Another Viper totaled - anyone have any information on this car/driver?

[johniew398]

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj9/johniew398/Miscellaneous/10891689_10202048150724223_2588161591367950556_n_z psada4955d.jpg (http://s268.photobucket.com/user/johniew398/media/Miscellaneous/10891689_10202048150724223_2588161591367950556_n_z psada4955d.jpg.html)

[johniew398]

http://www.nbcmiami.com/video/#!/on-air/as-seen-on/Firefighters--Surgeon-Extricate-Man-From-Car-After-Accident/286923631

[Victxv10]

Gen3 Paxton car

[SA Heat]

By the looks of the car bent in half where it hit the pole, he's lucky to have survived.

[johniew398]

The guy bought it two days ago. How often have we seen that where someone not used to a Viper buys one and then totals it.

[Vipes]

The guy bought it two days ago. How often have we seen that where someone not used to a Viper buys one and then totals it.

Yeah, once a week maybe? I would love to see some statistics of how many wrecks per car out there. Has to be one of the highest ratios per/car/mile considering these cars rarely get driven. I hope he's okay!

[Fatboy 18]

Ouch, that's not nice to see, hope the guy makes a speedy recovery, looked nasty, he is lucky to be alive after that one.

Shame about the car :(

[swexlin]

Does anyone know if he is a member here. I dearly hope he will be OK. Looking at the car, it's amazing that he got out.

[XSnake]

Owner had just taken delivery of the car so I doubt they had signed up for membership. Was down in sfl today with members. People knew the car but not the new owner.

[J TNT]

SRT Engineers in a tech seminar had mentioned , that going with a steel frame to give occupants a higher positive outcome in collisions , was part of their decision process.
Given that the Viper is lighter than the New Aluminum Frame Corvette , they seem to have struck a nice balance .

[Vprbite]

Wow. As someone who survived a terrible Viper crash I feel greatly for this person. I also don't feel comfortable jumping to conclusions as to why or how it happened without any information.

If anyone knows this person, please get in touch with me. I would like to be of some help if I can having survived something eerily similar.

[LATAMUD]

Doug Levin posted on the Alley that it was once one of his cars. The driver bought it from a dealer 2 days ago. The wreck forced the engine up onto the driver. His legs were amputated to get him free.

[Vipes]

Doug Levin posted on the Alley that it was once one of his cars. The driver bought it from a dealer 2 days ago. The wreck forced the engine up onto the driver. His legs were amputated to get him free.

Wow that sounds horrible!! Poor guy :(

[01sapphirebob]

Doug Levin posted on the Alley that it was once one of his cars. The driver bought it from a dealer 2 days ago. The wreck forced the engine up onto the driver. His legs were amputated to get him free.

Thats just awful. :(

[Vprbite]

Wow. That's aweful. Seriously, does anyone know how to get ahold of him? The details between his and my wreck are very similar and I really would like to be of some help to this person if possible. I would like to show him that recovery is possible. As is driving a Viper again or anything else one would like to do.

[XSnake]

Terrible news :/

[Viktimize]

Wow. That's aweful. Seriously, does anyone know how to get ahold of him? The details between his and my wreck are very similar and I really would like to be of some help to this person if possible. I would like to show him that recovery is possible. As is driving a Viper again or anything else one would like to do.

I've seen Corvettes outfitted for hand driving because they are automatic. Not sure how that could work with a Viper?

Sounds like this guy is lucky to be alive. Nobody knows the details yet, but I would take it as another reminder to be careful with cold tires.

[J TNT]

Sorry to hear that !

[Vprbite]

You can do what is called a "trigger clutch" which goes on the gearshift like a trigger and used pneumatics to move the clutch pedal. The car can still be driven normally. And it is also just cool in its own right to have a clutch worked like the trigger if a gun. Also, there is of course the automatic option, though expensive. A company called guido simplex out of Italy makes driving aids for race car drivers who have been injured.

I don't want to talk about myself too much here because this thread isn't about me but feel free to PM me if you are curious about what I did for my Viper.

[IndyRon]

Man, hope the guy ends up being OK. Looking at the car, some cars are totaled and others are TOTALED. His would be the latter.

[LATAMUD]

I just wanted to correct myself, Doug Levin did not say it was once one of his cars. He just mentioned it was a highly modded Paxton car. I hope the driver makes it through this.

[Fatboy 18]

OMG :( That's awful news :(

[Anonymous]

Close to my house in NY about three months ago, two twenty something year olds died in what looks like a red 2003 Paxton car, but they went under a guard rail,the PD found them two days after the crash.

[Fatboy 18]

Got to ask a serious question here, how many of you guys had driven a stick shift before owning a Viper?

Watching Top Gear UK it seems many Americans have not driven a stick shift. If you go out and buy a used Viper do you have a driver awareness course or something of that nature to say you can drive a stick shift? do you have to pass some sort of different driving test?


In my Country, if you pass your driving test in an Automatic car, thats all you are allowed to drive. If you pass your test in a manual stick shift car you can drive manual and Auto.

[Torquemonster06]

That's a sad thing. Thoughts and prayers his way.

[LifeIsGood]

...how many of you guys had driven a stick shift before owning a Viper?

I had years of seat time with sticks before my viper.


If you go out and buy a used Viper do you have a driver awareness course or something of that nature to say you can drive a stick shift?

No.


...do you have to pass some sort of different driving test?

No

We take a written test and a road test when we're 16 (years old) to get a drivers license. We drive our own car during the test so it doesn't have to be a stick...our license covers any normal car or truck (automatic or stick).

[Fatboy 18]

Really! That's got to be worrying :( Respecting the power in a stock viper is hard enough, then add another few hundred HP and a young inexperienced or older driver (used to a Corvette auto) could be allowed to drive off down the road without any formal training on clutch control and shifting has to be a recipe for impending disaster! No wonder so many cars end up like this!

[Anonymous]

Fatboy is this an American only problem?I do see a lot of crashed high end sports cars in Europe ,I have family in Italy and I visit there often,also lots of Americans drive stick.

[Viktimize]

Got to ask a serious question here, how many of you guys had driven a stick shift before owning a Viper?

Watching Top Gear UK it seems many Americans have not driven a stick shift. If you go out and buy a used Viper do you have a driver awareness course or something of that nature to say you can drive a stick shift? do you have to pass some sort of different driving test?


In my Country, if you pass your driving test in an Automatic car, thats all you are allowed to drive. If you pass your test in a manual stick shift car you can drive manual and Auto.

Sounds like your country is doing something right. Our country thinks it is ok to just let any idiot out on the road without a clue what they are doing. And instead of teaching them how, or issuing citations to teach them through discipline, they instead just go apeshit on speed enforcement to slow down everyone so in the event of accidents there is a higher likelihood of living. But they don't seem to give a single damn about preventing accidents in the first place, which would be like hitting 2 birds with one stone. Although it wouldn't be near as profitable as speed enforcement.

[IndyRon]

Really! That's got to be worrying :( Respecting the power in a stock viper is hard enough, then add another few hundred HP and a young inexperienced or older driver (used to a Corvette auto) could be allowed to drive off down the road without any formal training on clutch control and shifting has to be a recipe for impending disaster! No wonder so many cars end up like this!

Our drivers testing is woefully inadequate here in the US overall and some states are worse than others. I think there should be a wet skidpad test done in a large parking requiring the average driver to appropriately respond to understeer and oversteer situations as part of getting your drivers license.

[J TNT]

Graduated licensing in some European countries seems to have a more positive outcome . I know in Motorcycles, most riders will kill themselves in the first 2 years, typically buying to much machine for their ability . Once they get past the 2 year mark the attrition rate drops dramatically . With graduated licensing the rider would start with a smaller bike , and as a result the learning curve is very good , once 1 or 2 years of experience is attained they move up the food chain . It also helps keep insurance rates down for the rest of us who are responsible . fwiw

[Sybil TF]

Got to ask a serious question here, how many of you guys/gals had driven a stick shift before owning a Viper?

.Never...

[Fatboy 18]

Fatboy is this an American only problem?I do see a lot of crashed high end sports cars in Europe ,I have family in Italy and I visit there often,also lots of Americans drive stick.OF COURSE ITS NOT ONLY AN AMERICAN PROBLEM.

Speed is not the problem either, but stopping and controlling it is! TIRES also play a major part in controlling the car, many overlook that bit ;)

I used to teach people to ride motorcycles, new bikes that the customer purchased would be delivered to a large carpark where we would teach them about centre of balance, brake and clutch control. at that time in the late 1970s the british law was changed so that you could only learn to drive up to a 250cc motorcycle, later as bikes became more powerful they changed the law again bringing this down to 125cc

Germany on certain sections of Autobahn there are no speed restrictions,, France has a speed for when driving in the rain and another speed for driving in Dry weather. (as im sure you are aware).

But surely it would make sense to at least ask the driver about his experience and have some sort of stick refresher course available?

This driver may well of had much experience, I'm not pointing the finger at him one bit, something may have failed on the car?

But in an emergency situation, if you are not used to the stick shift and clutch, it could aid to an impending accident.

[Fatboy 18]

Graduated licensing in some European countries seems to have a more positive outcome . I know in Motorcycles, most riders will kill themselves in the first 2 years, typically buying to much machine for their ability . Once they get past the 2 year mark the attrition rate drops dramatically . With graduated licensing the rider would start with a smaller bike , and as a result the learning curve is very good , once 1 or 2 years of experience is attained they move up the food chain . It also helps keep insurance rates down for the rest of us who are responsible . fwiw Yes, YOU GET IT, this was exactly my point.

[Fatboy 18]

Never... WOW, So from your perspective, honestly, how did you find it, any tricky moments?

[SA Heat]

We Americans undoubtedly have superior drivers compared to the rest of the world.....not even an argument. We can drive AND talk on the phone, text, Facebook, Twitter, apply make-up, eat, drink, and read sh*t like newspapers without killing more than a few thousand people per year.

[LifeIsGood]

That's 30,000 to 40,000 per year in the US.

[NSamX]

Sadly all the posts are true.

Here is a little more insight into the sad story.

The car was traded into Coral Springs Audi, the car did have modifications that the dealer was not aware of. Doug Levin called me and thought it would be a good car for me to purchase (I am a local car dealer). I tried to reach a deal with Coral Springs but when we finally agreed on a price the dealer tacked on $799 for the dealer fee so I passed on the car.

The car was sold the next day (for $2500 more then I was going to pay) to a gentleman from Brazil, he was not aware of the car, nor the power, in fact he was so unhappy with the car that he called the dealer and asked if he could sell them the car back for less then he paid, they would not buy the car back.

Subsequently he loaned the car to his brother and the ensuing terrible accident occurred. The accident was so severe that a trauma team was called out and the driver lost his legs, this was the only way he could be removed from the Viper.

Very sad story, I wish him a speedy recovery.

Sam

[72hemi]

Wow that is incredibly tragic, any update on the drivers condition?

[ViperJon]

Jesus that's a tragic story.

[Space Truckin]

Wow, incredibly tragic. :confused::rolleyes:

[TitleMine]

Yeah, once a week maybe? I would love to see some statistics of how many wrecks per car out there. Has to be one of the highest ratios per/car/mile considering these cars rarely get driven. I hope he's okay!

And that, right there, is why they get wrecked. The amount of time you've had the car sitting in your garage means nothing compared to your seat time. Would you trust a sniper who has owned a rifle for 25 years but only gone to the range twice? It's the same way with Viper owners-If you think you can take a 700HP supercharged car you rarely/never drive to 10/10ths on a whim after puttering around the mall in your Honda Pilot all week, you're going to straight-up die.

[Space Truckin]

:t1236:

[viper_eddie]

I have read some bad stories on forums before but this one might be the worst. So incredibly tragic.

[Doug Levin Motorsports]

Guys, I'll call his brother tomorrow and hopefully provide an update on his condition.


Best regards,
Doug Levin

[Doug Levin Motorsports]

Sadly all the posts are true.

Here is a little more insight into the sad story.

The car was traded into Coral Springs Audi, the car did have modifications that the dealer was not aware of. Doug Levin called me and thought it would be a good car for me to purchase (I am a local car dealer). I tried to reach a deal with Coral Springs but when we finally agreed on a price the dealer tacked on $799 for the dealer fee so I passed on the car.

The car was sold the next day (for $2500 more then I was going to pay) to a gentleman from Brazil, he was not aware of the car, nor the power, in fact he was so unhappy with the car that he called the dealer and asked if he could sell them the car back for less then he paid, they would not buy the car back.

Subsequently he loaned the car to his brother and the ensuing terrible accident occurred. The accident was so severe that a trauma team was called out and the driver lost his legs, this was the only way he could be removed from the Viper.

Very sad story, I wish him a speedy recovery.

Sam Hi Sam, actually the dealer knew about the modifications and the horsepower the car made, they just weren't aware of how much money was invested in the vehicle; I went over the details with several of their salesman as well as the sales manager.

Best regards,
Doug Levin

[Sybil TF]

WOW, So from your perspective, honestly, how did you find it, any tricky moments? I really don't see what the big deal is. Mine is slightly modded with 3:73's which it feels like a rocket when you floor it but many said make sure the wheel is straight if you floor and so I listened. I wouldn't dare get stupid on a crap road or bad road conditions. I did buy new tires when I found out the original ones where what it had(previous owner kinda fibbed). What a difference. It sticks like glue to the road now

[Fatboy 18]

I really don't see what the big deal is. Mine is slightly modded with 3:73's which it feels like a rocket when you floor it but many said make sure the wheel is straight if you floor and so I listened. I wouldn't dare get stupid on a crap road or bad road conditions. I did buy new tires when I found out the original ones where what it had(previous owner kinda fibbed). What a difference. It sticks like glue to the road now What Im talking about is shifting and Clutch control, Tried doing a Hill start using Handbrake getting the clutch bite just right so the car does not roll backwards? Short shifting, long shifting up to the redline are you using the stock shifter or an aftermarket one?
Ive been using manuals pretty much my whole driving career but I found the Viper gearbox shift gate a bitch after my smooth T5 box I had in the Cobra.

I now use a Hurst Shifter, its better but not great. and I still have to make sure i'm in the correct gear before lifting the pedal, I believe there have been many written off vipers because of people pulling the stick back thinking they were going into 4th at speed and hitting 2nd gear, which results in the rear end locking up and throwing the car into the nearest pole or Deer ;)

Good for you if you managed it OK and have never had a problem, Im Impressed, but being totally honest its caught me out many times including on track, lucky I had a fast reaction and dumped the clutch pedal down quick!

[Sybil TF]

What Im talking about is shifting and Clutch control, Tried doing a Hill start using Handbrake getting the clutch bite just right so the car does not roll backwards? Short shifting, long shifting up to the redline are you using the stock shifter or an aftermarket one?
Ive been using manuals pretty much my whole driving career but I found the Viper gearbox shift gate a bitch after my smooth T5 box I had in the Cobra.

I now use a Hurst Shifter, its better but not great. and I still have to make sure i'm in the correct gear before lifting the pedal, I believe there have been many written off vipers because of people pulling the stick back thinking they were going into 4th at speed and hitting 2nd gear, which results in the rear end locking up and throwing the car into the nearest pole or Deer ;)

Good for you if you managed it OK and have never had a problem, Im Impressed, but being totally honest its caught me out many times including on track, lucky I had a fast reaction and dumped the clutch pedal down quick!

Well, I just drive mine with an occasional get on it on the highway. Yes it is a hard shifting gate for sure. I won't be competing in any races lol. I let my slave run it hard once in a while with the agreement that if he breaks it he buys it lol. He ran it once against his buds 2007 ZO6. Smoked it and the vette broke a valve which may or may not been a factor at the end of the race but.....oh well:smilielol:

[Space Truckin]

What Im talking about is shifting and Clutch control, Tried doing a Hill start using Handbrake getting the clutch bite just right so the car does not roll backwards? Short shifting, long shifting up to the redline are you using the stock shifter or an aftermarket one?
Ive been using manuals pretty much my whole driving career but I found the Viper gearbox shift gate a bitch after my smooth T5 box I had in the Cobra.

I now use a Hurst Shifter, its better but not great. and I still have to make sure i'm in the correct gear before lifting the pedal, I believe there have been many written off vipers because of people pulling the stick back thinking they were going into 4th at speed and hitting 2nd gear, which results in the rear end locking up and throwing the car into the nearest pole or Deer ;)

Good for you if you managed it OK and have never had a problem, Im Impressed, but being totally honest its caught me out many times including on track, lucky I had a fast reaction and dumped the clutch pedal down quick!

"The car was sold the next day (for $2500 more then I was going to pay) to a gentleman from Brazil, he was not aware of the car, nor the power, in fact he was so unhappy with the car that he called the dealer and asked if he could sell them the car back for less then he paid, they would not buy the car back

Subsequently he loaned the car to his brother and the ensuing terrible accident occurred"


I really think what you are driving at is personal responsibility/ accountability (no pun intended). Your passive aggressive stance of questioning members here if they knew/ know how to drive a stick or their driving skills prior to buying a Viper is off topic (please see "gentleman from Brazil, he was not aware of the car, nor the power"). Who buys a car of this caliber, this way?? Hell the same thing just happened with a 700hp Hellcat in Colorado. In the end a very tragic ending. JM2C :United_States:

[Fatboy 18]

Sorry if my posts came over as aggressive, they certainly were not intended that way, I apologize if anyone was / is offended :(

I will leave it there by wishing the Driver a Speedy Recovery

[Matt Dillon]

That is just Horrible! And i can't imagine how the brother that let him drive it is feeling. I remember when i first got mine, all you ever heard about on these forums is how Easy these cars could get away from you & the #1 thing to do if it had older tires on it was to get New ones on it right away. My car was 10 yrs. old & it still had the OEM tires on it but they looked Brand New (only 8k miles on them) & i'll never forget that one day when i was in it by myself & out on an open road (no ditches, no mail boxes, no on coming cars) & i decided to see for myself & as soon as i got on it, the car did a complete end around & i was looking in the opposite direction & it all happened in a Split Second. Ever since then i've respected the car more than any other i've ever had (& i've had some fast ones). But, that was the first time i'd ever had one do that to me like it did. Needless to say the Next Day i bought New tires & it Really was like Night & Day Difference in the Traction. Keep this guy & his Family in your Prayers!

[SA Heat]

Anyone can go buy a variety of stock sport bikes with horsepower-to-weight ratios that make even modified Vipers look like a Prius. You don't even need to prove you have a motorcycle license to buy one. Here in San Antonio we recently had a kid who bought one unlicensed and with zero experience....and though the dealership tried to talk him out riding away on it without taking a class first, he rode it out onto the freeway access road with his mother following in a car. About 1/4 mile down the road he crashed and was killed.

[viper_eddie]

Sorry if my posts came over as aggressive, they certainly were not intended that way, I apologize if anyone was / is offended :(

I will leave it there by wishing the Driver a Speedy Recovery

Didn't come across as offensive to me but rather as an honest question. If the first manual car you drive is a Viper you're almost guaranteed to get in some trouble.

First Viper I drove was a rented 2001 and when getting on the freeway I managed to somehow shit from 2 to 1 instead of 3rd gear; luckily I caught it midway and dumped the clutch. Luckily also for me the gearing is long in the car so you can do that.


Anyone can go buy a variety of stock sport bikes with horsepower-to-weight ratios that make even modified Vipers look like a Prius. You don't even need to prove you have a motorcycle license to buy one. Here in San Antonio we recently had a kid who bought one unlicensed and with zero experience....and though the dealership tried to talk him out riding away on it without taking a class first, he rode it out onto the freeway access road with his mother following in a car. About 1/4 mile down the road he crashed and was killed.

Wow...good parenting there! Very tragic but these things command respect.

[Fatboy 18]

Anyone can go buy a variety of stock sport bikes with horsepower-to-weight ratios that make even modified Vipers look like a Prius. You don't even need to prove you have a motorcycle license to buy one. Here in San Antonio we recently had a kid who bought one unlicensed and with zero experience....and though the dealership tried to talk him out riding away on it without taking a class first, he rode it out onto the freeway access road with his mother following in a car. About 1/4 mile down the road he crashed and was killed.OMG! Wonder how his mother must have felt after seeing that :( Terrible :(

[Vprbite]

Survivor guilt is a real thing and effects people in profound and intense ways. As some of you know, I survived something eerily similar to this gentleman and I used to think all the time about how hard it must be on the people who loved me. Of course it wasn't their fault or anything like that. But the same people who were my biggest fans of me getting my car and achieving that dream are the ones who are hardest on themselves. They wonder if they could have done anything to prevent it. They wonder if they can do anything to help me, no matter what kind of sacrifice it requires on their part. They would do it if possible. The people around the one involved in the wreck often blame themselves and feel powerless to help. That is a terrible feeling.

It is important to remember this person and his whole family and friends are experiencing this trauma too. I hope he and those around him know how much he has people pulling for him.

[James430]

Really! That's got to be worrying :( Respecting the power in a stock viper is hard enough, then add another few hundred HP and a young inexperienced or older driver (used to a Corvette auto) could be allowed to drive off down the road without any formal training on clutch control and shifting has to be a recipe for impending disaster! No wonder so many cars end up like this!


I resemble that older driver part ......The Big HP just makes it more fun!!����.....But to any new Viper owners no matter how old or experienced you are keep those front tires straight before you muscle it and No Wet roads.....I hope a speedy recovery to the person in this car...