Help me understand canned tune vs custom tune vs dyno tune

[Vprbite]

I may misunderstand these terms, leading to some confusion.

I thought a custom tune meant where you put the car on the dyno and tuned according to your readings. Either the shop with the dyno making the adjustments or having a shop somewhere else making the adjustments so you are effectively just renting the dyno while someone else does the tune. Making your tune the only one like that, made specifically for your car.

I thought a "canned" tune is where I bought an SCT device from ROE or Unleashed Tuning, told them I had an 06 with XYZ mods and they sent me the device with a tune on it for those mods based on what they have learned wih all their experience.

It now seems I am mistaken. Is the second scenario I described above a custom tune, just not a remote dyno tune? And is the difference between buying a tune from roe or unleashed without doing remote dyno an issue of eeking every ounce of power out of the motor as possible?

Is a canned tune a generic tune written for all cars of that make and model regardless of mods?

I hope I adequately described my question. Thanks in advance for your help.

[plumcrazy]

custom tune can really only be done on a dyno, anything else is a waste

[Steve M]

I consider a canned tune something that comes on a handheld device that you just upload and go...no conversation with anyone about the mods. Torrie does what I'd consider remote custom tuning because he does take mods into account...it still isn't ideal because he's not actually there taking readings and looking at data to tweak the tune, but if you can log and reduce data, you can go back and forth with him a couple times and probably get pretty darn close, but the results will depend on the tools the end user has at their disposal (like a wideband O2 sensor installed). A dyno tune is just that - tuning done on the dyno in a controlled environment.

Most people consider a dyno tune to be the end all, be all of tuning, but I'd argue against that to an extent. Personally, I like to tune a car like it is driven - on the street. But that requires some things, and one of those things would be a wideband oxygen sensor installed and logged with all of the other data you can gather from the OBD-II port. The biggest drawbacks to doing this are: 1. you need some mechanical and technical proficiency to install and use a wideband O2 sensor, and 2. it can be dangerous tuning for WOT on public roads. The next best option would be to tune the car on a load based dyno - that's a Mustang dyno, and I think the newer Dynojets can do the same. They can apply a load to the driven wheels that is similar to the load applied when the car is driven on the street - this is nice because you can tune WOT without endangering the general public. The drawback to this is you don't have moving air running over the car and into the air box, so it's not exactly like the car would encounter in the real world. My least favorite option for dyno tuning would be on an inertia based dyno, like the good ol' DynoJet (at least the older ones). These don't present a realistic load to the driven wheels, and again, there's no moving air over the car. You can work around this generally by tuning it a bit rich, knowing that the car will likely run a bit leaner on the street under a realistic load.

As long as you understand what you are getting, you'll be fine. Some people don't even know what questions to ask, and that's where they can run into trouble, and potentially end up disappointed when the car doesn't run right. If you have the desire, tuning it yourself is always the best option, but you need to be willing to invest a lot of time and energy into understanding how things work and why.

[Vprbite]

I guess my confusion comes when a tuner website says custom tunes 199.99. But that is more of a " canned" tune written for a car exactly like mine, correct?

Though isn't that what most people have? most people who have a tune listed in their mods probably have a conservative tune written for a car with their parameters, right?

[Steve M]

I guess my confusion comes when a tuner website says custom tunes 199.99. But that is more of a " canned" tune written for a car exactly like mine, correct?

Though isn't that what most people have? most people who have a tune listed in their mods probably have a conservative tune written for a car with their parameters, right?

In a sense, yes - at some point, if you've tuned enough cars with similar mods, you know approximately what needs to be done to get the tune in order, so you at least have a good baseline. That's pretty much what any tuner that provides remote tuning service does.

In an ideal world, you'd want the tuner right there with your car, but not everyone can do that. If I'm not mistaken, some of the Texas folks flew Torrie out to tune multiple cars in person. In my case, when I bought HPTuners for my Gen 4, Torrie provided a custom tune as part of the package price, so he gave me a base canned tune to work from remotely. He knew approximately what needed to be done (my car was stock), so he made the changes, but kept them conservative to account for variables like gas quality and weather conditions. The car ran much stronger right away. I've since made even more tweaks myself to get things just right, but I can't do much more unless I either get some dyno time with a wideband O2 sensor or just install a wideband O2 sensor in my car.

[Vprbite]

So then for me, having just done belanger headers, high flows and corsa, a quasi-custom tune would probably work fine for some power gains while still being conservative for the reasons you mentioned. Correct?

I was hoping a tune might subdue a bit of the popping on decel when I engine brake. I like some of that, but I am afraid I am going to cause an accident next to someone cause they look over like it is a gun going off at times. Plus if it helps me get the most out of my mods. I have no desire to squeeze every drop of power out of the motor, but I may as well take advantage.

I assumed a tune written by Roe or Unleashed was fine because they have seen my mods a ton and have those pretty well locked down.

[plumcrazy]

steve is actually right. a real custom tune really does need to be with street conditions in all kind of different conditions. i wouldnt waste time or money on a canned tune regardless of mods. you will see "some" gains but nothing like a real tune done by a real tuner

[Steve M]

So then for me, having just done belanger headers, high flows and corsa, a quasi-custom tune would probably work fine for some power gains while still being conservative for the reasons you mentioned. Correct?

I was hoping a tune might subdue a bit of the popping on decel when I engine brake. I like some of that, but I am afraid I am going to cause an accident next to someone cause they look over like it is a gun going off at times. Plus if it helps me get the most out of my mods. I have no desire to squeeze every drop of power out of the motor, but I may as well take advantage.

I assumed a tune written by Roe or Unleashed was fine because they have seen my mods a ton and have those pretty well locked down.

You'd probably be okay with a remote tune for your application...they'll almost always leave a little on the table in the performance department for safety/durability reasons, but if you aren't looking to get that last little bit out of it, it should be fine.

The problem with a Viper is that there are so few of them out there that we don't have a lot of options for tuning. For a time, GM LSx tuners were popping out of the woodwork left and right...for the Viper, it's pretty much a handful of people, even though there's nothing inherently complicated about them. Just gotta have software support, but that's hard to come by when only a small fraction of Viper owners even mod their cars.

[SlateEd]

I have a canned tune that was written for bolt-ons like mine. Got a chance to dyno the car looking at data like A/F and the canned tune improved what we were seeing over the stock tune, but did not come close to getting the most out of the engine. And it's all over the map, rich in the low end, lean up top with huge differences between. Getting it tuned on a loaded dyno is on my list for this year for sure.

[Vprbite]

Thanks for your input. Lots of good info here. Would a tune written by say, Unleashed for my car with my mods help tone down some of the popping on deceleration that I get? Like I said, I like it to an extent but it's pretty intense since the headers, high flows, and corsa and I think I might like it just a little more subtle.

[Revolution]

Buyers beware you may be paying for less performance then you already got! I made that mistake last year and won't do that again!!

[plumcrazy]

Buyers beware you may be paying for less performance then you already got! I made that mistake last year and won't do that again!!

from who ?

[kirkinsb]

Exactly.....From who???

[Vprbite]

Revolution, could you be please be a bit more cryptic next time? You are far too clear with your post.

[Steve M]

His issue was with Torrie, hence why he popped up in here.

Limited info/details emerged in this thread:

http://driveviper.com/forums/threads/4774-HPTuners-Info-(Gen-4)/page5?p=82660#post82660


Took my gen 4 to the track with hp in it and was down considerably on power anyone else ran there cars on the track?