michelin pilot sport 4s [Archive] - Viper Owners Association

blingnoring

03-14-2023, 10:50 PM

still have the original p zero tires on my 14' gts, 20k miles, tread doesn't look too bad but rubber getting close to 10 years, it's definitely time. the car is for street use only, but can get a little crazy on back roads:) i am leaning toward the michelin pilot sport 4s. anybody have these tires? i read very good things about them, but i also drive the car alot in cooler weather, so wondering how much that affects them. any input would be appreciated.

finalleaf

03-15-2023, 02:21 AM

these are my go to tires for every car that see mostly street, they don't take much warm up and probably have one of the best if not the best grip out of all the 300tw tires.

great longevity too.

only downside I see with them is with their tendency to really heat up on track, but not a problem for you

blingnoring

03-15-2023, 09:37 AM

No hemi

03-15-2023, 09:41 AM

Have them on my gen5, they're great all around( they don't hook up as much as i'd like due to my car's hp, but I couldnt find toyo's when I got these), but they sure grip good on spirited mountain drives.

Tunedprt91

03-17-2023, 08:07 AM

Another+1 to the 4S tires as we have them on multiple vehicles.

ViperGeorge

03-17-2023, 09:50 AM

I ran the Michelin 4S tires on my ACR-E for last year's One Lap of America. I liked them. Ok, not as fast as Cups, Kumhos, or Hoosiers but for a street tire pretty darn good. They were also much better in the rain than the PZeros.

ViperPete

03-17-2023, 10:18 AM

They are better than the Pirellis. But worse than the Toyo R888's. I honestly don't love them. Once they wear out ill be going back to the Toyo's. The michelins just dont have "acclerate through a turn" confidence IMO.

Lawineer

03-17-2023, 10:54 AM

It's hard to find a better performance street tire. There's better track tires, but it's hard to find something better that can blend wet, cold, and dry good grip along with good wear and low road noise.
They're kind of the the "go to" max performance street tire for a car that doesn't see track time or any racing.

A lot of these super performance tires like R888R, NT01, Cup2 are straight up death traps below 45 degrees. Below 40 degrees, it's a nightmare. And that's dry. I drove on Cup2s at ~40 degrees exactly once. It went from about 55 to 40 (maybe slightly less) over dinner and a little mist. I am not kidding you, I thought I was going to crash for sure in my C7. I was going with the flow of traffic through onramps and the the tires were letting go. I was trying not to let me my GF know and she noticed how tensely I was driving. I felt like I was driving at the limit at the track, except with no runoff and at 55mph.

I'll be switching to them in the Viper and AMG when my next tire change comes around (1yr for AMG, 17 years for Viper lol).

Also, R888R are my least favorite tires. I dont get the love for them unless you street race.

blingnoring

03-17-2023, 01:53 PM

sounds like the tire for me, i don't track the car and i have no problem taking it out in 30 to 40 degree temps for a joyride. i watched alot of you tube videoes and it's like what Lawineer says, very good street tire in colder weather due to them warming up quicker than other tires but not the best for track because they have a tendancy to get too hot fast.

ForTehNguyen

03-18-2023, 11:27 PM

pzeros sucked when they were new, cant imagine 10 years old. It will be complete night and day with the michelins

Jack B

03-19-2023, 03:14 PM

In a parallel universe, I just bought a 2023 Corolla GR (Toyota's answer to the WRX and VW Gulf). The factory tire is the PS4s or the cup series.

SA Heat

03-19-2023, 03:38 PM

In a parallel universe, I just bought a 2023 Corolla GR (Toyota's answer to the WRX and VW Gulf). The factory tire is the PS4s or the cup series.

How do you like it so far? (the GR)

StrokerAce

03-19-2023, 05:07 PM

A close friend has those tires on his C6Z. They seem great after 3k miles or so.

Jack B

03-19-2023, 09:58 PM

Lawineer

03-20-2023, 11:30 AM

I think you'll really enjoy it. It's *very* different than a viper though.

I have an FT86 as my dedicated track car and I've been doing a lot of sim driving in the GR86 (no FT). The GR seems have a lot of similar characteristics. The most notable one is that it turns in FAST under braking, even very light braking. Like... 10% braking pressure makes a difference. It's very easily to spin the car on brakes. You really need to get the front end settled down under braking, then turn in- which often means start braking earlier and lighter just to get the car settled. And for a car with such little power (relatively), getting on the gas really straightens it out. Reminds me a bit of driving a 911 Turbo. When thinks got sketchy, I'd just hit the gas the AWD would just straighten the car out.

The Viper felt a lot more "normal" under braking. Quite honestly, it it actually felt really stable. I could jab the brakes and turn in right away on kinks without an issue. Light braking didn't do much and it turned in easier under heavy braking, but unless I was really trying, it wasn't going to spin the rear around on me. At least it didn't feel that way. Of course, having an extra 120mm of rubber in the rear will do that. If you add a wing, it would probably be next to impossible absent serious effort.

Bill Pemberton

03-22-2023, 08:26 PM

Since you drive the Viper when it is cool and likely changing weather I would suggest your two solid choices would be the 4S or the Continental Extreme Sport. Both tires are reasonably quiet , solid on a rainy road, and not bad at all when the weather is cooler. I would not recommend the R888R for someone who is driving it often, as it is extremely noisy, lousy in cool weather and very skittish on wet and rainy pavement. You are not tracking the car, so for a good ride, solid life, and some piece of mind in cool or rainy weather, the 4S or Conti Extreme Sport are great choices.

By the way, for those excited to get a set of Extreme Force Contis, it appears from my sources, there is another delay before they hit the ground.

Martin

03-22-2023, 08:48 PM

I'm thinking very hard about getting a set of 4S tires for my ACR-E. I love the Kumho tires when they are brand new, but I don't drive on the track with this car, I don't push the car much at all, but the Kumho tires do feel very greasy if I do push them after a few years.

I'm more worried about the weather around here getting wet and very cold - and the Kumho tires just don't cut it in those conditions. In fact, I've opted out of club days when the outside temperatures were around 37 degrees at my house (even if they're 50 down in town).

Downside is that the 4S tires are 35% more expensive, and it is kind of nice to keep a fresh set of OEM tires on the car - even if I toss them when they're only down about 10% from their "new" treadwear depth.

imzoomintoo

03-22-2023, 10:07 PM

I have them on a TT build, once they warm up they run pretty good. They don't stick as well as R888's but for the street they are a pretty good option.

ForTehNguyen

03-29-2023, 05:21 PM

Michelin is releaseing a Pilot Sport 5 S tire now, but who knows if they will carry viper sizes over to it

https://www.evo.co.uk/news/205791/new-michelin-pilot-sport-s-5-high-performance-tyre-launched

Aevus

03-29-2023, 05:25 PM

probably just 20-21 sizes

blingnoring

04-01-2023, 08:45 AM

FWIW, had the 4s tires installed yesterday and had my alignment checked as well. alignment was a little off so got that adjusted. the drive home was almost 2 hours consisting of highway and backroads.
what i noticed: (temp outside was about 55 degrees)
- tires definitely stickier, kicked up more little rocks when leaving the parking lot
- car felt great on highway and stayed planted when taking the on and off half-circled exits pretty aggressively
- from what i understand, this tire warms up quicker and can get hotter than most. not sure if this is related but with the Pirellis, the tire psi went up 3psi on my drive to the dealership, on my way
back the s4 tires went up 2 psi (32 to 34). i'm sure tracking the car, which i don't, i would expect the psi to get a little higher? it was a cool day so i'm curiuos how much the psi will change in the
hotter summer days

these tires are definetley a softer rubber than the pirellis and i don't expect them to last 10 years, and maybe not 20k miles, but i do feel more confident with them, which is what i wanted.

stradman

04-01-2023, 10:21 AM

I use these on my ACR as a daily now. Much more comfortable than the stock Kumho's and also a bit more confidence inspiring particularly when and if wet. I use slicks on track however if it happens to rain then no problems I'll stick to the PS4s which are actually very good in the rain on track-ok they're not race wets- but still pretty good.

SA Heat

04-01-2023, 11:06 AM

It is supposed to be in next week. It looks like each dealer is getting one car, that seems hard to believe. I did see the US allocation was 2500 units, but, that was dependent on no supply chain hiccups. They are now going over msrp. I got lucky, my dealer got an extra car for the auto show, I took his allocated car.

Nice. I saw one (white in color) for the first time in person in the Toyota vendor display at the NASCAR race at COTA last weekend. I like them even better in person. Neat little car...one would make a nice stablemate for my Evo 8.

Lost me beer

04-02-2023, 09:48 PM

Fwiw I just installed PS4s on my 16 and it is hands down better than the oems. I can actually shift without getting loose now. Very happy with them.
Troy

Jack B

04-03-2023, 12:30 AM

Nice. I saw one (white in color) for the first time in person in the Toyota vendor display at the NASCAR race at COTA last weekend. I like them even better in person. Neat little car...one would make a nice stablemate for my Evo 8.

I have put 150 miles on the car, just getting used to it. One neat feature, is the auto rev match when down shifting. One noticeable difference, the AWD makes the corners seem much easier. Part of that could be the four wheel limited slip. Even on a wet surface, there is little or no slip, the rear seems to follow the front like on a track.

No hemi

04-03-2023, 07:59 AM

Fwiw I just installed PS4s on my 16 and it is hands down better than the oems. I can actually shift without getting loose now. Very happy with them.
Troy

That is when you DRIVE the car... :rolleyes::smileys-car-driving:D

ViperSRT

04-03-2023, 09:59 AM

That is when you DRIVE the car... :rolleyes::smileys-car-driving:D

Definitely good for a laugh! And what about the flat???

No hemi

04-03-2023, 11:07 AM

:rolleyes::D

Lawineer

04-03-2023, 12:58 PM

Definitely good for a laugh! And what about the flat???

I'm genuinely terrified of getting a flat to the point where I won't drive the car more than 20 min away. The car is lowered on coilovers AND has side skirts AND has a diffuser. A low profile jack can barely get under it as it sits (I'm not even sure if it can). If it drops another inch due to a flat, I'm not sure how the heck I get it up in the air.

I need to invent a jack that grabs the car by by the wheels so I can get the car up high enough to get another jack under it, lol.

Space Truckin

04-03-2023, 01:13 PM

I need to invent a jack that grabs the car by by the wheels so I can get the car up high enough to get another jack under it, lol.
No need to invent, already done...:)53125

Lawineer

04-03-2023, 02:00 PM

Lol, if I could get the wheel in that, I wouldn't need it.
I'm talking about a mini fork lift type lift. 8" gap between the forks and 14" deep forks. Obviously, a lot of difficulties with lever arms and making it remotely portable. Probably doesn't exist for a reason.

Hootie

04-03-2023, 09:31 PM

https://youtu.be/lFk0IyHC21s
It lifts the tire. Don’t need to put a tire down onto it.

ViperGeorge

04-03-2023, 10:39 PM

https://youtu.be/lFk0IyHC21s
It lifts the tire. Don’t need to put a tire down onto it.

If you can't get a Harbor Freight jack under the car I'm not sure you could get the tire jacks under the car either.

ViperDrive97

04-04-2023, 10:47 AM

I'm genuinely terrified of getting a flat to the point where I won't drive the car more than 20 min away. The car is lowered on coilovers AND has side skirts AND has a diffuser. A low profile jack can barely get under it as it sits (I'm not even sure if it can). If it drops another inch due to a flat, I'm not sure how the heck I get it up in the air.

I need to invent a jack that grabs the car by by the wheels so I can get the car up high enough to get another jack under it, lol.

Get you one of these! An AC DK13HLQ. I love mine, super low, easy to get replacement parts, and you can go deep with the grab of the lift.

https://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/smart/more_info.cgi?pn=TOL-13HLQ

Lawineer

04-04-2023, 10:49 AM

If you can't get a Harbor Freight jack under the car I'm not sure you could get the tire jacks under the car either.

Yup. There's zero chance that gets under my car. The front wheels definitely don't make it. that's why it needs to be like a mini fork lift.

The front BARELY clears low profile ramps. I got the lowest profile jack I could find (2.75") and I can't get that underneath- it's super close so I only need to go up a piece of plywood. Drop the front another inch due to a flat and I'm not sure what I would do. I have some pieces of lumber in the car I could roll up. I could also jack up the other front corner and hope that gets high enough to lift the opposite side enough to get another jack under there.

Nightmare on the side of the highway for sure.

ViperGeorge

04-04-2023, 12:09 PM

Yup. There's zero chance that gets under my car. The front wheels definitely don't make it. that's why it needs to be like a mini fork lift.

The front BARELY clears low profile ramps. I got the lowest profile jack I could find (2.75") and I can't get that underneath- it's super close so I only need to go up a piece of plywood. Drop the front another inch due to a flat and I'm not sure what I would do. I have some pieces of lumber in the car I could roll up. I could also jack up the other front corner and hope that gets high enough to lift the opposite side enough to get another jack under there.

Nightmare on the side of the highway for sure.

I added the Doug Shelby hocky puck thing to the center rear of the car. Probably could get a jack under it even with a flat. Lift the car and put it down on some pieces of wood then use the normal jacking points.

One other thought. I have, somewhere, a super low profile, billet, scissors jack. It is like 1" thick. I haven't tried it on the Viper but I will.

Lost me beer

04-05-2023, 11:12 PM

April fools! Lol

Inside joke gents.
Troy

ViperSRT

04-05-2023, 11:15 PM

April fools! Lol

Inside joke gents.
Troy

The flat joke is almost as good as Bud Light hiring a trans as their spokesperson. Oh wait ….

Bill Pemberton

04-06-2023, 12:16 PM

Thanks for the post George , Mr. Shelby makes alot of great stuff. Many of us have dug Doug's machinations for over a decade!

ViperSRTMike

05-03-2023, 01:01 PM

Have them on my gen 3, couldn't imagine a better street tire. Also had them on my 2016Z06. Great tires.

ViperGeorge

05-03-2023, 04:22 PM

Have them on my gen 3, couldn't imagine a better street tire. Also had them on my 2016Z06. Great tires.

A local member was complaining about the handling of his 2004 Gen 3. It had Nitto tires on it when he got it. I recommended the Michelin Pilot 4S. He bought them and couldn't believe how different the car behaved. He is very happy now.