Long Term Collectibility?

[72hemi]

Alright this should be a fun discussion. Which Vipers do you think will be the most valuable/collectible in the long term (where talking decades out)? My votes are for (in no particular order):


96 b/w GTS (because who doesn't want a b/w GTS)
96 w/b GTS (because only 3 were made for execs at Chrysler)
92 RT/10 (because it is the first year)
98 GT-2 (because they still command a serious premium)
Red with gold wheels GTS (not many produced and a lot of them have lost their original wheels)
Sapphire Blue ACR with original shocks and paint (low production, shock leak issue, and paint issues)
Gen IV ACR 2nd trip to the ring editions (rare dealer model)
Fitzgerald Motorsports Shelby Vipers (extremely low production)
GTSR with race pedigree

[ACRucrazy]

Shelby GTS
ACR convertibles
ACR RT/10
ACR-X
Hardcore optioned ACRs (hey, I'm partial) :P

[72hemi]

There was an ACR RT/10?

[ACRucrazy]

1. It was grey if I recall.

[Coloviper]

It was Graphite Grey or Steel Grey with black BBS rims.

[daytonprowler]

Ketchup and Mustard

[BlknBlu]

any rare color combos i would think have a chance.

6 2008 GTS Blue with Black Stripe Coupes
2 2009 GTS Blue with Black Stripe ACR's
1 2010 GTS BLue with Black Stripe ACR's

Bruce

[Viper vince]

The 1:33 s and the Vooodoo's

[Bill Pemberton]

May be biased , but believe the Woodhouse/Factory Built ACR Convertibles will be at the top. Only 20 ever built, and in 4 colors, but a build sheet with a specific code, window sticker showing a special model and all factory listed , means this is the lowest production true Dodge Viper model.

[Coloviper]

There are two here in Colorado (10%) with VOA members Bill, but you already knew that. :) They are an awesome beast.

[Viper Red]

My 1993 RT/10 with 5000 miles.
Hey, I'm biased okay! LOL

[Drummerviper]

Typically dealer associated cars like Fitz and others don't create long lasting value in the car market. There have been a few exceptions.

Long after we are gone the first year cars that are left, should bring good value. Look at 53 Vettes-- similar production, etc and go big. But, 54s go all day at. $75k--I suspect 94s with much higher production (like 54s) will not do much.

I have a low number 92 with a pretty good story to tell, and I suspect it would not bring big money for some time, but who knows?

[LeadfootRT10]

Copperhead Coupes?

[rw99]

I've seen a sapphire blue ACR just about everywhere I go, John. Must be a dime a dozen ;)

[rw99]

Ketchup and Mustard

Ronald McDonald :rolleyes:

[Bugman Jeff]

With only 53 made, the B/W RT/10s are exceptionally rare.

[Glen97]

I've seen a sapphire blue ACR just about everywhere I go, John. Must be a dime a dozen ;)

Now that is some funny stuff right there! Mine won't I drive them to much.

[Troublemaker]

Ronald McDonald :rolleyes:

The McViper.

[Granger73]

Where are all of the 86 Malcolm Konner Vettes? IMHO, the number one factor will always be performance. Factory performance cars will top the list. Rarity is surely the other major factor. Rarity in and of itself does not always mean collectible. There was no big line waiting to buy the yellow convertible with green upholstery. Special color combos seldom gain collector status.
Firsts and lasts often do well. The 92's and the 96 GTS will eventually bring good money. Also the performance of the car when compared to its contemporaries is an additional factor.
Tough to predict, but I think eventually the GT-2, the comp coupes and ACR's will lead the pack.

[Fatboy 18]

Not seeing the Woodhouse / Autoform 91 cars on that list? to celebrate the 2000 Rolex Daytona win

Think there were a total of 11 made! 2 are in the UK. :)

[bluesrt]

acr convertables and acr-x cars, 2010 acr cars

[AutoformSteve]

I may be biased as well...but don't rule out the 11 Autoform/Woodhouse Daytonas...seems the GTSRs with the Classic Red and White livery will always be recognized as Viper.

5653

[herbbone]

With only 53 made, the B/W RT/10s are exceptionally rare.

I have been lucky snuff to be around one. Would love to get a close opposite to mine. Rare car.

[sparkrn]

2002 blue Acr. There is only one! 2002 FE ACR 34 made

[daytonprowler]

Typically dealer associated cars like Fitz and others don't create long lasting value in the car market. There have been a few exceptions.

Long after we are gone the first year cars that are left, should bring good value. Look at 53 Vettes-- similar production, etc and go big. But, 54s go all day at. $75k--I suspect 94s with much higher production (like 54s) will not do much.

I have a low number 92 with a pretty good story to tell, and I suspect it would not bring big money for some time, but who knows?

Drummerviper has hit the nail on the head. Look at his signature.... in addition to his remarkable current stable he has had many Vipers. But look at which one he kept, the '92.

I wanted a '92, but could not get one, so I got a '93.

The first is always the best......

[Drummerviper]

Thanks.

One thing Dodge did to their detriment, IMO, was come out with way too many "limited editions". It typically happened when sales were slow and I got sucked into almost every one including the infamous "Final 50 2010 Ed" . Sold each at a loss. My decision. Not complaining .

I am not an ACR expert, so aside from those I would say the early 92, 96 and 98 GTS- R would be what our grandchildren would see at auction bringing decent money. It will take some time. Right now the only appreciation I am seeing in a major way is the Heritage GT. :)

[Granger73]

I don't think there's a 53 that has broken the $1,000,000 mark. There must be 30-40 L88's, grand sports, and factory Vette race cars that have broken the 1 million dollar mark. I believe the most recent was a 67L88 going for @ 3.5 million.

[CarolinaViper]

Damn, So my 2004 silver 1 of 400+ won't be a collectible...guess I give it to my granddaughter if she promises to take care of me in my old age.

[SSGNRDZ_28]

I agree with Drummer, It has always seemed strange to me that some of the various special/limited editions are the most common cars out there since the Viper is such a low volume seller.

[RedTanRT/10]

Thanks.

One thing Dodge did to their detriment, IMO, was come out with way too many "limited editions". It typically happened when sales were slow and I got sucked into almost every one including the infamous "Final 50 2010 Ed" . Sold each at a loss. My decision. Not complaining .

I am not an ACR expert, so aside from those I would say the early 92, 96 and 98 GTS- R would be what our grandchildren would see at auction bringing decent money. It will take some time. Right now the only appreciation I am seeing in a major way is the Heritage GT. :)


Yeah, those are the ones, plus the winged ACR's

'92's get dragged down since '93's and '94's look the same, '96 B/W is classic viper, '98 is the only viper that can sell for more than orginal list today.

I'l add one that folks can dismiss, the Hennesey cars with documents in mint condtion will be like the Yenko's and original Baldwin Motion cars are to chevy's

[Matt M, Pa]

One thing is for sure...we're all guessing.

What I think will be the most collectible are the clean, no excuses, unmodified cars. Rarity may play a part....but rare doesn't always mean desirable.

Odd side note. I see a local guy with a '93 at the shows. Super nice guy...really into his car. It's had a set of the polished wheels like a '96-'98 GTS that he honestly believes were available and an option in 1993. Last time I saw the car, the wheels are now yellow and there are emblems placed similar to the McViper on the sides of the hood. (Except, they're Striker logos.) He wants it to look like a "french fries and ketchup" model. I replied..."like a '96"...and he says..."you could get that in '93". Again... a really nice guy who's really into his car....I'd never argue with him about this.

The point is...there is alot of misinformation about Vipers on the street...so I can only imagine what a dealer or seller would present in the future about rarity, etc.

[Bugman Jeff]

I think for the collector, the '96 GTS will always be worth more than the '92 RT/10, particularly in b/w. While the RT is the original, the b/w GTS is the American sports car of the 90's. Like the Corvettes, I think the later and more refined car will command a better price.

[Bill Pemberton]

The Market for the 92s and maybe early 93s, likely will mirror the 53/54 Vettes , when more and more folks have a Generation Collection but are missing the early years. The Gen 1 market has been in the doldrums for 10 years , but just like the Corvette, I too believe their time will come, since there are relatively few models and they are the beginning machines from the snake pit.

The Woodhouse/ACR Convertible is not a Dealer marque built car though, being a pure . 100% factory built car with it's own designation, factory wind tunnel testing ( Dodge built a specific wing for this car ), chassis testing to figure out dynamics with the difference in aerodynamics and load going to a convertible from a Coupe. With it's own code , full listing as model in Chrysler's data bank and options list, full window sticker showing listing as a Dodge distinct model , etc. quite a few Dodge executives have told us in personal confidence that they believe it could be the most valuable Viper ever built!

The 97 RT-10s in B/W also are up on the list, as they rarely come to market and most are squirreled away in private collections.

There were only 10 Daytona Coupes ever built, authorized by Daytona International Speedway, built by Autoform and sold by Woodhouse. Bernie Katz had a 1997 that was built as a prototype and was used to convince Daytona to do the project. It was different to a degree from the final vehicles, but it was instrumental in getting the car approved by the track. This is why many come up with the number 11 of Daytona Commemorative models -- and yes, two are in Jolly Olde England!!

The chances to pick up a 92 and 93 are likely dwindling fast , but many collectors I am acquainted with think there will be just a few more years at best to pick up one reasonably, and then the numbers will just disappear as more are acquired , and the value will skyrocket. I have to say the only non scientific example I can give is that we rarely get any calls at all for Gen 1s, but when we do , almost all of them are inquiring about a 92, or 93 ( antenna ) Snake.

The 96 B/W will stay strong throughout the years , as proof is in the comments listed, requests for the model at many Dealerships, and the fact that even though the 97 B/W is a much better car, the 96 holds sway with almost all those interested.

The coming years will tell , and if another ACR is ever built, many wonder what the Gen IV ACRs will do value wise?

[Policy Limits]

I heard on the radio randomly that historically the first or last numbered car in a limited numbered edition held the most value. Ultimately value is whatever someone will pay for it. I'm no collector and I buy a new toy every couple of years on average. Right now the Ford GT appears to be a potential long term big money maker. I blew a good opportunity on one some years back. Heritage is even bigger; gonna be seven figures generations from now. The biggest regret is the Dino I turned down for 50 grand that is now worth, well, lets not even talk about it. Ugh.

I think gen V will be it for this brand with no gen VI. If that happens rare vipers like drummer's and the ACR verts etc might climb. There's just something about the fact that production stops and money can't buy more that can drive up value I guess.

But I'll keep getting new cool different toys anyway as variety is the spice of life.

[Drummerviper]

Damn, missed it by one number, then.

[GBS]

Any 2002, the last of the greatest looking viper! :o

[Viper Red]

Thanks.

One thing Dodge did to their detriment, IMO, was come out with way too many "limited editions". It typically happened when sales were slow and I got sucked into almost every one including the infamous "Final 50 2010 Ed" . Sold each at a loss. My decision. Not complaining .

I am not an ACR expert, so aside from those I would say the early 92, 96 and 98 GTS- R would be what our grandchildren would see at auction bringing decent money. It will take some time. Right now the only appreciation I am seeing in a major way is the Heritage GT. :)

Porsche are doing it now. With their 997 range and now spilling in to the 991 range.

[72hemi]

Great discussions everyone! It will be interesting to see how Viper values change over the coming years.

[Luisv]

I may be biased as well... the Classic Red and White livery will always be recognized as Viper.



Any 2002, the last of the greatest looking viper! :o



I could not agree more! ;-)

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/s363/luisv001/Viper/Misc%20Viper%20Shots/PBL_130201_PBL6272_zpsda41400d.jpg

[Viper Red]

You're biased and damn right!

[Nine Ball]

Someone else mentioned it earlier, but I'll repeat. Rarity doesn't mean the same thing as desirability. Some may have that 1-of-1 build, but if the color/option combo isn't desirable, it doesn't really matter. Collector cars need both rarity, and desirability. The factory special editions and race cars will certainly be the cars sought out later, when we are all dead.

[ACRucrazy]

What may be desirable now may not be as in 30 years. What isn't now may be in 30 years. It's funny, when someone can't have something it often becomes more desirable.

[Bugman Jeff]

Rarity doesn't mean the same thing as desirability.
Exactly. Often, rare cars are rare because no one wanted them in the first place. The biggest thing that could drive up the price of all the various "limited editions" is the absurdity of Mopar collectors(you know, the guys who think a 'Cuda is worth $3 Mil because it's got the Winkydoodle modulator with the Dodad shift).

[Big Miata]

THEY ARENT GONNA BE WORTH JACK WITH PEOPLE SELLING THEM SO CHEAP. It is up to the sellers to hold til they get the price the cars are worth.

[Anonymous]

Jeff do you know where I can buy a Cuda w/ a winkydoodle modulator I've been looking fo a long time!!!Haha

[Chorps]

Does it really matter what they'll be worth in 10, 20 or 30 years? I say enjoy it now, put your investment dollars into your investments and your play money into your toys. Conflating the two seems get people all wound up.

The conundrum with it is that if everyone thinks they'll be worth big dollars, none of them will ever be because there will be too many on the market in pristine condition. The price should get lower and the car should be worth less and less, so people wind up driving them and not collect them. Then the survivors in collector's condition will then be worth more, or ones with provenance and desirability.

I have a friend who thinks his 2002 FE is going to be a collector's piece. It may well be, eventually. I drive my viper without worrying about miles and (I'm being serious) he didn't even know how to open the damn hood. When we're both 80 at least I can say that I really drove my car and it brought me smiles...money isn't everything.

GT2, convertible ACR, 96GTS, Comp coupe, ACRX, GT3R, possibly TA, 92... those will be worth something. The rest of them will be great older cars but it will take even longer for those to appreciate. Too many collectors nowadays to make headway on cars that are made non limited production/years.

[VoodooRob]

Problem with the Viper is it is a very low production vehicle...any color any year low numbers. So a 1 of 1 may sound sweet and it may be special to a particular owner, the car has to be on the highly sought after list to start climbing in value. Viper just hasn't made it there yet, the open market just hasn't latched onto the car like the Corvettes. That's not a bad thing, I enjoy the car and feel at the current pricing it is not far out of reach for people who desire what the Viper is.

[ACRucrazy]

Does it really matter what they'll be worth in 10, 20 or 30 years? I say enjoy it now, put your investment dollars into your investments and your play money into your toys. Conflating the two seems get people all wound up.

The conundrum with it is that if everyone thinks they'll be worth big dollars, none of them will ever be because there will be too many on the market in pristine condition. The price should get lower and the car should be worth less and less, so people wind up driving them and not collect them. Then the survivors in collector's condition will then be worth more, or ones with provenance and desirability.

I have a friend who thinks his 2002 FE is going to be a collector's piece. It may well be, eventually. I drive my viper without worrying about miles and (I'm being serious) he didn't even know how to open the damn hood. When we're both 80 at least I can say that I really drove my car and it brought me smiles...money isn't everything.

GT2, convertible ACR, 96GTS, Comp coupe, ACRX, GT3R, possibly TA, 92... those will be worth something. The rest of them will be great older cars but it will take even longer for those to appreciate. Too many collectors nowadays to make headway on cars that are made non limited production/years.

Agreed. Mine is not a garage queen. Would rather die knowing I enjoyed living my dream.

[72hemi]

Does it really matter what they'll be worth in 10, 20 or 30 years? I say enjoy it now, put your investment dollars into your investments and your play money into your toys. Conflating the two seems get people all wound up.

The conundrum with it is that if everyone thinks they'll be worth big dollars, none of them will ever be because there will be too many on the market in pristine condition. The price should get lower and the car should be worth less and less, so people wind up driving them and not collect them. Then the survivors in collector's condition will then be worth more, or ones with provenance and desirability.

I have a friend who thinks his 2002 FE is going to be a collector's piece. It may well be, eventually. I drive my viper without worrying about miles and (I'm being serious) he didn't even know how to open the damn hood. When we're both 80 at least I can say that I really drove my car and it brought me smiles...money isn't everything.

GT2, convertible ACR, 96GTS, Comp coupe, ACRX, GT3R, possibly TA, 92... those will be worth something. The rest of them will be great older cars but it will take even longer for those to appreciate. Too many collectors nowadays to make headway on cars that are made non limited production/years.

Sorry but I thought it would be a fun subject to ponder, and for most who have responded it has been. I don't plan on ever selling my Viper and really don't care how much it is worth and it is definitely not a garage queen as I have over 90,000 miles on it.

[Chorps]

Sorry but I thought it would be a fun subject to ponder, and for most who have responded it has been. I don't plan on ever selling my Viper and really don't care how much it is worth and it is definitely not a garage queen as I have over 90,000 miles on it.

No need to apologize, you're not Canadian. :lol2::Canada:

[72hemi]

I may need to apologize more, I'm a Californian :D

[Luisv]

i mentioned this on another similar thread....

I drive the car. I modify to make it better.....for me. I don't what the future will hold for it, maybe a rebuilt engine, more power, better suspension, etc.

In the end, I'll enjoy the car and know that it depreciates less than a Vette** of the same year. So at the end of the day, if it holds more of it's value and I have a blast driving it.... I can care less if it's going to be worth more in 30 years than another GTS. I am happy though that it does not lose so much of its value.... in the end, the rarity of the cars in general helps this...

(** Assuming Current KBB Values vs. MSRP when new, 40K miles, Z06 Vette)

[Newport Viper]

Best looking Viper ever.

http://www.fotosdecarros.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/25/01/1996-Dodge-Viper-GTS-at-Dusk-Blue-lfvr.jpg

[BAD BOYZZ GARAGE]

Hopefully my ACR will hold its value, after all it was one of the first Ring Machines (7.22).. Back in the day it was a pretty awesome factory club racer!!

http://i1331.photobucket.com/albums/w587/BADBOYZZGARAGE1/BBG%20Ohlins%20Race%20Dampers/5ea54ae18bfb0f78986229c6665cdd67_zpsc5a778e0.jpg

http://i1331.photobucket.com/albums/w587/BADBOYZZGARAGE1/BBG%20Ohlins%20Race%20Dampers/daa7423bfb193e79d7233bbe493c722c_zps503dc11c.jpg

http://i1331.photobucket.com/albums/w587/BADBOYZZGARAGE1/BBG%20Ohlins%20Race%20Dampers/606bdb9b4794af95934f905bf8a87eea_zpsec850a98.jpg

[Granger73]

Winner, winner. Chicken dinner.

[Russ Oasis]

I think that Vipers that are the result of aftermarket mods are not as collectible as more rare factory versions. For me, the most collectible Vipers are 1) the 1992 RT-10 (the first car) 2) The 1993 antenna cars 3) The 1996 GTS 4) The 1998 GT-2
5) The 2010 ACR 1:33 6) An unmolested ACR-X 7) an unmolested Comp Coupe Just my .02

[Sybil TF]

Best looking Viper ever.

http://www.fotosdecarros.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/25/01/1996-Dodge-Viper-GTS-at-Dusk-Blue-lfvr.jpg

Absolutely!!

[2010.Blue.White.ACR]

Here is what I got from a viper engineer on the 2010 blue and whites in a letter.

Mike:

Congrats on your new ACR!

Attached is the official document we made here at Chrysler to chronicle the 2010 Model Year Viper builds. Hopefully this gets you what you need.

Another note on your car is that the 2010 blue and white cars with the tapered stripes are the most rare of any of the blue/white generations (1996, 1997, 2006, 2010 and 2013). And it's the only generation that had a blue and white ACR produced from the factory.

Enjoy your car!

Mike

[RT SERPENT]

It wasn't that long ago that one could buy a vette in "good" condition for around $7k.
Even those have now jumped up…. and they make hundreds of thousands of them. (million plus actually, but who cares.)

Any Viper will be a collectible. Some more than others. Just have patience my friends.:dude3:

[dadstoy]

well my 2006 may not be a collectable but it is a special car to my family.

For me, that is all that matters.

[ohlarikd]

I always thought older cars like Challengers and Cudas were now expensive since most rotted away or were crushed. No one thought back then that they would be worth anything, or that pollution controls would kill the entire market for many, many years. For Vipers, since Day 1 people thought they were collectable, and ironically may hurt value in the future since they are almost ALL still around in pretty good shape.

On the other hand, nobody can make any sense of what has value in the future... just watch Mecum, etc., and all kinds of crazy things happen. Even the 'not desirable' cars have become in fashion, and now UN-restored examples are going for more than the restored ones!

[Bugman Jeff]

On the other hand, nobody can make any sense of what has value in the future... just watch Mecum, etc., and all kinds of crazy things happen. Even the 'not desirable' cars have become in fashion, and now UN-restored examples are going for more than the restored ones!

Case in point: I was at a big name auction a few weeks ago and saw an 80's Cavalier sell for over $7K. Low miles, mint condition convertible, but still just a Cavalier! $7K! Auto collectors are a fickle bunch...

[Sybil TF]

It wasn't that long ago that one could buy a vette in "good" condition for around $7k.

No such thing as a good vette......

[Newport Viper]

Absolutely!!

I'm still waiting on someone to comment on the side pipes...no one caught it ;). Jon B will bring you to speed on the HISSSSSSSSSSSSTORY




http://autolibra.com/images/dodge-viper-gts-1996-2002-06.jpg

[Thawk97]

RT style side pipe GTS wow - beautiful

[72hemi]

I'm still waiting on someone to comment on the side pipes...no one caught it ;). Jon B will bring you to speed on the HISSSSSSSSSSSSTORY




http://autolibra.com/images/dodge-viper-gts-1996-2002-06.jpg

I caught it, but I didn't comment because that is the concept car for the GTS coupe. There were several differences between the concept car and the production car, like the front fascia, wheels and third brake light.

[daveg]

No such thing as a good vette......Not true. I can put you in a 69 convertible that will change your mind.