Tribute to the death of Orange TA 68

[Jet Slicker]

**UPDATE** Finally settled with insurance for a fair amount so the post and details are going back up as they were. The key is getting them to use fair comparables as they were trying to use base model cars for value comparison. I'm guessing most people on here would probably figure insurance would do that anyways. Insurance wanted $40k for buyback so I turned that down and the car will be at a co-part auction soon enough. Hopefully others can learn from my mistakes.

Hello everybody...
It is with extreme heartbreak and shame that I fight back tears to write this post. On November 15th I totaled my best friend, Orange TA #68. It's taken me a while to actually write about it. I'd rather say something now instead of people seeing it on a tow truck or an auction in the coming months.

First off, I was pretty much entirely unscathed in the wreck and my girlfriend had a sore neck, bruises on her hips, and a laceration on her leg. We are both perfectly fine though.
I've owned the car since April 2017 and put 32k miles on her. I was 23 when I bought the car with my life savings and i've loved it dearly ever since. The car was like a good friend and it has got me through a lot. This car was almost like a part of my personality and I finally have an amazing girlfriend to enjoy the car with me. Check this post out if you're interested in my story of buying the car and driving it home: https://driveviper.com/forums/threads/17883-A-short-tale-of-a-guy-and-his-new-Orange-Viper-TA
**Different girlfriend now**

Anyways, i'm definitely not the best driver but I have track day experience with the car and (not so proudly) lots of fast street driving. On November 14th I drove the car down to South Carolina with my girlfriend to visit a friend. I drove tail of the dragon with the TA in May 2019 and had a blast. I wanted to drive the road again when I was down there. I had a go-pro filming and my friend was cruising with me in his 2002 Trans-Am. It was about 55 degrees out and I had some brand new Pzero Corsa's installed. The road was mostly clear and hardly any traffic; I was driving too fast and too recklessly. After years of fast driving in the Viper and other cars, with no crashes and very few close calls, I thought I was invincible. Deep down I knew that i've been progressing with my confidence and driving too fast on public roads since nothing has knocked me down. No major tickets, no crashes, etc.. I didn't care, nothing has happened before and nothing will happen now, right?

About halfway through the dragon there was a dip in the road that came to a crest with a mild left turn on/after the crest. I was wide open in 2nd, somewhere around the 5800~6000rpm range going through the dip. I didn't realize how tall the crest was until it was too late. I was slightly turning left when I went over the crest (Around 80mph?) and the rear tires lost enough grip to slide and point the car about 45 degrees to the left. I corrected to the right but I was sliding so much and so fast that I experienced hard snap oversteer that was uncorrectable. The car slid hard right and backwards. The entire rear end smashed against a tree when traveling around 70mph and the car bounced up in the air, landed, and then spun 360 degrees before sliding into the ditch and hitting 3 trees on the driver side probably around 40mph. The car was only about 12ft off the road but the ditch went down more than 100ft off the road. The car was also off level to where the passenger side was much higher than the driver side. Traction control was full on the entire drive.

The car was totaled... I knew it. As I was spinning and waiting for the car to hit things, I was waiting to be knocked out and wake up somewhere. It never happened, and I entirely couldn't believe it but I was uninjured and fully functioning. My girlfriend was complaining of stomach pain and her seatbelt was extremely tight. I immediately focused on her and apologized more times than I could count and I still feel like it was not enough. She even told me I was going too fast about 30 seconds before I lost control and my response to her was don't worry, we will be fine. Yes, I know i'm a terrible person.
Driver side airbag was deployed so the cabin was smokey. The horn was on and would not turn off. Bystanders screeching to a stop and car doors slamming as people ran over to check on us. It was a terrible time but I was so glad we were both not seriously injured. Both doors would not open due to being crunched or blocked. I climbed out of my open driver side window and noticed there was a small fire in the engine where the valve cover was cracked. I quickly got my panicked girlfriend out of the car and put the fire out with a water bottle before the situation became much worse.

There was no cell signal so somebody drove off to call 911. Lot of people stopped by to help and I was extremely appreciative. I tended to my girlfriend since we almost just died and I played with our lives like they didn't even matter. She was not in control of the reckless decision I made even though she spoke up and warned me. Then I wanted to mourn the loss of the car but I still couldn't fathom what I just did, and I also knew that mourning wouldn't make the situation any better right now. I had a bunch of tools and other belongings in the trunk that were scattered over hundreds of feet due to the trunk and even rear frame rail being entirely sheared off in the crash. My phone also flew out of the car at some point in the wreck. I spent the next hour and a half looking for my stuff and waiting for police to show up. EMS arrived almost 2 hours after the wreck and police about 3 hours after. The battery on the car had finally died and it was dark out.

The police officer was very nice and helpful and did not end up giving me a ticket since nobody was really injured in the crash. It took 2 tow trucks to pull the car off of the trees and I honestly cried when the bumper and hood were cracking and the car was being sort of ripped apart. The car was towed and I went back a few days later to get my shift knob and DSE catch can that were still good. I was able to get both doors to open, but every other part of the car is smashed in some way. It is amazing how well the car did it's job with protecting us during this violent wreck.

This has been a massive wake up call for me with the dangers of driving fast on public roads. I realize that I was entirely stupid, reckless, and irresponsible. I feel beyond terrible for also putting my girlfriend in danger and wrecking such a nice car. If the first tree I hit had been 4 feet farther towards the front of the car, I think I would be dead. I found some of my tools but lost at least $300 of stuff. Never found my phone either. The go-pro flew off and my girlfriend found it after 3 hours of searching. The wreck is recorded but I am not going to post it. Watching the video makes me anxious and sick to my stomach. I am absolutely going to learn from this and be a better and more responsible person. Insurance has determined the car is a total loss and i'm waiting on a settlement number. I am entirely expecting an offer that is not what the car would have been worth. If that is the case i'll probably make a post asking for advice to get what the car is worth. Insurance company is AAA.

For now i'm going to just take the settlement and mature for a while before buying another fast car. I was attached to my Viper and I don't think another Gen V or any Viper could replace it. It's been a blast everybody and and i'll still hang around the forums. But Orange TA #68 and her journey's across the continent are officially put to rest.

Humbly and shamefully,
- Randy


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[ViperGeorge]

Good Lord. Thankfully you were both ok. Sorry you had to learn this lesson the hardest way possible. The car can ultimately be replaced but you and your girlfriend's life cannot be. Count your blessings that you are still able to write about this and as you've said, learn from it.

[zee]

Damn man - so sorry to hear. I remember chatting with you a few times when you first got it. Happy to hear you both are ok. The TA is a special car but nothing is more special then your life.

[Mark1107]

I wrecked an Orange 2006 Daytona sunset orange metallic C6 Corvette racing someone on a rainy freeway with bald tires. I feel your pain! I was 32 and that car was my identity. For guys the quickest way to get over a heartbreak is to replace it! Buy another viper ASAP! I’m glad you guys are ok!

[SharpMan]

Glad you're both OK. You're lucky. Don't do it again. Delete this thread if you can.

[Loud]

Wow, sorry to hear about the accident, but glad you guys are ok. I second sharpman, delete post until you settle with insurance.

A

[99RT10]

OMG!! You had a guardian angel watching over you two. It is amazing that no one got seriously hurt or killed. Live everyday like it's your last.

[Dman]

Thank goodness you’re both ok, and that’s all that matters. We all live (hopefully, thankfully) and learn. Hope the crash-anxiety passes, something like this could happen to anyone. Take it to heart, be thankful you’re both ok and try to shake it from your head. All the best.

[theviper]

You are lucky to be alive and intact without any major injuries. And you've learned your lesson...something a lot of others fail to do. You are quite young and I've said this for years, this is not a car for younger people. They haven't had enough life experiences and minor mistakes to avoid the major mistakes. Anyway, count your blessings forever. This will change your outlook on life permanently.

[daveg]

Your extremely lucky that both ends of the car was hit and the cockpit was spared. The biggest person I feel bad for is your girlfriend who had no control of the situation. Glad you are both OK and you truly sound remorseful. As stated, cars can be replaced but lives cannot... If I were you I would give your girlfriend a tight hug..

[St Pete Viper ACR E]

Scary stuff and yes it is easy after years of driving fast to forget that all it takes is one slip or one car getting in your way and this can happen.

You were probably also saved from serious injury by hitting the tree rear end first, that top pic is shocking. I know this is a detail but look how the CF X brace fractured.

Finally we need pictures of the new girlfriend.

[capevettes]

Sorry about your car and no reason to beat up on you since it appears you have learned a lesson the hard way. I was a police officer for 30 years and saw many people die in wrecks that didn't look as bad as yours. You were both very fortunate to survive. I have driven the Tail several times. It can get away from you easily on that road. Better to drive at 5/10's than 10/10's and enjoy the drive without endangering your life. Glad you are both OK.

[SSGNRDZ_28]

Glad you are okay and thank you for sharing as a reminder to others! Hope to see you back in a Viper one day.

Doug

[aspman]

damn tore hell outta that beauty!Count your blessings...car did its job keeping you safe...its replaceable.Several folk on here can help you with inshorance claim...good luck!

[Uranium235]

Where's Alex Rebuilds when you need him?

[ViperNC]

That is quite the story and its no small miracle you and your girlfriend came out almost unscathed. The Dragon is no joke. Be thankful, respectful, and smart moving forward as you are getting a 2nd go at life. If the girlfriend sticks around, you might want to marry her!

[Jet Slicker]

Thank you so much for the support everybody. Nothing is more apparent than how lucky we were. I'm so glad I can sit here to write this and that neither of us were even moderately injured. I have absolutely learned an important lesson that I won't forget. If I didn't, then I don't deserve to be in another car anyways.
My girlfriend and I just came back from a week long vacation at Disney in Florida. It was nice to clear my head with something else and focus on getting my life back in order. I'm just so thankful that we were even able to go on this trip after a wreck like we had.

Very thankful to be here,
- Randy and Sam

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[J TNT]

WOW ! Glad to hear you both are ok . And the car is replaceable........

The SRT engineers talked about aluminium frame vs steel frame . And yes the aluminium frame would have saved 50 lbs , it's situations like this were the steel frame is the better choice.......

The Dragon attrition rate is quite high for cars and motorcycles and can be very unforgiving . In some cases it's taken up to 6 hours to get my friends to a hospital......

Track days are really the best place for spirited driving.........

Hope to see you in another Viper .

[Rare Snake]

I have a lot of track video I took that I watch over and over, the rain laps especially show how easily a driver could lose control of one of these cars, even at a lot lower speeds. If you were wide open in 2nd gear, on a public road, I can only imagine how incredibly terrifying your video would be to watch. If you ever decide to share that horrible experience, I promise not to judge you. Putting myself in your shoes, I can hear my wife telling me to slow down, so I can see this happening all too clearly. I've actually had nightmares about pretty much this exact same scenario.

I'm sad to see my favorite Viper hurt, but I am a lot more happy to read that you two are okay, and still together.

Thank you for sharing your story.

Dason

[bluesrt]

glad your ok, allways listen to women when they say your doing something silly, they are usually right. move on we all have done silly stuff,just don't repeat it

[Bruce H.]

Very glad you guys are okay. Sad ending for your time with the car but it sounds like you'll use the experience for the better. This could have happened to probably just about everyone reading your story at one time or another when being foolish, regardless of age or driving experience. I hope you sharing your story will help save others from experiencing something similar, or worse. Like J TNT said, track days are really the best place for spirited driving.

Wishing you the best at putting this all behind you and moving on to a great future, which will hopefully include another great car at some point!

[One Viper Bite]

You are lucky to be alive and intact without any major injuries. And you've learned your lesson...something a lot of others fail to do. You are quite young and I've said this for years, this is not a car for younger people. They haven't had enough life experiences and minor mistakes to avoid the major mistakes. Anyway, count your blessings forever. This will change your outlook on life permanently.

Nothing to do with age. I bought my first Gen V at age 23 as well. It just has to do with experience, and that experience can come at any age.

Randy, I'm so glad you and the lady are ok. As many have stated, the car can be replaced. It takes a lot of guts to admit when you've made a mistake and I commend you for owning that. A hard lesson to learn but better to learn it now. Hope to see you back in a snake soon.

Lastly, agreed that you should delete this thread until you are settled with insurance.

[SLP]

Thank you for sharing and I'm glad you two are okay. As another young person relatively new to high performance cars, this struck a cord.

[Whiskey]

Thanks for sharing the story. I've said this over the years that a Viper is the safest car to crash in. I've personally walked away from a crash into a concrete barrier at the track at 120+ That sent me spinning and bouncing all over the place and only had a sore foot and some bruises from the harness. The Viper was so mangled and totaled to the point people where shocked that I was alive much less get out of the car and kiss it good bye (literally). My other viper wreck was being side swiped by a moron trying to take a pic that sent the car flying off the hwy at 75mph. Still totaled the car as it bent the frame on the passengers side from going over a dead deer! But I still walked away unhurt. Asshole made it a hit and run.

You are lucky, sounds like you have learned a good lesson the hard way (haven't we all for one thing or another).

PS: new girlfriend major upgrade from old girlfriend. :-p

[JonB ~ PartsRack]

NOTE: IF you have any 'open issues' as with law enforcement, property damage, car insurance, or your GF medical, I urge you to remove this post now, and re-post it after any and all open issues are totally resolved.


BEST OF LUCK to you both

[Jet Slicker]

***All details of the crash and my history are being held for confidentiality reasons while the total loss claim is open***

[Jet Slicker]

If the girlfriend sticks around, you might want to marry her!

Very good advice hahaha shes one of a kind! :)


PS: new girlfriend major upgrade from old girlfriend. :-p

Yes!! I entirely agree! The old girlfriend was not this cool or good looking :D

[stradman]

Jesus H Christ! Wow. great opener that first picture! Damn, you sure did total that sucker didn't you! . That definitely won't buff off..

[St Pete Viper ACR E]

PS: new girlfriend major upgrade from old girlfriend. :-p

LOL was going to say that!

You can always upgrade a girl but you can't upgrade from a Viper, you'll have one again soon Randy.

[serpent]

Hopefully OP upgrades common sense.

[Arizona Vipers]

Wow! Glad you guys are ok, that first pic is nuts. There's pretty much nothing salvageable on that car except for a few mechanical things (motor etc)
As fast as I drive on the track I've got a strict policy on the street I never go more than 9mph over the speed limit, no exceptions. Haven't had a ticket in 20 years.

[Martin]

Wow is right. I'm glad you're all OK, and I'm glad it was a single car accident with no injury to anyone else. One of my biggest nightmares in my area is going around a corner and having a bunch of bicyclists riding side-by-side on the blind side of the turn. I can't count how many times I've had one of those butt-puckering moments where I go around the corner and a whole herd of bicyclists are lane-wide on the other side. I've seen more than one bike accident when they all swerve away from oncoming traffic - just to pile into each other.

Good move in removing any details of the incident. When I crashed my old ACR, the insurance company definitely looked through the forums and through YouTube for information. Fortunately, it was a clean crash, if that's even a possibility these days.

[Old School]

The old girlfriend was not this cool or good looking :D

Yes, that's obvious. Wait, can I day that? without sounding like a creep?

[ViperNC]

One of my biggest nightmares in my area is going around a corner and having a bunch of bicyclists riding side-by-side on the blind side of the turn. I can't count how many times I've had one of those butt-puckering moments where I go around the corner and a whole herd of bicyclists are lane-wide on the other side. I've seen more than one bike accident when they all swerve away from oncoming traffic - just to pile into each other.

Off topic - We've got the same issue in NC as well. I used to cycle on the road all the time and its insane how many cyclists don't know the laws for biking on the road. That plus the average driver paying too much attention to their mobile phone these days encouraged me to go back to the woods only and stick to mountain biking. Trust me that your butt puckering moment is nothing compared to the cyclist's butt puckering moment when they see a Viper coming around a corner at speed when they are too close to the center line. Hopefully they learn their lesson.

[ACRSNK]

Glad you are both ok you can always replace the Viper

[Matt Dillon]

WOW, Glad you were Both OK! I Couldn't imagine having a Viper @23, I've always had Fast cars even in HS I had a Vega with a 350 in it with 4.55 gears with 2 fours that ran in the high 10's thru the quarter & it was a Street car but it was No where Near as powerful as a Viper with the HP & Torque, the Torque is what will get you! Do you remember where or which curve you was at when you crashed?

[Whiskey]

It's not that uncommon for young guys to have a Viper...I bough my first one at 22. I'm on Viper #5. I can't stop driving these things! So far, I've only wrecked two of them. I must have over 200,000mi in these cars by now. I'll have to figure it out at some point. I hope not to wreck the Gen5 GTS as it's the most expensive and almost my favorite.

[SharpMan]

It's not that uncommon for young guys to have a Viper...I bough my first one at 22. I'm on Viper #5. I can't stop driving these things! So far, I've only wrecked two of them. I must have over 200,000mi in these cars by now. I'll have to figure it out at some point. I hope not to wreck the Gen5 GTS as it's the most expensive and almost my favorite.

"only" wrecked two of them LOL...

[TheMadMachinist]

Only Wrecked Two of Them................

Whiskey, what would you say the average life expectancy of a Viper is in your neck of the woods. Just wondering?

[JonB ~ PartsRack]

***All details of the crash and my history are being held for confidentiality reasons while the total loss claim is open***


Just say "OK BOOMER"

[commandomatt]

It's not that uncommon for young guys to have a Viper...I bough my first one at 22. I'm on Viper #5. I can't stop driving these things! So far, I've only wrecked two of them. I must have over 200,000mi in these cars by now. I'll have to figure it out at some point. I hope not to wreck the Gen5 GTS as it's the most expensive and almost my favorite.

Only two.........what do you consider above normal ?

If everyone had your record, only 12000 Vipers would be wrecked. Values would definitely go up though.......

[Martin]

Only two.........what do you consider above normal ?

If everyone had your record, only 12000 Vipers would be wrecked. Values would definitely go up though.......

The half-life of these cars is pretty short... Just about everyone I know who has owned one has a story to tell. It is surprising that the crashes haven't led to more price inflation - but I think it's a double-edged sword. There are fewer cars out there every Monday, but the reputation of these cars having a demonic tendency to want to kill everyone around them tends to hold the usual buyers back. I know of a few people that drool over my cars, but they tell me that they would never buy one because they'd probably wrap it around a tree in a month.

[Oh Three Z]

I’m glad that you and your girlfriend came out of that in one piece. While I was reading your post and before I saw the pictures I was envisioning what the car looked like and what rebuild channel it was going to end up on.... then I saw the pics. Wow.

I’m sure you still have some guilt as to what happened but most of us push these cars when the opportunity presents itself and 99.9% of the time there are not consequences similar to yours. Unfortunately for you you were the .01.

I’m guessing that you will come out ahead financially on the claim even with the miles. I wouldn’t beat myself up too much as accidents do happen. Use this as a learning experience and when the time is right jump back on the horse

Good luck

[JonB ~ PartsRack]

G5s are the safest Vipers out there by far.

We bought a stunning % amount of wrecks in G 1 (400HP) up thru year 2000 (450HP) , when ABS cut down on understeer wrecks in 2001+. 505 HP in G3 and 600 HP in G4, with no added safety aids, wrecked a larger %. The G5 nannies are a lot more difficult to lose, unless you minimized your traction controls. Very Few % G5s totalled.....

Slicker dont post it, but what traction mode were you in? Tell us later if anything but Full On.....

{Ask that GM Vette Indy Pace Car exec in MI about switching off traction controls!]

[Whiskey]

Only two.........what do you consider above normal ?

If everyone had your record, only 12000 Vipers would be wrecked. Values would definitely go up though.......


Considering most viper owners will not put more than 20,000mi on them in 10 years. I'd say I'm doing pretty damn good. I basically daily drive my Vipers and go play at the local road race tracks 1-2 times a year...but I visit the drag strip typically once or twice a month. 1 wrecked at the track the other due to being sideswiped by a nincompoop trying to get a pic sending me off the road.


So for everyone entertainment I looked through my old excel spread sheets I had on the cars and this is what I came up with. I keep logs for maintenance when I sell.


2001 GTS ACR (start mileage 223mi ended with 57,875 when I sold it. (Blew motor a 16k rebuild heads/cam/stoker). Driven 57,652mi

2001 GTS RACE CAR start 14,762 end 39,448 (sold)...yea I drove it on the street too a bit.
Driven 24,726

2008 Coupe. Start mileage 2,477mi. Crashed from idiot side swiping me at 66,958
driven 64,481

2003 Vert (Paxton 850rwhp+) 4,588mi. Crashed at the track 46,823.
Driven 42,235mi

2014 GTS start 1,277mi. Had it two weeks and already at 3,145.
Driven 1,868mi

Ok total viper mileage hasn't been 200k. But I'll get there soon enough I'm at about 190,000 give or take a bit. One of these days I'll get the odo over 100,000 if it (and "I") live long enough.

My motto: Miles = Smiles.

I have so many awesome memories who needs therapy....I have a Viper! Life is Good!

[Joshevo22]

Glad to see you guys are ok!! Car can always be replaced. We might be selling our orange heads and cam TA in the spring if interested!!

Also, if the insurance gives you the option to buy it back for cheap I might be interested depending what price is and could throw you couple bucks!

724-713-5794 is my cell!

[Gen5snake]

Take a deep breath and put this behind you....don't think of the what if's. Glad you and the lady walked away.

[TheWessss]

Blessings, glad you had a great time in Florida. Hopefully your post if nothing else is a great reminder of the accountability you have to have for yourself and your passengers when driving these cars on city streets or track. You will find yourself getting the "itch" sooner than later. Maybe just in time for NVE4, you can take your new to you Viper for a swim in the Ocean this time. TO SOON? Just laugh, you are okay, its just a car and can be replaced.

[Jet Slicker]

**UPDATE** Finally settled with insurance for a fair amount so the post and details are back up as they were. The key is getting them to use fair comparables as they were trying to use base model cars for value comparison. I'm guessing most people on here would probably figure insurance would do that anyways. Insurance wanted $40k for buyback so I turned that down and the car will be at a co-part auction soon enough. Hopefully others can learn from my mistakes.

[dirtyboot]

I'm glad you finally got it settled. $40k buy-back you'd think it just barely met totaling criteria, that's outlandish for the state of the car in my experience. They wanted $12k for mine, and after consulting with Tom Sessions and some other gurus, I still wouldn't have been able to rebuild it for less than the cost of buying another.

[Oh Three Z]

Im glad to hear that you have this wrapped up. 40k for that car is crazy. I think that is about what goonzsquad paid for #33 and that was probably too much. Hope to see a post in the near future of you showing off the replacement

Good luck

Mike

[BSLSK]

Congrats on settling and hopefully you will get the snake bite again soon...

[sadil]

Sad to see a local TA trashed but very glad to hear you have your health and money back! On to the next my man!

[JonB ~ PartsRack]

SSSSSSSSSSLITHER On.........

[Fatboy 18]

Tough Read :(

[ACR Steve]

Thats why everyone should have "Agreed value " on there Viper

[Bryan Savage]

Anyone know if this car is totally totaled? It damn sure looks it, but these YouTubers out there...

It's still on the list in the TA list thread.

[ViperNC]

Thats why everyone should have "Agreed value " on there Viper

Yeah... big difference between Agreed Value, Stated Value, and normal auto insurance. Glad our young friend is OK and he definitely learned his lesson. Go fast at the track and stay within reasonable limits on the street.

[pappyG45]

Sorry to bring this post back from the dead, but somehow TA68's dash wound up in 49's VIN

edit looks like the dealer may have been fooled to... Will keep this thread going until I find out what went down.

47912

[ACRSNK]

Sorry to hear, but that thing was mangled. Surprised they were able to put it back together again. Every part must be new.

[AAA96]

Sorry to hear about the trickery as well. If you care to share how it was sold to you that may be helpful. Just as a learning experience since I am always afraid of scammers out there. If you need any help with anything don’t hesitate to ask.

[pappyG45]

Sorry to hear about the trickery as well. If you care to share how it was sold to you that may be helpful. Just as a learning experience since I am always afraid of scammers out there. If you need any help with anything don’t hesitate to ask.

I bought it from an out of state dealer (mind you I have done this a few times before not actually seeing the car in person but with videos etc.) the car fax was clean, low mileage, etc so it all seemed good to go. When it arrived there were some def oddities that I could easily see in person. Missing carbon fiber engine brace (standard on TA), doors not lining up perfectly, gaps in fenders, bubbling & cracks in side rockers, weird interior scratches, service airbag warning, driver seatbelt sensor not engaging, etc

Whoever put it back together did a pretty good job at 5 ft you cant tell.

Hoping the OP comes back to this thread so we can verify the VIN.

Update: VIN is confirmed not 68

47913

[Fatboy 18]

Drop the OP a private message, it should flag up on their email.....It does with me.

[Lawineer]

This is wild.

What were they thinking trying to do this on a that there were 93 of? Especially so poorly.

[Lawineer]

Sorry to bring this post back from the dead, but somehow TA68 was put back together and I got bamboozoled from a dealer who gave me a fraudulent odometer etc. Thank you for this thread it will help in my lawsuit. Any attorney's on here want this case?

edit looks like the dealer may have been fooled to... Will keep this thread going until I find out what went down.

47912

I had a tuner in Orange County literally just steal my client's high 6 figure car claiming to be doing work on it, and holding it for ransom when he refused to pay more and adding 10% interest per day. I got local counsel in CA and they did a great job- though they weren't cheap. I'd be happy to make a referral. Just send me a PM

[pappyG45]

So here's the clean looking carfax, seems to be quite a bit of effort on multiple fronts to fake this vehicles true identity. Didn't know they could fudge the mileage so easily on a newer car? OP said he put 32K miles on it. And also some Puerto Rico weirdness going on.

47914

[StrokerAce]

I had a tuner in Orange County literally just steal my client's high 6 figure car claiming to be doing work on it, and holding it for ransom when he refused to pay more and adding 10% interest per day. I got local counsel in CA and they did a great job- though they weren't cheap. I'd be happy to make a referral. Just send me a PM

That's a terrible story. I'm not a cast of the Expendables but you can bet your ass my car would be going home with me, one way or the other. Hopefully that tuner is out of businesses.


So here's the clean looking carfax, seems to be quite a bit of effort on multiple fronts to fake this vehicles true identity. Didn't know they could fudge the mileage so easily on a newer car? OP said he put 32K miles on it. And also some Puerto Rico weirdness going on.

47914


That's something else. Someone fiddled with the paperwork. This is why I don't trust Carfax.

[13COBRA]

What's the VIN? Would be happy to run an AutoCheck on it and see if I can get to the bottom of the apparently washed title.

[pappyG45]

What's the VIN? Would be happy to run an AutoCheck on it and see if I can get to the bottom of the apparently washed title.

Awesome thank you - VIN: 1C3ADEAZ7EV200049

[13COBRA]

Similar results. If I was a betting man, I would say that it was purchased by a body shop from Copart or something similar, then it was sold to an entity in Puerto Rico to 'wash' the title, then brought back into the United States, and sold at auction. It doesn't appear that the dealer you purchased it from, had anything to do with it in my opinion. The issue definitely lies upstream from them. They should be able to help you though. The invoice or bill of sale from when they purchased it at the auction will show who the seller is.

47915

[camarochevy1970]

doesn't that VIN align to a different numbered car?

[Fatboy 18]

Have to say carfax saved my butt on a purchase of a 1999 Viper GTS in the UK (car had been issued a cert of destruction) I'm amazed this car was also not issued a cert of Destruction seeing so much damage. In the UK we have a system called HPI Similar to carfax but nowhere near as good. Trouble is even when I sent HPI all the evidence from carfax and a letter from the Dept of Motor vehicle's in Florida, they would still not add the history to their records because I was a private individual and they only accept data from Insurance companies and UK Licence agency!

Sorry to hear you got scammed Pappy, if there's one thing I really hate its dishonestly :mad:

[Loud]

Didn't think that car could be put back together. Clean carfax? Double you Tee Eff!!

Did you not get a PPI? Come on man, that should be the first thing to do when buying sight unseen right? Lesson learnt and good luck sorting this out. Sorry you have to deal with this.

[pappyG45]

Similar results. If I was a betting man, I would say that it was purchased by a body shop from Copart or something similar, then it was sold to an entity in Puerto Rico to 'wash' the title, then brought back into the United States, and sold at auction. It doesn't appear that the dealer you purchased it from, had anything to do with it in my opinion. The issue definitely lies upstream from them. They should be able to help you though. The invoice or bill of sale from when they purchased it at the auction will show who the seller is.

47915


So they used VIN - VIN: 1C3ADEAZ7EV200049, however the car is 68 according to the dash. Also drivers side is messed up replaced window

[Loud]

#49 is somewhere in the US per Bryan's list.

[camarochevy1970]

can you attach a picture of the VIN plate and I think there should be a sticker in the door jam that has a VIN on it as well

[Fatboy 18]

Wonder if parts were swapped to a different chassis?

[pappyG45]

#49 is somewhere in the US per Bryan's list.

49's VIN what really happened to this car?

Funny thing is that the 68/93 badge is actually not that easy to see a very minor thing that was overlooked that put this puzzle together.

[pappyG45]

can you attach a picture of the VIN plate and I think there should be a sticker in the door jam that has a VIN on it as well

No sticker avail. Any other spots where I can check a VIN

[camarochevy1970]

you don't have the tire pressure sticker in the door jam?

[13COBRA]

No sticker avail. Any other spots where I can check a VIN

There should be a VIN on the upper frame rail on the front, and on the rear.

[Fatboy 18]

http://www.theviperregistry.com/vin.php

[StrokerAce]

Hodgepodge of parts is what it sounds like and a very shady operation. You can bet your bank account this is not their first attempt at this.

[Jet Slicker]

Hey everybody. I just called PappyG45 about what's going on. My car was so absolutely screwed, I didn't think it could ever come back to life. Rear foot and a half of the frame sheared off, engine support braces and frame all crunched, among other things.

Brian Jones of Jones Auto Inc (Buys salvage Vipers and parts them out or rebuilds if possible) bought my car from CoPart and actually parted it out. Parts went everywhere across the US. My guess is that this is a different body/frame, and whoever rebuilt the car bought my 68/93 dash from Jones Auto, among other parts from my old car possibly. I did confirm that the door cards/panels are NOT mine, because I installed the 18 speaker package and this car does not have that.

I gave Pappy the contact info for Jones Auto to see what actually happened to my body/frame of OTA #68. And, if the body was confirmed scrapped, info of who the #68/93 dash was sold to would be great, if Jones Auto can give the info up. OP also needs another location besides the dash and door jam to look for a VIN, to try and see which body/frame he actually has. If anybody has that info for him that would be fantastic.

As much as I would be ecstatic to see my car breathing and driving again, it was so far gone that i'm not convinced. And if it actually was mine, there would be so many new parts it wouldn't really even be mine.

Jones Auto: https://jonesautoinc.com/?fbclid=IwAR0U2PSC9SSvloOl0Vh8St3qUbGVyKFTB6W5XUUo KID4fGERG3OfOVtyX-U

[SRT_BluByU]

Wow.. just speechless. So sorry to hear about this.

[13COBRA]

I'm not 100% clued in on the TAs....does the VIN correspond with the number unit? A lot of cars don't.

[Tunedprt91]

When replacing my window regulator I found the Vin inside the door behind the window glass. It would be another place to check.

[pappyG45]

Hey everybody. I just called PappyG45 about what's going on. My car was so absolutely screwed, I didn't think it could ever come back to life. Rear foot and a half of the frame sheared off, engine support braces and frame all crunched, among other things.

Brian Jones of Jones Auto Inc (Buys salvage Vipers and parts them out or rebuilds if possible) bought my car from CoPart and actually parted it out. Parts went everywhere across the US. My guess is that this is a different body/frame, and whoever rebuilt the car bought my 68/93 dash from Jones Auto, among other parts from my old car possibly. I did confirm that the door cards/panels are NOT mine, because I installed the 18 speaker package and this car does not have that.

I gave Pappy the contact info for Jones Auto to see what actually happened to my body/frame of OTA #68. And, if the body was confirmed scrapped, info of who the #68/93 dash was sold to would be great, if Jones Auto can give the info up. OP also needs another location besides the dash and door jam to look for a VIN, to try and see which body/frame he actually has. If anybody has that info for him that would be fantastic.

As much as I would be ecstatic to see my car breathing and driving again, it was so far gone that i'm not convinced. And if it actually was mine, there would be so many new parts it wouldn't really even be mine.

Jones Auto: https://jonesautoinc.com/?fbclid=IwAR0U2PSC9SSvloOl0Vh8St3qUbGVyKFTB6W5XUUo KID4fGERG3OfOVtyX-U

I just want to say what an awesome community you Viper folks are! Love everyone's passion and support. Ever since high school I have wanted a Viper and finally had the scratch to make it happen. If anyone has lines on any Orange Vipers please send my way as I will be on the look out for another one. I am talking with the dealer and hoping this resolves easily with an insurance claim they can make and take the car back.

[Arizona Vipers]

I'm not a cast of the Expendables but you can bet your ass my car would be going home with me


LMAO!!!

[Jet Slicker]

I'm not 100% clued in on the TAs....does the VIN correspond with the number unit? A lot of cars don't.

YES, the whole VIN is mostly the same on all 2014 Orange TA's at least, but all of them end with EV2000xx. The xx being the number of the TA, which is how you can tell exactly which number you have. So the last 8 of MY VIN was EV200068. Pappy just has my dash. The dash was confirmed sold by Jones Auto, to a person or company that Jones Auto would not disclose. My dash from totaled OTA #68 must have been put in OTA #49 for some reason, and the dash plaque was not swapped or corrected.

Also, to clear up some mis-information, The car had a total of 40k miles when wrecked. I bought it used, and put about 33-34k miles on it.

[Oh Three Z]

Does the full xxxxx49 vin correlate to a TA or just to the 49th 2014 viper? It seems unlikely that a wrecked TA (49) would need a dash. My guess is that the car in question did not start it’s life as a TA

Has anyone tried to contact the owner of #49

Edit. I see that it is an unclaimed car on Bryan’s list.

Sorry that Pappy is having to deal with this. I hope you get a favorable resolution

[sonicbloo]

this sure sucks, hope you get it resolved.

I found an old advert (don't know how old) but it confirms the VIN belongs to car #49

http://www.2040-cars.com/Dodge/Viper/2014-dodge-srt-viper-ta-edition-49-of-93-orange-blk-only-1-600-miles-like-new--970726/

[Jet Slicker]

Does the full xxxxx49 vin correlate to a TA or just to the 49th 2014 viper? It seems unlikely that a wrecked TA (49) would need a dash. My guess is that the car in question did not start it’s life as a TA

Has anyone tried to contact the owner of #49

Edit. I see that it is an unclaimed car on Bryan’s list.

Sorry that Pappy is having to deal with this. I hope you get a favorable resolution

The VINs for the 2014 TA's are different than the other 2014 cars. It actually means that is number 49 TA, and not the 49th 2014 car. The other non-numbered cars in 2014 would have much different last 8 numbers. So the VIN Poppy has is 100% a TA VIN and not a GTS or base SRT VIN.

[Bryan Savage]

Does the full xxxxx49 vin correlate to a TA or just to the 49th 2014 viper? It seems unlikely that a wrecked TA (49) would need a dash. My guess is that the car in question did not start it’s life as a TA

Has anyone tried to contact the owner of #49

Edit. I see that it is an unclaimed car on Bryan’s list.

Sorry that Pappy is having to deal with this. I hope you get a favorable resolution

For 2014, all the TA cars had sequential VINs. 2000xx for Orange, 3000xx for White, 4000xx for Black, and 5000xx for the Carbons. The last two digits match the number of the car. Non TA cars don't have such a nice sequence (thought I haven't checked many others). The TAs weren't built in order either, but all the digits should match.

Sounds like a decent whack at a rebuild, but it's the little things that define Quality, and it would seem this car was lacking.

I assume the passenger side of the dash will tear open during airbag deployment, so that could explain why it needed a dash replacement.

[Jet Slicker]

I assume the passenger side of the dash will tear open during airbag deployment, so that could explain why it needed a dash replacement.

Agree, that was my thought as well. In my massive crash, the passenger airbag didn't end up going off. I bet you look at the front of OTA #49, especially on the passenger side, and see differences that would indicate a crash. Which is why they would have needed my dash after the original from #49 blew open.

[sonicbloo]

this sure sucks, hope you get it resolved.

I found an old advert (don't know how old) but it confirms the VIN belongs to car #49

http://www.2040-cars.com/Dodge/Viper/2014-dodge-srt-viper-ta-edition-49-of-93-orange-blk-only-1-600-miles-like-new--970726/

Painful memories Jetslicker, but here's the copart advert I just found with a few pictures. #68 Sold for $24400

https://en.bidfax.info/dodge/viper/4697336-dodge-viper-srt-2014-orange-84l-10-vin-1c3adeaz0ev200068.html

[pappyG45]

Painful memories Jetslicker, but here's the copart advert I just found with a few pictures. #68 Sold for $24400

https://en.bidfax.info/dodge/viper/4697336-dodge-viper-srt-2014-orange-84l-10-vin-1c3adeaz0ev200068.html

Great find so is the dash all one piece? Like it would include the passenger airbag system etc?

FYI to clear up any confusion this is 68 still sitting the focus now is what actually happened to 49 thanks all for your input


47919

[TIME]

No sticker avail. Any other spots where I can check a VIN

Hi PappyG45,

You state that you have C3ADEAZ7EV200049. This is for OTA #49/93, as per Bryan above.

Here is a link to Viper VIN locations:
https://www.theviperregistry.com/vin.php#:~:text=The%20Vehicle%20Identification%20N umber%20(VIN,pillar%20inside%20the%20windshield%20 opening.

What are the VIN numbers on your car as shown in above link?
What VIN is on your purchase agreement?

You will need the all of the information to talk to your dealer and/or a lawyer.

[Jet Slicker]

Painful memories Jetslicker, but here's the copart advert I just found with a few pictures. #68 Sold for $24400

https://en.bidfax.info/dodge/viper/4697336-dodge-viper-srt-2014-orange-84l-10-vin-1c3adeaz0ev200068.html

Yepp, I watched it get bid up and sold when the auction was going on. That's also how I found out that Brian Jones bought it.


Hi Pappy45,

You state that you have C3ADEAZ7EV200049. This is for OTA #45/93, as per Bryan above. OTA 68/93 would have VIN number C3ADEAZ7EV200068

Here is a link to Viper VIN locations:
https://www.theviperregistry.com/vin.php#:~:text=The%20Vehicle%20Identification%20N umber%20(VIN,pillar%20inside%20the%20windshield%20 opening.

What are the VIN numbers on your car as shown in above link?
What VIN is on your purchase agreement?

You will need the all of the information to talk to your dealer and/or a lawyer.

The VIN number EV200049 is NOT for Viper 45/93.. Not sure if that was a typo or you don't know what you're talking about.
My OTA #68 has a different VIN than what you listed.
We already have the VIN's figured out, unless there is another VIN location on the car that Pappy will look at to confirm it is EV200049.

Don't worry TIME, we're all set!

[TIME]

Got it!

[Oh Three Z]

For 2014, all the TA cars had sequential VINs. 2000xx for Orange, 3000xx for White, 4000xx for Black, and 5000xx for the Carbons. The last two digits match the number of the car. Non TA cars don't have such a nice sequence (thought I haven't checked many others). The TAs weren't built in order either, but all the digits should match.

Sounds like a decent whack at a rebuild, but it's the little things that define Quality, and it would seem this car was lacking.

I assume the passenger side of the dash will tear open during airbag deployment, so that could explain why it needed a dash replacement.

I get that but if 49 was wrecked as well why not put the “49/93” badge back on the donor dash?

[Jet Slicker]

I get that but if 49 was wrecked as well why not put the “49/93” badge back on the donor dash?

I'm wondering if the dash plaque gets destroyed when the airbag goes off. I'm thinking not, but don't know. And the place that rebuilt it didn't fix the airbag light, didn't take all the broken glass shards out of the drivers door, didn't tint the drivers window to match the passenger one, and other strange things. It's clear they didn't do a good job and didn't entirely finish it, so it would make sense they didn't care to have the VIN and the dash plaque match.

[Oh Three Z]

Ok.... since we all love value threads what is this car worth?

I wouldn’t pay more than part out money but would anyone buy this car for 70? 60??

Safe to say 49 & 68 are essentially dead OTA’s

[Oh Three Z]

I'm wondering if the dash plaque gets destroyed when the airbag goes off. I'm thinking not, but don't know. And the place that rebuilt it didn't fix the airbag light, didn't take all the broken glass shards out of the drivers door, didn't tint the drivers window to match the passenger one, and other strange things. It's clear they didn't do a good job and didn't entirely finish it, so it would make sense they didn't care to have the VIN and the dash plaque match.

I could see it separating from the dash but it would be unlikely that it would be destroyed. I would have wanted it as a keepsake had I returned to the carcass.

[pappyG45]

Ok.... since we all love value threads what is this car worth?

I wouldn’t pay more than part out money but would anyone buy this car for 70? 60??

Ya wondering myself

[Jet Slicker]

Ok.... since we all love value threads what is this car worth?

I wouldn’t pay more than part out money but would anyone buy this car for 70? 60??

To say for sure i'd love to see pictures of it wrecked if that can be tracked down. Otherwise if somebody is desperate enough, which they are, they would pay more. I don't know how much i'd pay for it. Definitely less than $82k, which is what I paid for my OTA used in 2017, even though I know prices have gone up since then. And COVID shortages are driving prices up even higher. I'm thinking Vipers will go down a bit in value with all other used cars once the COVID effect wears off. But they will still be higher than they were when COVID started.


I could see it separating from the dash but it would be unlikely that it would be destroyed. I would have wanted it as a keepsake had I returned to the carcass.

I tried to get the plaque off when I went back to the car but I couldn't get it off. I didn't have many tools with me so I had to leave it.

[usmcfieldmp]

Here's one of the listings for TA 49 when it was at 15,185 miles. Aligns with the previously posted Carfax... is that who you bought it from? I found a couple older posts, as well... but they aren't loading properly. I'm still working on it though.

https://incacar.com/used/cars/dodge/viper/2014-Dodge-SRT-Viper-SRT-2049089/

EDIT: It was once listed on the Spanish-version of Auto.com, but the listing is gone, and I can't pull a cache version from any of my resources.

https://www.auto.com/es/cars/dodge-srt_viper-base-2014-1c3adeaz7ev200049

[pappyG45]

Here's one of the listings for TA 49 when it was at 15,185 miles. Aligns with the previously posted Carfax... is that who you bought it from? I found a couple older posts, as well... but they aren't loading properly. I'm still working on it though.

https://incacar.com/used/cars/dodge/viper/2014-Dodge-SRT-Viper-SRT-2049089/

Yes, correct however as stated by Jet Slicker this car has the indication it was in some sort of accident.

[usmcfieldmp]

Reported incident here: https://www.vincheckup.com/results?year=2014&make=SRT&model=Viper&RecordsCheckType=&vin=1C3ADEAZ7EV200049&aff_exitValue=ON&aff_item_id=1

If you have a clean Carfax, they have a buyback guarantee. So if the dealer falls through, they're an option.

[pappyG45]

Reported incident here: https://www.vincheckup.com/results?year=2014&make=SRT&model=Viper&RecordsCheckType=&vin=1C3ADEAZ7EV200049&aff_exitValue=ON&aff_item_id=1

If you have a clean Carfax, they have a buyback guarantee. So if the dealer falls through, they're an option.

Looks like a marketing gimmic to get you to buy the report? Oh well

47922

[usmcfieldmp]

Looks like you're right. Says the same thing when I run any other VIN.

I can't find much else for the VIN and all the old sales ads don't have caches, but most of them look like they're for the same WA dealer.

[pappyG45]

Looks like you're right. Says the same thing when I run any other VIN.

I can't find much else for the VIN and all the old sales ads don't have caches, but most of them look like they're for the same WA dealer.

Well I'm sure things are done differently in Puerto Rico assuming thats when the damage occurred.

[sonicbloo]

I get that but if 49 was wrecked as well why not put the “49/93” badge back on the donor dash?

I was wondering that myself. If they had done that, we wouldn't have been having this discussion. The badge seems to be the only part of #68 that is on this car. Total mystery what happened to #49 and so far no-one is coming forward, surely the Viper community is small enough to know something about it's history

[pappyG45]

I was wondering that myself. If they had done that, we wouldn't have been having this discussion. The badge seems to be the only part of #68 that is on this car. Total mystery what happened to #49 and so far no-one is coming forward, surely the Viper community is small enough to know something about it's history

47923

[Fatboy 18]

so that's 2 TAs down out of 93. Then there was the rebuilt one which featured on Youtube with those two young guys who did some interesting repair work.

[pappyG45]

so that's 2 TAs down out of 93. Then there was the rebuilt one which featured on Youtube with those two young guys who did some interesting repair work.

That was car 33

[sonicbloo]

Not sure what number this TA is, but it has 'motorsport' on the side glass. Another wrecked car but rebuildable.

https://youtu.be/yf7D8KDt_gs?t=990

[pappyG45]

Well I found the car when it arrived in PR as this license plate was in the vehicle when it came to me.

47930

47931

[StrokerAce]

Front end looks smashed in. Hope you track down a prior owner.

[pappyG45]

Front end looks smashed in. Hope you track down a prior owner.

Yep def looks like the front of the car hit something on the right side... So maybe accident happened in US then they immediately get the car to Puerto Rico?


47932

[StrokerAce]

Yep def looks like the front of the car hit something on the right side... So maybe accident happened in US then they immediately get the car to Puerto Rico?


47932

Wouldn't there be more to it for that rocker to have the perceived damage?

[serpent]

47933

Look what they did to my boy :(

[Oh Three Z]

I see those pics and I still can’t figure out how/why the dash badge from 68 ended up
in the OPs car.

It’s not like 68 had a good dash with bags that didn’t blow.

[pappyG45]

I see those pics and I still can’t figure out how/why the dash badge from 68 ended up
in the OPs car.

It’s not like 68 had a good dash with bags that didn’t blow.

68 passenger bags did not blow according to OP.

[Leanmass]

I saw this car last year listed on Facebook for about $90k with missing front splitters, I knew there had to be more to the story. Then I saw it listed on Autotrader for over $125k. The ad on Facebook has been deleted so I couldn’t find out who listed it. You might be able to find more info on viper pages on Facebook.

[Oh Three Z]

68 passenger bags did not blow according to OP.

Wow. I know he had a passenger. Given the damage to that car I would have wagered a paycheck that it did blow.

[pappyG45]

I saw this car last year listed on Facebook for about $90k with missing front splitters, I knew there had to be more to the story. Then I saw it listed on Autotrader for over $125k. The ad on Facebook has been deleted so I couldn’t find out who listed it. You might be able to find more info on viper pages on Facebook.

Car TA49? Interesting

[serpent]

Was this car purchased in the northwest like washington state/oregon? I remember seeing an over priced TA missing the front splitters. The picture looked too bright too, like the orange was painted incorrectly or the photos were over exposed...

[pappyG45]

Was this car purchased in the northwest like washington state/oregon? I remember seeing an over priced TA missing the front splitters. The picture looked too bright too, like the orange was painted incorrectly or the photos were over exposed...

Yes Mudarri Motorsports Co

[pappyG45]

Update:

My ultimate conclusion on this deal is that Car OTA 49 was flooded/damaged during Hurricane Maria

I'm sure it was chaos down there so after the car dried up they repaired the interior etc of OTA 49 with parts from OTA 68 & others to mask the water damaged salvage title vehicle.

I was even able to find the water logged manual & you can see the water level line on the driver side speaker mesh and passenger side seatbelt.

47934

47935

47936

47937

[BSLSK]

What a nightmare! Sorry to hear this story. I hope the dealership takes care of you. I wonder if Dodge service can dig up any service/warranty history as this might be a 2014 R28/R29 car as well.

[ViperSRT]

The selling dealer had to know. Coming from PR and signs of corrosion/water damage. This is a case study as to why to perform prepurchase inspection. Practically anyone would catch a case as bad as this. Hence why the dealer had to know and sold it with a so-called clean title and history.

[StrokerAce]

Dealer deserves to be shut down. Crooked turds.

[RedTanRT/10]

PappyG45, following this for a couple of days and glad to see your detective work, and some others here, are getting you close to the real story

Have you called the dealer and said how F’d this car is, and ask for your money back??

If your trying to find out more of the details, I’d suggest you get the details of this car from the TX auto auction. A dealer like Cobra can find out which auction, how it was disclosed on the auction block, and they may have pictures too

Look at the trail from auction to registered in Arkansas the for sale at the dealer who sold it to you.

It’s unfortunate that you or someone didn’t look the car over. In about a minute you or someone else would have seen how F’d it was. Good luck, mike. Btw, where are you located. I’m in Dana Point

[pappyG45]

PappyG45, following this for a couple of days and glad to see your detective work, and some others here, are getting you close to the real story

Have you called the dealer and said how F’d this car is, and ask for your money back??

If your trying to find out more of the details, I’d suggest you get the details of this car from the TX auto auction. A dealer like Cobra can find out which auction, how it was disclosed on the auction block, and they may have pictures too

Look at the trail from auction to registered in Arkansas the for sale at the dealer who sold it to you.

It’s unfortunate that you or someone didn’t look the car over. In about a minute you or someone else would have seen how F’d it was. Good luck, mike. Btw, where are you located. I’m in Dana Point

I am in HB! I've actually bought a few cars online and never had any issues but ya I finally got burned. I have sufficient evidence and have a forensic auto specialist working on the rest of it for me. Dealer said he would let me know by today so hopefully won't have to hire an attorney.

Was kinda fun tracking this thing though really missed my calling as an investigator! haha

[AAA96]

I am in HB! I've actually bought a few cars online and never had any issues but ya I finally got burned. I have sufficient evidence and have a forensic auto specialist working on the rest of it for me. Dealer said he would let me know by today so hopefully won't have to hire an attorney.

Was kinda fun tracking this thing though really missed my calling as an investigator! haha

I am glad that you are not hysterically upset about this. Haha. If it were me, I would have stopped posting days ago because I would have either had a heart attack or be in jail. Haha. I think it’ll get sorted out for you!

[pappyG45]

I am glad that you are not hysterically upset about this. Haha. If it were me, I would have stopped posting days ago because I would have either had a heart attack or be in jail. Haha. I think it’ll get sorted out for you!

haha well its only money it will figure itself out I'm more of a karma guy so either its payback for me or them just not sure who yet! lmao

but bummed I really want an Orange TA still so please keep your eyes open friends!

[AAA96]

haha well its only money it will figure itself out I'm more of a karma guy so either its payback for me or them just not sure who yet! lmao

but bummed I really want an Orange TA still so please keep your eyes open friends!

Lmao haha. Glad you’re in good spirits........but, Gunmetal Pearl is better. :p0257:

[usmcfieldmp]

Personally, I'd see what kind of deal the dealer will make you to just keep the car.

But that's just me. Knowing it isn't perfect anymore would give me all the more justification to do whatever I wanted to it.

Ask them if they'll do a straight trade for a '97 GTS, haha.

[StrokerAce]

Personally, I'd see what kind of deal the dealer will make you to just keep the car.

But that's just me. Knowing it isn't perfect anymore would give me all the more justification to do whatever I wanted to it.

Ask them if they'll do a straight trade for a '97 GTS, haha.

Not sure about anyone else but a 97 in good shape is worth more than a jacked up 14. lol You into F-Bodies?

[RedTanRT/10]

Pappy, your in better spirits then I would be. As F’d as that car is, unless they told you salvage or sold it to you at 50% of market they had to figure you be pissed off and want your money back. Don’t screw around, you or your lawyer need to get with them ASAP. Don’t make the assumption that they have the wherewithal to give you all your money back quickly

BTW, look at their Yelp reviews. I have sympathy for you but you made so many errors. Good luck!!

[usmcfieldmp]

Not sure about anyone else but a 97 in good shape is worth more than a jacked up 14. lol You into F-Bodies?

It's a driver (58k miles) with a non-OE paint job (Matte Grey), so it won't be setting any BAT records. And no, zero interest in F-Bodies, lol; I would only trade it for other Vipers. ;)

The rebuilt title Gen V's that I've seen are still selling for considerably more than what I paid for my Gen II - and those weren't TA's either.


Pappy, your in better spirits then I would be. As F’d as that car is, unless they told you salvage or sold it to you at 50% of market they had to figure you be pissed off and want your money back. Don’t screw around, you or your lawyer need to get with them ASAP. Don’t make the assumption that they have the wherewithal to give you all your money back quickly

BTW, look at their Yelp reviews. I have sympathy for you but you made so many errors. Good luck!!

It could be worse... he could have bought it from CNC Motors, lol.

[pappyG45]

Pappy, your in better spirits then I would be. As F’d as that car is, unless they told you salvage or sold it to you at 50% of market they had to figure you be pissed off and want your money back. Don’t screw around, you or your lawyer need to get with them ASAP. Don’t make the assumption that they have the wherewithal to give you all your money back quickly

BTW, look at their Yelp reviews. I have sympathy for you but you made so many errors. Good luck!!

I got a little too comfortable buying cars online I def got sloppy this time.

[StrokerAce]

It's a driver (58k miles) with a non-OE paint job (Matte Grey), so it won't be setting any BAT records. And no, zero interest in F-Bodies, lol; I would only trade it for other Vipers. ;)

The rebuilt title Gen V's that I've seen are still selling for considerably more than what I paid for my Gen II - and those weren't TA's either.



It could be worse... he could have bought it from CNC Motors, lol.

His TA is far from done. My worry would be that if they couldn't even clean a speaker cover what else is hiding under the "fixed" sections. It's not what I can see that scares me. My guess is there is $30k left in his car to get it right.

Don't blame you on the F-Body. After driving mine my GTS feels like a Camry. :smileys-car-driving

[pappyG45]

His TA is far from done. My worry would be that if they couldn't even clean a speaker cover what else is hiding under the "fixed" sections. It's not what I can see that scares me. My guess is there is $30k left in his car to get it right.

Don't blame you on the F-Body. After driving mine my GTS feels like a Camry. :smileys-car-driving

Wondering what the auction price was & what the notes at auction house were on it?

[Taximan1]

I've owned OTAs #56 and #39... and regretfully sold them back in 2015,2017.. I saw this car on FB and talked to the seller... Right away, it didn't pass the sniff test. The PR history on carfax odd, and (if your from SouthFL, you know) 99.9% of everything in miami is beat up story cars (sorry its true). so I passed on it obviously. the seller did tell me it had some paintwork on the front, but was minor. I noticed the missing parts and out of alignment facia from the pics right away.... I'm sorry your going through this.. I should have went down there (70 miles from me) and put my eyes on it... But 5 minute call with the seller, and I was turned off.. Hope this works out well for you.

[pappyG45]

I'm also assuming these water spots in the carpet and rust in the seat tracks aren't common either?

47942

[StrokerAce]

I'm also assuming these water spots in the carpet and rust in the seat tracks aren't common either?

47942


Sure. If it's a leaky sunroof 80's car.

[Leanmass]

Dealerships across the country buy lots of cars second hand. The most in depth inspection they do on used cars are basically a quick walk around and running a Carfax. Whenever you buy used car it is basically buyer beware. It’s not that I don’t trust dealerships. Lots of people trade in a cars with hidden issues that isn’t disclosed to the dealership. Most dealers don’t find out the problem until the car is sold. Unfortunately this is the buyers problem now and most circumstances the dealership hold no liability and don’t have to make things right for buyer. As a buyer I hold myself accountable if I buy a used car with hidden issues. It’s my responsibility to make sure the car is thoroughly inspected before I make the purchase. I hope the dealership makes this right for the sake of their reputation. But when they don’t we are left holding the bag.

[pappyG45]

Dealerships across the country buy lots of cars second hand. The most in depth inspection they do on used cars are basically a quick walk around and running a Carfax. Whenever you buy used car it is basically buyer beware. It’s not that I don’t trust dealerships. Lots of people trade in a cars with hidden issues that isn’t disclosed to the dealership. Most dealers don’t find out the problem until the car is sold. Unfortunately this is the buyers problem now and most circumstances the dealership hold no liability and don’t have to make things right for buyer. As a buyer I hold myself accountable if I buy a used car with hidden issues. It’s my responsibility to make sure the car is thoroughly inspected before I make the purchase. I hope the dealership makes this right for the sake of their reputation. But when they don’t we are left holding the bag.

I'd agree with you on most of that however on a rare 6 figure car with such obvious flaws there is no excuse for them.

[ACRSNK]

Dealerships across the country buy lots of cars second hand. The most in depth inspection they do on used cars are basically a quick walk around and running a Carfax. Whenever you buy used car it is basically buyer beware. It’s not that I don’t trust dealerships. Lots of people trade in a cars with hidden issues that isn’t disclosed to the dealership. Most dealers don’t find out the problem until the car is sold. Unfortunately this is the buyers problem now and most circumstances the dealership hold no liability and don’t have to make things right for buyer. As a buyer I hold myself accountable if I buy a used car with hidden issues. It’s my responsibility to make sure the car is thoroughly inspected before I make the purchase. I hope the dealership makes this right for the sake of their reputation. But when they don’t we are left holding the bag.

You have some good points, but it seems like there may have been some fraud involved here and that is never acceptable. Bottom line is the dealer should be held accountable. Hopefully this all gets sorted sooner rather than later, but when a dealer says “I’ll get back to you” they are likely looking for ways to help themselves in any given situation rather than the customer that got screwed so I wouldn’t wait long on lawyering up if I were the buyer. Hope it all works out.

[pappyG45]

An update and we can finally put this to rest. Dealer is taking the car back, but not at the price I paid. I am taking a small haircut on the deal which I believe is fair for both parties considering everything. Appreciate everyones help on this matter and now I guess I'll just sit and wait until another TA comes up for sale.

[BSLSK]

An update and we can finally put this to rest. Dealer is taking the car back, but not at the price I paid. I am taking a small haircut on the deal which I believe is fair for both parties considering everything. Appreciate everyones help on this matter and now I guess I'll just sit and wait until another TA comes up for sale.

All that matters is that you're satisfied with the deal. Best of luck finding another one!

[13COBRA]

An update and we can finally put this to rest. Dealer is taking the car back, but not at the price I paid. I am taking a small haircut on the deal which I believe is fair for both parties considering everything. Appreciate everyones help on this matter and now I guess I'll just sit and wait until another TA comes up for sale.

Cool on the dealer part.

Interesting thought process now though. They're going to have to go back after the auction, and then after the seller....but that'll take a hot minute.

[dsp300c]

An update and we can finally put this to rest. Dealer is taking the car back, but not at the price I paid. I am taking a small haircut on the deal which I believe is fair for both parties considering everything. Appreciate everyones help on this matter and now I guess I'll just sit and wait until another TA comes up for sale.

i think there is a white TA on FB for sale if you want white

[Bryan Savage]

An update and we can finally put this to rest. Dealer is taking the car back, but not at the price I paid. I am taking a small haircut on the deal which I believe is fair for both parties considering everything. Appreciate everyones help on this matter and now I guess I'll just sit and wait until another TA comes up for sale.

TA #4968 will resurface someplace else. Everyone be on the lookout!

[pappyG45]

i think there is a white TA on FB for sale if you want white

Link?

[RedTanRT/10]

An update and we can finally put this to rest. Dealer is taking the car back, but not at the price I paid. I am taking a small haircut on the deal which I believe is fair for both parties considering everything. Appreciate everyones help on this matter and now I guess I'll just sit and wait until another TA comes up for sale.


Great news, hopefully not a huge price for a lesson learned. Something tells me you also never ran a car fax? In hindsight would you have bought a 5 owner Viper that came out of Puerto Rico without someone looking at it??? Telling you you'll get you $$$'s and having it in your pocket isn't the same. Don't fail to stay on top of these guys for your $$$'s. They know what they sold you and that should be a big red flag.

Good luck on your pursuit of a Viper, when you find one join the SoCal club and get to know Dan Cragin at Specialty Performance. Best wishes! Mike


Cool on the dealer part.

Interesting thought process now though. They're going to have to go back after the auction, and then after the seller....but that'll take a hot minute.

Nick, I had suggested to Pappy to reach out to you and see what auction in TX and how it was disclosed on the block (plus the pictures they had). That Viper was F'd up when they bought it and they knew it. You'd kill your UC manager if he bought that car for stupid money. I looked at these guys Yelp reviews, of the most recent 3, 1 said he had to get a lawyer, one wanted to give a -20, etc., etc. Ain't over till he has his money, hope he doesn't get strung along!

[Jet Slicker]

47933

Look what they did to my boy :(

What do you mean your boy haha I don't believe you ever owned this car?

[pappyG45]

Great news, hopefully not a huge price for a lesson learned. Something tells me you also never ran a car fax? In hindsight would you have bought a 5 owner Viper that came out of Puerto Rico without someone looking at it??? Telling you you'll get you $$$'s and having it in your pocket isn't the same. Don't fail to stay on top of these guys for your $$$'s. They know what they sold you and that should be a big red flag.

Good luck on your pursuit of a Viper, when you find one join the SoCal club and get to know Dan Cragin at Specialty Performance. Best wishes! Mike



Nick, I had suggested to Pappy to reach out to you and see what auction in TX and how it was disclosed on the block (plus the pictures they had). That Viper was F'd up when they bought it and they knew it. You'd kill your UC manager if he bought that car for stupid money. I looked at these guys Yelp reviews, of the most recent 3, 1 said he had to get a lawyer, one wanted to give a -20, etc., etc. Ain't over till he has his money, hope he doesn't get strung along!

Dealer paid 93K for it at auction

[dsp300c]

Link?

sent you a private message with the info

[Loud]

An update and we can finally put this to rest. Dealer is taking the car back, but not at the price I paid. I am taking a small haircut on the deal which I believe is fair for both parties considering everything. Appreciate everyones help on this matter and now I guess I'll just sit and wait until another TA comes up for sale.

Glad it worked out to your satisfaction. Good luck finding another. Here is a pic to keep you occupied until then ;)

https://i.imgur.com/9eBTejs.jpg

[pappyG45]

Glad it worked out to your satisfaction. Good luck finding another. Here is a pic to keep you occupied until then ;)

https://i.imgur.com/9eBTejs.jpg

What a beaut!

[13COBRA]

Nick, I had suggested to Pappy to reach out to you and see what auction in TX and how it was disclosed on the block (plus the pictures they had). That Viper was F'd up when they bought it and they knew it. You'd kill your UC manager if he bought that car for stupid money. I looked at these guys Yelp reviews, of the most recent 3, 1 said he had to get a lawyer, one wanted to give a -20, etc., etc. Ain't over till he has his money, hope he doesn't get strung along!

I can definitely give it a go...but after 90 days or so, it's hard to track back an auction. I think the auction sites remove listings like that to keep from being held liable for issues that come up down the road.

[pappyG45]

I can definitely give it a go...but after 90 days or so, it's hard to track back an auction. I think the auction sites remove listings like that to keep from being held liable for issues that come up down the road.

Thank you but its all squared away now dealer sent over paperwork to rescind the sale.

[Bruce H.]

If you love orange I've been told the black and white TA's have just the right amount on them;)

[Fatboy 18]

Thank you but its all squared away now dealer sent over paperwork to rescind the sale.Sounds like a good outcome for you, have you lost anything? Trouble is now, I suspect another Innocent customer will come along and also find out the hard way! Ideally the car needs to go through a full engineers inspection, just like you would have building a Kit car and the history needs to be corrected on the paperwork. When I tried to get my deposit back from a dealer trying to sell me a rebuilt viper I had to get the credit card company to lawyer up on them, they went after him and a couple of months later I got my 5k back.

Also that dash badge on your TA should be pulled off or the number deleted as its now a parts car.

[pMak26]

Thought you all might get a kick out of this. After seeing the car was going back to the dealer, I reached out and asked them what they want for it now knowing it was a flooded car with a hell of a history. This is their direct response:


The car is going to run at the auction likey and with the current market bring all the money. If youd like to make an offer let us know

This certainly sounds like they don't plan on disclosing the history of the vehicle on the next auction block.

[StrokerAce]

Thought you all might get a kick out of this. After seeing the car was going back to the dealer, I reached out and asked them what they want for it now knowing it was a flooded car with a hell of a history. This is their direct response:



This certainly sounds like they don't plan on disclosing the history of the vehicle on the next auction block.

I'd call the auction house and let them know. Eff that dealer for that crap. Morals are low these days.

[Voice of Reason]

Is there a way to get the carfax history updated? The next buyer needs protected so they don’t get taken.

[usmcfieldmp]

Is there a way to get the carfax history updated? The next buyer needs protected so they don’t get taken.

https://support.carfax.com/articles/report-discrepancies/

I think the problem that he might run into is that they're generally going to want some sort of proof to update the Carfax. The pictures might be enough, especially with the supporting evidence of the dash having been changed, but it's hard to say.

The real question that I would have is whether or not these auction places run a Carfax, as well. I would think now with such a high volume of vehicles running through, but I really don't know.

Hopefully it doesn't get reported, the current dealer is able to unload it at auction, and the next schmuck to come along is the one that ends up paying the price.

[Tunedprt91]

TA #4968 will resurface someplace else. Everyone be on the lookout!

Lol my thoughts exactly.

[13COBRA]

Hopefully it doesn't get reported, the current dealer is able to unload it at auction, and the next schmuck to come along is the one that ends up paying the price.

Quoted for when some random buyer shows up on the forum asking questions...

[usmcfieldmp]

Rereading what I typed out, I see that my intent might not be as clear as I intended, lol.

Hopefully this doesn't happen: it gets reported to Carfax, the current dealer is still able to unload it at auction without disclosure of the flooding, and the next schmuck to come along is the one that ends up paying the price once the Carfax gets pulled again/updated.

[13COBRA]

^^ The next schmuck will be a consumer.

[usmcfieldmp]

Yeah, very likely a consumer or the next dealer that buys it at auction.

[TIME]

Warning:

This TA 49/68 is up for sale again, on Autotrader. Same dealer, slightly lower price at $119,990.

[VENOM-TA]

Oh boy!!!

[ViperJon]

Wonder whatever happened to my old OTA the infamous #33 AKA Goonsquad rebuild. Would be interesting to run a CarFax on that one.

[VENOM-TA]

Wonder whatever happened to my old OTA the infamous #33 AKA Goonsquad rebuild. Would be interesting to run a CarFax on that one.

I believe they still own it..

[Hoonin88]

They still own it. I've messaged them more than once asking about it but i get no response...

[AZTVR]

Wonder whatever happened to my old OTA the infamous #33 AKA Goonsquad rebuild. Would be interesting to run a CarFax on that one.


They still own it. I've messaged them more than once asking about it but i get no response...

There is nothing better than drifting donuts in your yard with your OTA Viper !!! https://youtu.be/dud5HI47uKU?t=1008 Posted a few days ago.

[kell]

Warning:

This TA 49/68 is up for sale again, on Autotrader. Same dealer, slightly lower price at $119,990.

I actually called on this one yesterday as I didn't know the story... then I saw 5 owners and did some research. Too bad, would love an OTA.

[ACRSNK]

Drifting in an OTA……Why?

[StrokerAce]

Drifting in an OTA……Why?

Correction. Drifting in a shitty grassy backyard in an OTA....Why?

[AZTVR]

Warning:

This TA 49/68 is up for sale again, on Autotrader. Same dealer, slightly lower price at $119,990.

Here is a link to tie a newer thread with a little more information on TA 49, 1C3ADEAZ7EV200049 to this one: https://driveviper.com/forums/threads/29094-2014-Orange-TA-seems-like-good-deal

[Dr.Duct_Mossburg]

So.... Did OP ever post the video? I know that road very well and believe I know what turn he's describing. For the most part, those that spend a lot of time on backroads are able to read the road... Nothing too crazy.

However... and a BIG however... There are 4 turns in particular that will catch you off guard and when they do, it's game over.

[VENOM-TA]

Well.. this car is now in Texas.. my service advisor at the Dodge dealership text me that a car like mine was in the shop.. another smaller dealership bought it from an auction to flip it.. it’s there at the service department to diagnose why every single dash light is on.. lol..

[darbgnik]

Well.. this car is now in Texas.. my service advisor at the Dodge dealership text me that a car like mine was in the shop.. another smaller dealership bought it from an auction to flip it.. it’s there at the service department to diagnose why every single dash light is on.. lol..

Did ya tell him what you know?

[VENOM-TA]

Did ya tell him what you know?

I forwarded this thread to him..

[Lawineer]

I'm a buyer at $40k. Probably.

[AZTVR]

Well.. this car is now in Texas.. my service advisor at the Dodge dealership text me that a car like mine was in the shop.. another smaller dealership bought it from an auction to flip it.. it’s there at the service department to diagnose why every single dash light is on.. lol..


Did ya tell him what you know?


I forwarded this thread to him..

Well, hopefully the buyer googled the VIN before he bought the car, and bid accordingly. It appears that it was offered at Manheim in California around 10/11/2021

[Oh Three Z]

It’s back!!!

“Best deal on eBay”

[Oh Three Z]

It’s back!!!

“Best deal on eBay”

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Dodge-Viper-T-A-TIME-ATTACK-ULTRA-RARE-1-OF-93-BEST-DEAL-ON-EBAY-/275058686428?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l6249&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0

[AZTVR]

It’s back!!!

“Best deal on eBay”

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Dodge-Viper-T-A-TIME-ATTACK-ULTRA-RARE-1-OF-93-BEST-DEAL-ON-EBAY-/275058686428?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l6249&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0

Number 49,
1C3ADEAZ7EV200049 , is also on the dealer's website: Monaco Motor Group (https://www.mmgcars.com/details/used-2014-dodge-srt-viper/81456898)

[VENOM-TA]

It states in the description that’s it’s car #49 and it has a serial dash plaque.. did they not look at it??? Lol clearly says 68/93

[Rollin]

It states in the description that’s it’s car #49 and it has a serial dash plaque.. did they not look at it??? Lol clearly says 68/83

Read back through this thread. It's car 49 with the dash from 68, crashed, dodgily repaired and sold and resold to 20 different people.

[SRT_BluByU]

Hope it sells... and the buyer is fully aware of the history.

[ViperSRT]

Hope it sells... and the buyer is fully aware of the history.

Did you see the price? $187,999 It would not be an eyes wide open purchase at anything near that amount!

[13COBRA]

$188k LOL

[Loud]

If that sells for $188, I am hiring that guy to sell mine for $350, lol.

[TIME]

Pictures are worth a thousand words: 68/93 on the dash. VIN EV200049.

Stop the madness.

[VENOM-TA]

Oh yeah, I’ve been keeping up with this car, it was here in DFW a month ago at my local Dodge service department..

[pappyG45]

My old car is back up for sale. Hopefully anyone interested will see this thread.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/275058686428?hash=item400ac679dc%3Ag%3Aj2oAAOSwo3N hsqWH&fbclid=IwAR2KM96sSPpVS0za45ZbVyfavxqnAbBG4drNd8CtG ko4tz4KYlmURkWIdV8

[SRT_BluByU]

Did you see the price? $187,999 It would not be an eyes wide open purchase at anything near that amount!

I did.. if he gets that all of ours are $300k cars! ha

[ACRucrazy]

Still on eBay.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Dodge-Viper-T-A-TIME-ATTACK-ULTRA-RARE-1-OF-93-BEST-DEAL-ON-EBAY-/275151225748?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0

[MoHaWk2003]

Another red flag...didn't all TAs come with the carbon fiber X-brace? Man, I can't believe this car is still up for sale. Wonder if MMG knows about its past. This car just needs to get crushed so nobody else can potentially fall into a greedy dealer's trap.

[AZTVR]

Man, I can't believe this car is still up for sale. Wonder if MMG knows about its past. This car just needs to get crushed so nobody else can potentially fall into a greedy dealer's trap.

Great idea! Go ahead and take the initiative and buy it and have it crushed! I doubt that there is anyone else willing to do it. Or, perhaps, the VOA membership could buy it and part it out; except for the questionable parts.

[ellowviper]

It's great this car is out there and available...as OTAs should live as many lives as possible....BUT this issue is with its checkered past and sellers/dealers gouging and misrepresenting the vehicle. It's honestly a $70-80k vehicle IMO...and should be sold to a valued owner as such. Lots of potential fun and enjoyment can be had with his car, it just needs to have fully and open transparency...which in this market and this vehicle won't happen unfortunately.

[SRT_BluByU]

its easily worth $30k

[VENOM-TA]

It's great this car is out there and available...as OTAs should live as many lives as possible....BUT this issue is with its checkered past and sellers/dealers gouging and misrepresenting the vehicle. It's honestly a $70-80k vehicle IMO...and should be sold to a valued owner as such. Lots of potential fun and enjoyment can be had with his car, it just needs to have fully and open transparency...which in this market and this vehicle won't happen unfortunately.
Not even worth 70K.. this car was at my Dodge service department I go to, my service advisor text me pics saying my twin just showed up.. I asked him the last 3 of the vin and sure enough it was this car.. told him the history of it.. he said the guy who brought it in was trying to get the lights off in the instrument cluster as they all were lit.. needless to say they couldn’t do it, it needed a new ECU and wire harness, he didn’t want to pay for that.. car was flooded twice..

[StrokerAce]

Make it a track car. Anyone who would sell that to someone on the premise that it's a good car has no morals.

[ViperGeorge]

I sent the eBay seller the history of the car including pictures. Now let's see if they change the ad. They do have 100% positive feedback so maybe they honestly don't know the car's history. If they don't modify the ad I guess the next step would be to report the ad to eBay.

[ViperGeorge]

I sent the eBay seller the history of the car including pictures. Now let's see if they change the ad. They do have 100% positive feedback so maybe they honestly don't know the car's history. If they don't modify the ad I guess the next step would be to report the ad to eBay.

No response from selling dealer so I reported this item to eBay's customer service.

[ViperGeorge]

Response from eBay on my reporting of the TA 49/68. I sent them pictures to go along with the report. Maybe it will save some unsuspecting person from buying a POS.

"Thank you for writing back to eBay about the listing of the seller 'mmgcars'.

First of all, I appreciate your efforts in trying to report this listing through our 'Report item' link on the listing page and I understand that you have not seen the appropriate category or description for your report. I'm here to assist you on this.

I have checked on the car listing and this is definitely worth reporting and investigating, rest assured that I've now forwarded the details of the listing as well as the seller to our specialized team. This triggers on checking all their account activities including all the items they have listed and sold. After the investigation, we will send the seller a warning, remove all their listings, or limit the seller's buying and selling privileges.

To set your expectation, for any action or sanctions that will be taken against the seller we may no longer have to divulge this to you for privacy reasons but rest assured that proper action will be done, as we take these reports seriously.. For now, please consider this report as done.

I trust this information has been helpful and I wish you all the best on eBay in the future."

[ACRSNK]

You may have just saved someone from a lot of heartache.

[Fatboy 18]

You may have just saved someone from a lot of heartache.

Well the advert still seems to be being displayed on eBay.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/275151225748?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110 01%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D201609081050 57%26meid%3D373d6313f00649ef82cd2b6609dacd3c%26pid %3D100675%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D15%26sd%3D184585384746% 26itm%3D275151225748%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D23 80057&_trksid=p2380057.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci%3A6ab7b01b-9a8a-11ec-b70d-42bcf056042f%7Cparentrq%3A4d37e39f17f0ad343a9cc6fd fff2c3ba%7Ciid%3A1

[ViperGeorge]

Well the advert still seems to be being displayed on eBay.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/275151225748?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110 01%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D201609081050 57%26meid%3D373d6313f00649ef82cd2b6609dacd3c%26pid %3D100675%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D15%26sd%3D184585384746% 26itm%3D275151225748%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D23 80057&_trksid=p2380057.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci%3A6ab7b01b-9a8a-11ec-b70d-42bcf056042f%7Cparentrq%3A4d37e39f17f0ad343a9cc6fd fff2c3ba%7Ciid%3A1

Yes, it probably takes eBay's "specialized team" a few days to even look at the issue.

[Fatboy 18]

Yes, it probably takes eBay's "specialized team" a few days to even look at the issue.

Advert is now doing the rounds on the Viper Facebook Pages too

[StrokerAce]

Yes, it probably takes eBay's "specialized team" a few days to even look at the issue.

Is this one of them?

50873

[SlateEd]

Hey Guys - I think #49 has resurfaced - https://www.mmgcars.com/details/used-2014-dodge-srt-viper/81964636

A friend of mine asked me to look into it for a friend of his....

I'm thankful as always for this community and the resources we pool. A really nice guy avoided making #49 his first Viper today.

[SRT_BluByU]

Has someone already told the monaco motor group about this viper and it history??

[ViperGeorge]

Has someone already told the monaco motor group about this viper and it history??

Yes, I told them but they never responded. I even sent them pictures. Since they never responded I notified eBay of the car's history. They said they would take action and I just noticed the item has ended on eBay.

[ACRSNK]

I would be beside myself if I unknowingly purchased that car!

[VENOM-TA]

Hey Guys - I think #49 has resurfaced - https://www.mmgcars.com/details/used-2014-dodge-srt-viper/81964636

A friend of mine asked me to look into it for a friend of his....

I'm thankful as always for this community and the resources we pool. A really nice guy avoided making #49 his first Viper today.

No shit, look 3-4 posts up.. lol

[SlateEd]

No shit, look 3-4 posts up.. lol

exactly

[Brian E]

Yes, I told them but they never responded. I even sent them pictures. Since they never responded I notified eBay of the car's history. They said they would take action and I just noticed the item has ended on eBay.


Looks like it has just been relisted for sale.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/275196192981?hash=item4012f8a8d5:g:h6cAAOSwoBRiERl s

[ViperGeorge]

Looks like it has just been relisted for sale.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/275196192981?hash=item4012f8a8d5:g:h6cAAOSwoBRiERl s

Well I tried.

[Fatboy 18]

Well for what its worth, I too have reported it.

[Steve M]

Looks like it has just been relisted for sale.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/275196192981?hash=item4012f8a8d5:g:h6cAAOSwoBRiERl s


Well I tried.


Well for what its worth, I too have reported it.

What about reporting it to Carfax (or something similar)?

The car shows up as 5 owner car with no accidents.

That's likely the only way to stop this car being passed off as a pristine example of a Viper that is priced as such when we all know there's way more history than what the "official" records show.

[StrokerAce]

Has someone already told the monaco motor group about this viper and it history??

Hook has been baited. :)

[Mikey]

I contacted carfax with the vin and photos, they'll get to me Monday

[Lawineer]

What does everyone think FMV is for this thing? I bet a lot of buyers would line up at 70k with full disclosure.

[Fatboy 18]

What does everyone think FMV is for this thing? I bet a lot of buyers would line up at 70k with full disclosure.

What does FMV mean?

If somone is trying to sell the car with a clean washed title, that's just plain wrong, Full disclosure is the ONLY way this car should be sold.

[Lawineer]

What does FMV mean?

If somone is trying to sell the car with a clean washed title, that's just plain wrong, Full disclosure is the ONLY way this car should be sold.

fair market value. IE: put on ebay with a link to this thread.

[Steve M]

What does everyone think FMV is for this thing? I bet a lot of buyers would line up at 70k with full disclosure.

$70k is a lot of money to pay for a guaranteed headache. If the car looks that beat in the pictures (and it does), I can't imagine what it looks like in person.

[Lawineer]

$70k is a lot of money to pay for a guaranteed headache. If the car looks that beat in the pictures (and it does), I can't imagine what it looks like in person.
I’m probably in at a max of $40-50k. But I have a Gen 5, a race car and value not having a headache a lot more than others. I bet someone would pay $70k with eyes wide open.

[SRT_BluByU]

Id be in for parts i suppose… maybe $30k

[StrokerAce]

I'd be in at $40-50k.

[James]

Well for what its worth, I too have reported it.
Copy that, just did so too.

[TIME]

I contacted carfax with the vin and photos, they'll get to me Monday

Thank you!

[StrokerAce]

I just received an email from them.

"Good morning Handsome (that's me),

Attached you will find a CARFAX for the Viper. As the images suggest, the car is in great shape. We did not discover any notable issues with it. As in any pre-owned automobile, there are a few cosmetic imprefections which we've zoomed in on. If you view all the pictures provided, you should have a good understanding of the overall condition of the car. All in all, it is in great shape.

Feel free to reach out if you have any questions or if you'd like to come by to check it out in person: (407) 739-0607.

Best,
Aamir"

Carfax shows nothing.

[Fatboy 18]

I just received an email from them.

"Good morning Handsome (that's me),

Attached you will find a CARFAX for the Viper. As the images suggest, the car is in great shape. We did not discover any notable issues with it. As in any pre-owned automobile, there are a few cosmetic imprefections which we've zoomed in on. If you view all the pictures provided, you should have a good understanding of the overall condition of the car. All in all, it is in great shape.

Feel free to reach out if you have any questions or if you'd like to come by to check it out in person: (407) 739-0607.

Best,
Aamir"

Carfax shows nothing.

So this email was from the company selling the car or eBay admin? I notice in the ebay add there are no interior pics! Could the Police get involved?

[SRT_BluByU]

has anyone reached out to the dealer directly and pointed them here so they can learn first hand about the cars history?

[98intrigue]

has anyone reached out to the dealer directly and pointed them here so they can learn first hand about the cars history?

I’m on it. Dealer responded with the VIN tonight. I’ll reply to them tomorrow directing them here.

[ViperGeorge]

has anyone reached out to the dealer directly and pointed them here so they can learn first hand about the cars history?

I sent the dealer a note with pictures about 10 days ago. I told them the history of both 49 and 68. They never responded.

[StrokerAce]

So this email was from the company selling the car or eBay admin? I notice in the ebay add there are no interior pics! Could the Police get involved?

From the company.

I asked them for a picture of the dash plaque. That way I can ask why it's not correct for the car. I'm west of them I think maybe 45 miles.

[AZTVR]

I think that the problem here is that almost all of what has been posted about car number 49 is hearsay (but, maybe the lawyers here would disagree with my untrained conclusion.) It is all good enough for me to use to decide that I would avoid this car; but, I don't see any evidence that the car title was "washed" as stated above. There are photos from "anonymous" people of evidence of water stains that existed some time in the past. Yes, I believe the posts; but, does a corporation like eBay, or Carfax use that kind of information to deny service, or to "brand" a car? What would eBay's and Carfax' lawyers tell them to do based on emails from people with photos of a car that could be the one advertised or maybe not, and descriptions of things posted on an internet forum?

[Oh Three Z]

I might be wrong but I seem to recall seeing pics of “rusty” door panel speaker grills from car 49. Certainly not a smoking gun but if my memory is correct it enhances the proof of submersion

[VENOM-TA]

I might be wrong but I seem to recall seeing pics of “rusty” door panel speaker grills from car 49. Certainly not a smoking gun but if my memory is correct it enhances the proof of submersion
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