps do not look bad at all. Do you have catalytics on the car? Most have been known to melt at around 550-600 rwhp. I had it happen on my Paxton Gen 3 before, as well as a supercharged Z06 I had. Ditch the cats, they also trap heat in the engine. And, remove one or both of those tow hooks. Every square inch of grille opening matters.

I believe that car currently has full factory exhaust and one tow hook up front. Upgraded radiator, hard coolant lines, coolant is 1/3 coolant and 2/3rds water. We also replaced the temp sensors just as a precaution.

[mjorgensen]

Don't get mad lol. You're running your TA on Hoosiers, with the Arrow ECU, on Motons. Your car has far exceeded what the factory engineers designed it to do so why would you not start looking into the Viper Race cars cooling system? Also the other TA you mentioned doesn't run anywhere near the times you do. And also that car IS NOT OVERHEATING even with it running 2 tow hooks in front of the radiator.

LOL Andy, you know full well he is on MCS and we both know why you know that... Karl is basically "stock" with the exception of the Arrow PCM (and well, the MCS we set up for him to "help" be that fast) 2.24 times over and over... Ben ran 2.29 with much more power and your suspension on Corsa's? (I bet which are pretty sticky compared to regular street tires) I have not ruled out there being something going on with Karl's car, it was at your shop and you found nothing wrong really though correct? I would hope we could keep him in the car since he is fast and represents the Viper very well at the track. He also is capable of giving great feedback about it, he is just not happy at the moment.

I'm glad he is consciences enough to not just run it to the edge and "have warranty deal with it" that to me shows real character and professionalism, I'm sure SRT feels the same.

[Nambo]

LOL Andy, you know full well he is on MCS and we both know why you know that... Karl is basically "stock" with the exception of the Arrow PCM (and well, the MCS we set up for him to "help" be that fast) 2.24 times over and over... Ben ran 2.29 with much more power and your suspension on Corsa's? (I bet which are pretty sticky compared to regular street tires) I have not ruled out there being something going on with Karl's car, it was at your shop and you found nothing wrong really though correct? I would hope we could keep him in the car since he is fast and represents the Viper very well at the track. He also is capable of giving great feedback about it, he is just not happy at the moment.

I'm glad he is consciences enough to not just run it to the edge and "have warranty deal with it" that to me shows real character and professionalism, I'm sure SRT feels the same.

Karl is definitely smoking around COTA! I hope he does a run with the stock ECU to compare because I think the Arrow ECU makes the car run hotter than stock. I have never seen temps as high as Karl ( I am a whopping 8 seconds slower) but I have run COTA with the stock ECM, HP tuners, and Arrow and the Arrow exhibited the highest temps (and melted O2 wires).

[FLATOUT]

Sorry I still reffer to MCS's as Motons by habit yes he is on MCS's. Bens times were not on our suspension he was still on stock TA Dampers with the DSC controller but we found that day that the DSC cant control the non dynamic factory shock so he went 2.29 with boltons, arrow controller, on a factory tire.

I have talked to Dick as much as you have and he still doesn't seem to be too concerned with the temps which is why I want to see two things. 1. swap the factory ECU back in it and lets see what happens. 2. Run the car harder for a few extra laps and lets see what happens.

This is not the normal case as you and I both know so if Dick says it's safe at the temps he's seeing why keep saying that it's overheating?

If this particular case was an easy fix we would have found it already.

Yes his car was at our shop and I am in agreement with you that we didn't find anything out of the ordinary other than a chalkyness to the coolant when we drained it to do the radiator swap. I spoke with Morgan and Brian Erdman more about it this weekend and it was either water wetter or really hard water that was in it. We flushed the system literally 5 times to make sure all of that was out of it before refilling.

Andy

LOL Andy, you know full well he is on MCS and we both know why you know that... Karl is basically "stock" with the exception of the Arrow PCM (and well, the MCS we set up for him to "help" be that fast) 2.24 times over and over... Ben ran 2.29 with much more power and your suspension on Corsa's? (I bet which are pretty sticky compared to regular street tires) I have not ruled out there being something going on with Karl's car, it was at your shop and you found nothing wrong really though correct? I would hope we could keep him in the car since he is fast and represents the Viper very well at the track. He also is capable of giving great feedback about it, he is just not happy at the moment.

I'm glad he is consciences enough to not just run it to the edge and "have warranty deal with it" that to me shows real character and professionalism, I'm sure SRT feels the same.

[FLATOUT]

Karl is definitely smoking around COTA! I hope he does a run with the stock ECU to compare because I think the Arrow ECU makes the car run hotter than stock. I have never seen temps as high as Karl ( I am a whopping 8 seconds slower) but I have run COTA with the stock ECM, HP tuners, and Arrow and the Arrow exhibited the highest temps (and melted O2 wires).

I am also really interested in seeing the stock ECU comparo.

[XSnake]

Wouldn't hard metal coolant lines just heat the coolant more once they are hot and coolant is passing through them? Not sure if I would do that. Putting a spring in the rubber ones is the way to go imo.

[Stealth]

I do not think the ECU is the issue, except if you are running 93 Octane and running hard you may generate a bit more heat and power.

My Gen IV Viper loved to have some heat in it in terms of power, etc.

My Gen V does get hotter at a HPDE than it does on the street, but how could this not be the case? 195-200F Oil is standard on the street with a bit of traffic. If the car is being wrung out--in a good way--on a road course, it will surely run hotter. More power = more heat. to expect to run the same temps on the track as the car runs when loafing on the street is not realistic. I look at the Arrow PCM as the tune SRT and Arrow preferred for the car, absent regulations, etc.

I am definitely in agreement with OP on this thread and with others on other threads (even the C7Z forum), that driving style and speed impact heat; clearly, the higher the rpms and the faster the lap, the more heat. Increased power also generates more heat. Thus far I have not seen any credible evidence of any Gen Vs getting "warning lights", going in to limp mode, etc. The C7Z is a completely different situation as that car appears to have known design...shortcomings, etc.

On most road courses I have run in cars and bikes, there are often choices in terms of gears and shift points for various portions of the track. With cars like Vipers and C7Zs, the ample torque provides more choices that some other cars.

Most street cars will require modification to be able to run flat out at high rpms for extended periods of time. There is a line somewhere between having some safe and fast HPDE time on one hand (Gen Vs are excellent here!), and actually racing or seeking to set the track record on the other hand. In the later category, there are concerns other than just cooling: fire suppression; full roll cage; etc.

Again, I would check the equipment changes on the new ACR--I believe it has dif and tranny coolers or something to ensure even more robust, sustained track performance.

Best wishes for the solutions which allow you to enjoy your Gen V or, alternatively, your new Porsche.