Been having some trouble shifting...

[VenomousOne]

So I pulled out my transmission mount, or should I say fell out? I'm hoping this new mount does the trick!

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i10/ohioswanga/Mobile%20Uploads/20150403_184112.jpg (http://s68.photobucket.com/user/ohioswanga/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150403_184112.jpg.html)

[XSnake]

Bet your motor mounts are in even worse condition if they haven't been replaced.

[JonB ~ PartsRack]

Indeed.

The drivers-side motor mount (called an Isolator by Chrysler) takes a real beating, and can raise / stretch .5" at WOT. Thousands of times until it fails in its HOT environment (worse with headers.) This flexing stresses the trans mount too, and eventually your shifts can become less precise. especially in a WOT sequence.

$45 OE Motor-Mount-Isolators are strong and durable within 650HP, but NOT necessarily for 10+ years or under extreme HP/Heat duress.

Poly Motor Mts have their own issues: cost 3X as much; Not good "isolators" transmitting vibrations to dash, cockpit, more. (NVH BUZZ); Melting under extreme conditions. As an instructor, when I hop into a strange Viper the 1st time I can often tell that it has hard motor mounts due to the vibrations in the cockpit!

So I usually suggest $90 for both OE mounts and $45 for a poly TRANS mount, really anchors the Shifter.


Your opinion may vary.

[VenomousOne]

The engine seems to be pretty secure. I've had other cars with mounts go bad and u could physically feel the engine rocking. I understand that this is a whole different beast and the symptoms may not be the same. Regardless I'm going to put her up in the air again tomorrow and check them out. Oh and I took it out to get an emission test this morning and the shifts definitely felt more stable.

[daveg]

Funny that this conversation came up.
Just got out from under my car (96 GTS) and looking / jacking up the engine, the mounts look great. Couldn’t get any movement / separation on the mounts at all when jacking up either side of the block. Didn’t look at the tranny though. I can’t believe they are the original mounts and not trashed.. Car looks brand new underneath so easy to look at them...

[JonB ~ PartsRack]

Other things that can cause 'shifting problems' are a deteriorating / leaking Hydraulic Slave Cylinder inside the bell housing.

Also, old, dark, black clutch fluid cannot handle header heat, and heat-soaking.
Causes intermittent hard shifting when hot / heat-soaked. Actually worse on Viper-powered trucks!

[Vprbite]

Jon, I have heard that some Gen IV's will go into "Limp Mode" with those hard motor and trans mounts. Have you seen that?

I like the idea of more precise shifts but putting all poly mounts on would worry me that the car would feel like a paint shaker given our torque and the way these cars are cammed.

Speaking of clutch fluid, I just had Eddie change the clutch fluid even though it had only been 10k mi or so and it made that clutch feel smooth as butter and overall a much better feel when shifting. The clutch had developed less of a bite and more of a big ol chomp with the old fluid. How often would you recommend changing out that old, dark, black clutch fluid? I think it's something that's easy to overlook.

[VenomousOne]

Would anyone with too much time on their hands care to tell me how to change the clutch fluid???? My car would appreciate it very much. :smileys-car-driving

[Bugman Jeff]

Would anyone with too much time on their hands care to tell me how to change the clutch fluid???? My car would appreciate it very much. :smileys-car-driving

The easy way: Suck as much fluid out of the reservoir as you can with a turkey baster and refill. Because the fluid in the slave cylinder gets hot, it will migrate up to the reservoir as the car is driven. Suck the fluid out and refill once a week for 3-4 weeks and most of your fluid will be exchanged.

The hard way: There is a bleeder valve on the slave cylinder. The clutch cylinders are bled the same way as brakes, with two people, one in the car, one under. Open the bleeder valve, step the pedal to the floor, close the bleeder, let the pedal up and repeat until the fluid coming out is new. Be sure to keep the reservoir topped up so you don't accidentally drain it and suck air into the system.

[VenomousOne]

Awesome. Thank you!

[Coloviper]

So had the Woodhouse Poly engine and tranny mounts installed on my 3,000 mile 06' SRT-10 Coupe when I had it. Absolutely hated it and 50 miles later, pulled them out and reinstalled the factory ones. It was like AC/DC 24/7. Shook me all night long! Sold that car a few years ago when I had some major health issues hit.

Now engine mounts were shot in my old Viper but it is an open air roadster so thought I would try again. Installed Woodhouse Poly engine and tranny mounts on my 23,000 mile 96' RT/10 Roadster. Absolutely LOVE them! Nowhere near as much additional vibration as on a coupe as I believe the open air car just desipates the vibrations better. No harmonic situations.

Now at the same time, I also did new Spec 3 clutch, Fidanza lightweight flywheel, IPSCO shifter, IPSCO aluminum tranny mount bar, new master and slave cylinders, new pilot bearing and the Snake Oyl remote clutch bleeder kit.

Can't say for certain which item improved the shift but before I wrestled to get the car into gear under load. It was brutal. Now, it is like butter. I mean new or old, I have never had a car shift as perfect and smooth as this old Viper pursing around or under WOT load. Never miss a gear going up or going from 5th to 2nd on a extreme slow down turn or example. It is an absolute pleasure to drive and has 100% confidence.

My "off the ass" opinion is yes to Poly Mounts on Verts but cautious on Coupes. If Coupe is a track toy, then yes. If Coupe is a street with occasional track, then may be too much additional Vibrations for your liking. Just IMHO.

[Vombomb]

I'm considering buying a damn TR6060 for my Gen III coupe, that's how bad the shifting is.

[My98RT10]

The only thing I could complain about is that the tranny needs a "minute" after disengaging the clutch to accept the next gear. Other than that I seem to have no issues with shifting. Makes me believe that my motor mounts are still in good shape!?

[Fatboy 18]

Woodhouse mounts in my car and transmission mount and Ipsco solid billet transmission crossmember, My old mounts were fine, but I did suffer from wheel hop, changed everything over for a much stiffer ride and minimum wheel hop, However, if you travel a few hundred miles you do notice more vibration through the car.

[Suitejudyblueyes]

The easy way: Suck as much fluid out of the reservoir as you can with a turkey baster and refill. Because the fluid in the slave cylinder gets hot, it will migrate up to the reservoir as the car is driven. Suck the fluid out and refill once a week for 3-4 weeks and most of your fluid will be exchanged.So what you are saying is that with each press and release of the clutch pedal, the fluid that is 'trapped' in the slave cylinder/release bearing unit is released back to the hydraulic circuit and a 'fresh' amount is trapped in the slave cylinder for the next cycle? I don't see this happening with a system not having a fluid return line. I could be wrong, but I believe the only proper way to get rid of the nasty fluid in the bellhousing is to do it the hard way using the bleed connection off the release bearing unit.

[Fatboy 18]

So what you are saying is that with each press and release of the clutch pedal, the fluid that is 'trapped' in the slave cylinder/release bearing unit is released back to the hydraulic circuit and a 'fresh' amount is trapped in the slave cylinder for the next cycle? I don't see this happening with a system not having a fluid return line. I could be wrong, but I believe the only proper way to get rid of the nasty fluid in the bellhousing is to do it the hard way using the bleed connection off the release bearing unit.

It will self bleed through gravity but it takes time ;)

[Bugman Jeff]

So what you are saying is that with each press and release of the clutch pedal, the fluid that is 'trapped' in the slave cylinder/release bearing unit is released back to the hydraulic circuit and a 'fresh' amount is trapped in the slave cylinder for the next cycle? I don't see this happening with a system not having a fluid return line. I could be wrong, but I believe the only proper way to get rid of the nasty fluid in the bellhousing is to do it the hard way using the bleed connection off the release bearing unit.

No. It has everything to do with heat, not with pedal actuation. Because it lives in an enclosed space between the engine and transmission, the fluid in the slave cylinder gets hot. The hot fluid rises and works it's way up to the reservoir. It's obvious that it really does work this way because the clean, fresh fluid in the reservoir quickly looks dirty again even though the system doesn't displace enough fluid to pump fresh fluid all the way down to the slave. It's not a straight old/new exchange, but a more gradual mixing of old and new until a majority of the old fluid has been exchanged It took 5-6 suckings/refillings over about a month for the fluid in my car to stay fresh looking.

[thetalonguy]

The engine seems to be pretty secure. I've had other cars with mounts go bad and u could physically feel the engine rocking. I understand that this is a whole different beast and the symptoms may not be the same. Regardless I'm going to put her up in the air again tomorrow and check them out. Oh and I took it out to get an emission test this morning and the shifts definitely felt more stable.

Just curious how things have been with just the trans mount replacement? Did you check your motor mounts?

[VenomousOne]

My shifts have been smoother but I'm not sure if it's because of the Trans mount or just because I am getting more and more used to the car. I have not checked the motor mounts yet; I've been kinda lazy because it's back down to 40 degrees here! Thanks for the check up. I am always looking for opinions and feedback from other owners. When I check out the motor mounts I will update this thread

[thetalonguy]

I installed the IPSCO Aluminum mount and poly bushing this afternoon. My old bushing fell right out into two pieces. Man what a difference!! The shifter is perfectly still and I can now downshift into 3rd without any issue. I had been under the impression that Vipers were supposed to be sluggish and have vibrations. Well, it has really made gear changes effortlessly. I love would higher suggest to do this upgrade in your Gen2 as your trans mount has probably crapped out.

The only thing that I noticed is that the trans is really, really loud. There are no vibrations at all, but I can't understand why it would create so much more noise. Did this happen to anyone else?

Also thought I felt the motor be a little more vibraty, but not enough for me to really care.

[Fatboy 18]

So I pulled out my transmission mount, or should I say fell out? I'm hoping this new mount does the trick!

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i10/ohioswanga/Mobile%20Uploads/20150403_184112.jpg (http://s68.photobucket.com/user/ohioswanga/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150403_184112.jpg.html)

Out of interest, what mileage had your car done when you removed the Trans mount?

[FrgMstr]

I change the clutch fluid every time I change the oil. Use the turkey baster method to put new fluid in the reservoir to the very top, then get under the car with a MityVac and suck out enough to NOT let eh reservoir go dry. Two times doing this gets all the old fluid out. I usually do three times to make sure.

[thetalonguy]

Out of interest, what mileage had your car done when you removed the Trans mount?

FYI... I have 39K on mine and had the same result.

Also, for future VOA searches, I spoke to Mark at IPSCO and he said that you don't need to install the preload bar that comes with the Energy Suspension mount. I did and I'm getting a lot of noise(no vibration) from the tranny tunnel. However, he mentioned there was no harm with leaving it in as long as your aftermarket shifter didn't intefere, but removal of the load bar should cut the added noise down. I've got a lot of seat time coming this weekend, and will decide whether to remove it after then.

[VenomousOne]

I have 47k

[RTTTTed]

There is a teflon/plastic bushing that the shifter Ball sits inside of. My 81,000mile T56 was worn out pretty badly. Short shifter I changed over to the new Tranzilla transmission. My Roe blown engine puts out about 700+whp and I compete often. I drive my GTS mostly on hwy to get tothe competitions that I enter (and kick ass). Only issue with my shfting was that at 5800rpm shifting between 5th and 6th was difficult and usually took two pulls.

Gen 2s run 196mph in 5th gear at 6100rpm with stock gears and tires so I only need to worry about 6th in mile competitions (or longer). My transzilla has the same gear ratios as my GForce race tranny with .75 (stock 5th gear) changed to 6th gear and .89 installed into 5th gear. I'm going to run Gen 3 (19" tires to gain the 8% higher gear ration and increase my top speed to 211mph with the 27.6" tall tires. Stock Gen 2 tires are 26" tall