Looking for a Gen2

[Wd40]

Trying to join the club and looking for my first viper.
Looking for a gen2. Not really looking for any color specifics, though id love silver/graphite. Not really picky on mods or mileage either. Just looking for something in good condition.
Please let me know if anyone is interested in selling.
Feel free to contact me at my cell,
305-479-6767

Thank you!

Just a quick edit here.. i dont mind paying more if the car is modified (sc, rims, etc)
My 35-38k price range is for stock. Thanks!

[City]

I'm hoping you already checked, but there's 3 excellent choices listed for sale in our classified area.

https://driveviper.com/classifieds/g3-gen-ii.html

Also, I see that you're not very particular, but without a mention of budget, it's difficult for members to assist.

[Wd40]

Hey bud. Yeah i did check those thank you. N i guess i did forget to mention budget. I would like to stay around 35-38k

[dave6666]

Shouldn't be difficult to find a clean car in that price range. You'll hear tons of arguments that what you are looking for is worth more than that but the reality is most Vipers are selling in the price range you are looking at.

[Wd40]

I hope your right buddy!

[Wd40]

I can bump the price range up a bit if its close to florida or deppending on mods...

[AustinK]

As Dave mentioned, you're right on the money at $35-38K. Check out my analysis on Viper values here (https://driveviper.com/forums/threads/16675-Gen-II-Pricing?p=362924&viewfull=1#post362924) and here (https://driveviper.com/forums/threads/16675-Gen-II-Pricing?p=363009&viewfull=1#post363009).

There are some high priced examples, and plenty of anecdotes and general sentiment around an inflated value of the car. It doesn't hold up against the data.

Case and point: Two cars that match your spec, right in your price range. This one (https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourc eContext=untrackedWithinSite_false_0&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=AUTO&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity=c1742&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity2=c1678&zip=95134&distance=50000&searchChanged=true&modelChanged=false&filtersModified=true#listing=219524231) in California for $36K (30K miles) and this one (https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourc eContext=untrackedWithinSite_false_0&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=AUTO&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity=c1742&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity2=c1678&zip=95134&distance=50000&searchChanged=true&modelChanged=false&filtersModified=true#listing=220313850) in Kentucky for $38K (20K miles).

[ACRSNK]

I think you will have to crack $40K to find one worth having. Best of luck with your search.

[Wd40]

At the rate im going, looks like ill be cracking 40k soon.
Are you selling that 2002 acr?

[AustinK]

I think you will have to crack $40K to find one worth having. Best of luck with your search.

No way. Do that and you're grossly overpaying. Read the analyses and review the listings that I linked above. All of the market data available on Viper values blatantly contradicts a $40K valuation for a clean car with moderate miles. Cars that fit OPs description were selling for $25K at Mecum today. Crack $40K and you better be looking at an excellent condition, very low miles garage queen.

Good condition Gen II RT/10 is selling at retail for $36K, and the GTS for $38K.

[99RT10]

I can bump the price range up a bit if its close to florida or deppending on mods...

I have a 1998 GTS I would sell for $39K, new paint, not stock.

[99RT10]

No way. Do that and you're grossly overpaying. Read the analyses and review the listings that I linked above. All of the market data available on Viper values blatantly contradicts a $40K valuation for a clean car with moderate miles. Cars that fit OPs description were selling for $25K at Mecum today. Crack $40K and you better be looking at an excellent condition, very low miles garage queen.

Good condition Gen II RT/10 is selling at retail for $36K, and the GTS for $38K.

You need to stay away from the drugs. Crack is wack. The 2000 RT sold for $45K. That is about right an does not include the buyers premium.

[Wd40]

Austin thank u for the help bud!
99rt10 please sent me info on ur gts. I sent u a PM

[AustinK]

You need to stay away from the drugs. Crack is wack. The 2000 RT sold for $45K. That is about right an does not include the buyers premium.

That car (https://www.mecum.com/lots/DA1018-361209/2000-dodge-viper-rt10-roadster/) had 1,600 actual miles on it. And not to be pedantic, but it didn't sell. Even as a prime collector car, bidders weren't valuing it past its reserve, hence my point about inflated values. On the other hand, this 1998 RT/10 (https://www.mecum.com/lots/DA1018-332453/1998-dodge-viper-rt10-roadster/) with 24,000 miles on it sold for $25,300. Add the buyers premium and that car rolled away for $27,800. Or how about this 1996 RT/10 (https://www.mecum.com/lots/DA1018-332969/1996-dodge-viper-rt10-roadster/) that sold for $26,400. Or perhaps this 1996 RT/10 (https://www.mecum.com/lots/DA1018-332117/1996-dodge-viper-rt10-roadster/) that stopped at $22,000. Today, these cars sold at the same auction as the expensive RT/10 that you mentioned, and they actually fit OPs description. Why did you leave them out?

I appreciate that you're currently selling two vipers, and it looks like you're considering a third, so you have a vested interest in this topic. But if you want to accuse me of being off the mark with my valuations, please provide some data to the contrary, beyond an outlier auction example that is of Concours quality (and didn't even sell) when OP is simply looking for a good condition driver (and isn't picky about miles or mods). That's a completely different class of car.

And it's valued, using national market data, at $36,800 (https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools/1998-Dodge-Viper-RT!10) for 1998, or $29,900 (https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools/1996-Dodge-Viper-RT!10) for 1996. Consider that in the context of my initial valuation and the auction sales, and you'll find that both my valuation and Hagerty's valuation is generous.

I'm put off by how often I see threads where someone is looking to buy a Viper and join this community, and they get bombarded with absurd valuations citing nothing beyond anecdotes and irrelevant outliers. And all too often, those valuations are coming from people who are selling Vipers themselves. It's dishonest and a terrible introduction to what I've found to be an otherwise humble and welcoming group of enthusiasts.

[Wd40]

Austin thank u for the help bud!
99rt10 please sent me info on ur gts. I sent u a PM

[Patentlaw]

That car (https://www.mecum.com/lots/DA1018-361209/2000-dodge-viper-rt10-roadster/) had 1,600 actual miles on it. And not to be pedantic, but it didn't sell. Even as a prime collector car, bidders weren't valuing it past its reserve, hence my point about inflated values. On the other hand, this 1998 RT/10 (https://www.mecum.com/lots/DA1018-332453/1998-dodge-viper-rt10-roadster/) with 24,000 miles on it sold for $25,300. Add the buyers premium and that car rolled away for $27,800. Or how about this 1996 RT/10 (https://www.mecum.com/lots/DA1018-332969/1996-dodge-viper-rt10-roadster/) that sold for $26,400. Or perhaps this 1996 RT/10 (https://www.mecum.com/lots/DA1018-332117/1996-dodge-viper-rt10-roadster/) that stopped at $22,000. Today, these cars sold at the same auction as the expensive RT/10 that you mentioned, and they actually fit OPs description. Why did you leave them out?

I appreciate that you're currently selling two vipers, and it looks like you're considering a third, so you have a vested interest in this topic. But if you want to accuse me of being off the mark with my valuations, please provide some data to the contrary, beyond an outlier auction example that is of Concours quality (and didn't even sell) when OP is simply looking for a good condition driver (and isn't picky about miles or mods). That's a completely different class of car.

And it's valued, using national market data, at $36,800 (https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools/1998-Dodge-Viper-RT!10) for 1998, or $29,900 (https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools/1996-Dodge-Viper-RT!10) for 1996. Consider that in the context of my initial valuation and the auction sales, and you'll find that both my valuation and Hagerty's valuation is generous.

I'm put off by how often I see threads where someone is looking to buy a Viper and join this community, and they get bombarded with absurd valuations citing nothing beyond anecdotes and irrelevant outliers. And all too often, those valuations are coming from people who are selling Vipers themselves. It's dishonest and a terrible introduction to what I've found to be an otherwise humble and welcoming group of enthusiasts.

What is dishonest is providing values for one type of car and not the range of values. You will note that the original poster DID NOT STATE that he wanted an RT 10. Why do you constantly post values of the RT10? That creates an unfair and un realistic expectation. For all you know, he wanted a GTS? Explaining to him that the values drastically differ is more realistic. Yes, you can get RT10s with generally high mileage for the values you state. The GTS commands more money. That is just the reality.


To the original poster, good luck with your search. There are constant threads on the value of these cars. If I were you, try to get an original car. There are a ton of people who just butcher their car and then try to unload it. The cars themselves really never break if in original condition. The only thing that really is an issue on the Gen II cars is that they have a tendency to eat batteries. Air conditioning is fair to poor on the cars.

Also, wait a couple of months. The deals will appear. Near winter the deals get better. Also, I see that you are in Florida. You can buy from up north and still use the car during the winter where you are. Frank Barba on here transports cars.

[AustinK]

What is dishonest is providing values for one type of car and not the range of values. You will note that the original poster DID NOT STATE that he wanted an RT 10. Why do you constantly post values of the RT10?

Did you read the analysis that I linked to in my first reply? It was on the Gen II GTS and it concluded that $37,900 was the current market value for a good example.

I then shared two RT/10s that fit OP's spec, because they were the color and mileage that he requested. He never specified a model.

In my next reply, I shared valuations on both the RT/10 and the GTS. Following that, I replied to 99RT10's statement about an RT/10 selling for $45K. It only made sense to use RT/10's as the reference. I also explicitly labeled each link and reference with "RT/10". That's hardly dishonest.

I've fully covered the GTS, and it was the first thing I did.

But it does bring up a good question: WD40, do you have a preference between a GTS and an RT/10? Or are either fine?

[Wd40]

Sweet deal! Appreciate the help! I will try to sit n wait. Lol. Anxiety builds.

- - - Updated - - -

Def gts! Just like the style more

[Wd40]

Def gts! Just like the style more

[AustinK]

Def gts! Just like the style more

That definitely impacts value. You'll probably crack $40K, unless you get the right 1996 GTS. Anything newer than that is likely worth over $40K, so long as it's in good condition and doesn't have high miles.

I would pull together more valuations on this, but I'm on the road right now. I'll do a full GTS and RT/10 analysis post in the future.

[soundkillr]

Gts is definitely worth more. Part of the problem with comparing market prices with the Viper is this, there are several market comps that are rebuilt titles and bring over all prices down. When I was looking for my gts, I saw many cars with lower prices, and every one of them was a salvage or rebuilt title. Not sure why the Viper marquee has so many salvage titles, but it does affect averages, especially when software can't differentiate between the two.

[AustinK]

Not sure why the Viper marquee has so many salvage titles, but it does affect averages, especially when software can't differentiate between the two.

Actually, the software does differentiate and separate high miles cars, accident or salvage cars, fleet cars, etc. into a lower class labeled "fair". My analysis was based on "good", which excludes these cars and requires a clean title, clean condition, lower miles, etc. So from a quantitative analysis perspective, this doesn't apply. But you're still getting at a good point; I'll break that out whenever I do a full analysis post.

Qualitatively, I can see how this would affect you. It's easy to see several low prices and think that's actually the fair price, when in reality, the car has a bad history. CarGurus helps with this, as they share title status, fleet status, owner count, etc. and allow you to filter by it.

You're totally right that there is a big difference between the RT/10 and the GTS, and that gap widens when the GTS has certain desirable features. The value also climbs with each model year (generally, newer is more expensive, but not always).

[ACRSNK]

No way. Do that and you're grossly overpaying. Read the analyses and review the listings that I linked above. All of the market data available on Viper values blatantly contradicts a $40K valuation for a clean car with moderate miles. Cars that fit OPs description were selling for $25K at Mecum today. Crack $40K and you better be looking at an excellent condition, very low miles garage queen.

Good condition Gen II RT/10 is selling at retail for $36K, and the GTS for $38K.

Lol...Exactly how many Vipers have you bought and sold, or currently own, or have owned? Can’t be many if any. You know what I would ask you to do with your graph if you ever showed up with that looking to buy one of my Vipers? Your little chart in no way reflects true market values on a clean low mile GTS. Can one be had for under $40K? Sure, but it will be a car with needs. Little things add up quick on these cars. To the OP...find the best car you can afford and negotiate a deal on that car. If you are looking for an ACR, expect to pay quite a bit more. And for the love of God, don’t look at RT/10 prices when you are coming up with numbers for a GTS.

[AustinK]

Your little chart in no way reflects true market values on a clean low mile GTS.

My little chart (https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools/1996-Dodge-Viper-GTS) isn't mine, and it isn't little. It's national market data (https://www.hagerty.com/valuationtools/About-our-prices).


You know what I would ask you to do with your graph if you ever showed up with that looking to buy one of my Vipers?

You can react however you like. It doesn't change the market value of your car.

[soundkillr]

Honestly while I appreciate your list, it just doesn't follow the market based on what I've seen. I know what acrsnk is saying, and I don't think he would consider your list a basis for his values. To do so would be.... Just wrong.

[AustinK]

Honestly while I appreciate your list, it just doesn't follow the market based on what I've seen. I know what acrsnk is saying, and I don't think he would consider your list a basis for his values. To do so would be.... Just wrong.

That's understandable. I'm just presenting it as data; I can see why it may upset some people, and I respect that. I'm not trying to tear down people's cars or what they feel they're worth. But it's worth being aware of the macro value of the car, and being honest about it. The values that you're exposed to (auctions, dealer list prices, anecdotes) often won't reflect the market as a whole, whereas this data does.

Of course, as we've all pointed out, values do fluctuate a bunch depending on model, year, condition, history, etc. ACRSNK appears to have a 2002 ACR. The values that I've shared are fully non-applicable to that car. But that much should be fairly obvious.

This is why I want to do a more comprehensive analysis. Perhaps it will make more sense then.

But really, I didn't want to upset anyone here. I just wanted to provide fair and objective guidance to OP, and unfortunately, we weren't always clear on what OP wanted.

[ACRSNK]

Sorry, but your chart does nothing for the Viper educated people on here except maybe make them laugh. Do you even, or have you ever owned a Viper?

[AustinK]

Sorry, but your chart does nothing for the Viper educated people on here except maybe make them laugh.

This is precisely the point that I've been getting at. I see a lot of numbers thrown around here that are inaccurate, and whenever someone attempts to correct those numbers, they get attacked.

I deal with big data and experimentation as part of my profession. Often, I find that data has an innately humbling quality to it, because it's objective. I may hypothesize one thing at the beginning of the experiment, and then get data back which tells me that I was completely wrong. That's a humbling thing to experience, and it helps expose you to your own bias and subjectivity. You are a data point of one, and a biased one at that. And while I'm not sure what it means to be "Viper educated" or how that even pertains to disputing hard market data, I am sure that being aware of real market data would be the first step in being "Viper educated". And yet, you can't seem to wrap your mind around the market data.

Perhaps it's because you're dealing with a different class of car. You have an incredible garage, and I imagine that you run with people that have similarly impressive cars. They aren't the norm, and neither are you. I never meant to insinuate that you were, nor that your cars were. As I mentioned earlier, your ACR is in a completely different class and this data isn't relevant to it. But it is relevant to OP, and for that matter, the Viper market at large.

You can subjectively disagree with this, but you should also be aware that you haven't provided anything concrete or legitimate to support that disagreement. It's based on your feelings and experience, and while I'm sure that's vast and credible, it isn't market data.


Do you even, or have you ever owned a Viper?

Yes, though I'm not sure how ownership qualifies/disqualifies someone from being informed on this topic. The data is public. If anything, ownership induces bias and renders one less fit to discuss this topic rationally.


For 10 months, I ran searches on Gen II Viper ACRs that sold and the kind of condition the appeared to be in with documentation. Along the way, sellers and owners essentially called me crazy - didn't return calls/emails.

In the end, I did the research I needed to do to buy the Viper I wanted to buy. Put in whatever level of research you need to feel as good about your Viper like I do a year later. Everybody else can go pound sand unless they are buying the car for you.

This is great advice, and a nice observation.

I've noticed the same thing: These are special cars. Some would say, collector cars. Or perhaps more accurately, affordable collector cars. Collectors are passionate, and even more-so when they worked hard for the car(s) that they own. This is the story of many Viper owners. Hard-working, passionate people that earned their cars and truly love them. In my opinion, that's what makes this community so great. But it also means that you'll run up against a lot of different valuations, because these cars hold different values and meanings to different people.

[Bill W]

Two weeks ago I bought a 2002 RT/10 (red with black interior) for $40,000. The buyer wouldn't budge on the price. One owner, 11,500 miles, hard top, soft top (never used), tonneau cover (never used), excellent to near perfect conditon exterior and interior--I couldn't be happier--got the car I wanted for what I considered to be a fair price. I realize I may have found one just as nice for less money, but decided not to wait and chance that this one would sell to somebody else. I spent several thousand dollars on four new tires (originals came on car), a new power steering pully and some hoses. Also had all fluids flushed and replenished. Yes, I could have bought a number of "fast" and shiny cars brand new off the lot, but I got what I've always wanted since the first time I laid eyes on one back in 1993. I love the body style of an RT/10. My advice is to be patient, spend time on this forum researching information, and try to learn as much about these cars as you can. When the right Viper comes along you will know it all the way into your bones. That's the one you should buy. Good luck with your hunt. ;)

[AustinK]

Two weeks ago I bought a 2002 RT/10 (red with black interior) for $40,000. The buyer wouldn't budge on the price. One owner, 11,500 miles, hard top, soft top (never used), tonneau cover (never used), excellent to near perfect conditon exterior and interior--I couldn't be happier--got the car I wanted for what I considered to be a fair price. I realize I may have found one just as nice for less money, but decided not to wait and chance that this one would sell to somebody else.

I actually think you got a good deal on that car. It sounds like it's in excellent condition and it's a 2002 model year, so $40K is under its market value (https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools/2002-Dodge-Viper-RT!10). Not to mention, it's the one you wanted, which is the most important thing.

[98RedGTS]

I actually think you got a good deal on that car. It sounds like it's in excellent condition and it's a 2002 model year, so $40K is under its market value (https://www.hagerty.com/apps/valuationtools/2002-Dodge-Viper-RT!10). Not to mention, it's the one you wanted, which is the most important thing.

40K for an RT10 with 11.5K miles on it and needed new tires is under it's market value?

I'm sorry but that comment alone makes me question your data. That's actually a fair chunk above market value IMHO for an RT10. If that is under market I stole my GTS in the same condition as his RT10 as I only paid $37.5K for it. It's a 98 but their isn't that big of a difference between 98 and 02 for Red non ACR cars.

[AustinK]

40K for an RT10 with 11.5K miles on it and needed new tires is under it's market value?

I'm sorry but that comment alone makes me question your data. That's actually a fair chunk above market value IMHO for an RT10. If that is under market I stole my GTS in the same condition as his RT10 as I only paid $37.5K for it. It's a 98 but their isn't that big of a difference between 98 and 02 for Red non ACR cars.

I agree that $40K sounds very high, and a GTS can be had for less. I need to dig into this one more. But in general, I've observed that model year can affect value considerably. It feels like it shouldn't though.

[DublinOH]

In my opinion, A vehicle is worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Worth is subjective and dependent upon many things, desire being one of them. If you have a nice car that is worth $50k to you, all you need to do is find one person who agrees with your valuation. If you can't find anyone willing to spend what you feel your car is worth to you, keep it.

[98RedGTS]

I agree that $40K sounds very high, and a GTS can be had for less. I need to dig into this one more. But in general, I've observed that model year can affect value considerably. It feels like it shouldn't though.

I'd be interested to see more data around that. In the 2.5 years I looked I didn't see much price fluctuation with model year and in some cases it actually felt as though pricing was higher on the older cars in the same condition and mileage. Think that was due to the engine change. For the Gen2 It seemed like the only thing that impacted price (outside of general condition which is the obvious point) was:
- RT vs GTS
- ACR vs Non-ACR
- Exterior color - Blue/White 96/97
- Miles

Outside of that it was just normal factors like overall condition and region that dictated the price.

[AustinK]

That makes sense to me. I agree that we need more data here. Model year will play a role in any car's value, but I think the question is whether it should play such a large role in the Viper's.

A couple quick (https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/2002/Dodge/Viper/San+Francisco+CA-94115?zip=94115&startYear=2002&endYear=2002&makeCodeList=DODGE&searchRadius=0&modelCodeList=VIPER&sortBy=derivedpriceDESC&numRecords=25&firstRecord=0) searches (https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourc eContext=RecentSearches_false_0&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=AUTO&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity=c1678&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity2=c1678&zip=94115&distance=50000&searchChanged=true&modelChanged=false&filtersModified=true) seem to return results that corroborate the data I shared, but that's such a small sample size that it's basically moot.

I'd say you're correct with the factors that affect value, though I would add:

- Year (in general, but especially if it's a notable year, like the first or last)
- Mods (unmolested cars are most valuable, mods tank a car's value)
- History (as with any car, but this tends to be more important with Vipers, ie. "did you track it?" rather than just "show me the carfax")

[Charged01ACR]

I gave $50k for my '01 Viper ACR if it helps anyone. Original owner 14k miles. ROE supercharger, full exhaust yada yada you can see the specifics in my signature. I feel I got a good deal but yes everything in this life is only worth what you or someone is willing to pay for it. I've had everything other than a Viper. So to me there is nothing cooler and more rare for the money. Now keep in mind you can buy a lot of cool stuff with 50k but it will be something you see more of (Mustang, Camaro, Corvette, Hellcat ect) How often you roll up in your local cruise in and see a Viper period? Just my opinion and my 2 cents

[Bill W]

40K for an RT10 with 11.5K miles on it and needed new tires is under it's market value?

I'm sorry but that comment alone makes me question your data. That's actually a fair chunk above market value IMHO for an RT10. If that is under market I stole my GTS in the same condition as his RT10 as I only paid $37.5K for it. It's a 98 but their isn't that big of a difference between 98 and 02 for Red non ACR cars.

Never intended to make anyone beleive I thought I got a deal on my Viper. Just sayin' I thought it was a fair price for the car. Yes, could have done better, perhaps, but I'm happy with my decison. Interesting thread, however.

[AustinK]

All great points. Thanks for adding to the list. I agree that miles v. price is a good place to start, and you're totally right about looking at more than one car. The more time you research, and the more willing you are to walk away, the more likely you are to find the right deal.

[mitchdob]

I find it amazing how Viper owners are always the ones undervaluing the cars. I don't see it from others looking at the cars.... only from Viper owners on Viper forums. No wonder the value hasn't risen as some have expected. And yea, I own a Viper - a 2000 Steel Gray Pearl ACR, third owner, 14,800+ miles, maintained by SPT (yep, its modified and I love it).

The car is amazing... and its worth more to me then any of your intellectual estimates.

[soundkillr]

I find it amazing how Viper owners are always the ones undervaluing the cars. I don't see it from others looking at the cars.... only from Viper owners on Viper forums. No wonder the value hasn't risen as some have expected. And yea, I own a Viper - a 2000 Steel Gray Pearl ACR, third owner, 14,800+ miles, maintained by SPT (yep, its modified and I love it).

The car is amazing... and its worth more to me then any of your intellectual estimates.

Right on man!

[AustinK]

Yikes. This conversation devolved.

I'm not going to explain what I've already explained multiple times, because it seems you all don't care and don't want to hear it. That's alright. At the end of the day, OP is more informed.

[Wd40]

Soooo, anyone selling there gts!? Lol

[mitchdob]

Soooo, anyone selling there gts!? Lol

Not me!! The car's worth way too much (money) to me.
... but I'm sure you'll find one. There are some great cars out there.
But for sure once you find it make sure to have a experienced/qualified Viper tech check the car out.

Here's also some helpful reading on GenII's: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B-EETikFmFLnZHFzM3VGZVdPdnM/edit?pli=1

[Jeremyb]

I might consider selling my tt fully built b/w 97 gts.

[Wd40]

Jeremyb Sent u a PM with contact info. Thanx

[ACRSNK]

This is precisely the point that I've been getting at. I see a lot of numbers thrown around here that are inaccurate, and whenever someone attempts to correct those numbers, they get attacked.

I deal with big data and experimentation as part of my profession. Often, I find that data has an innately humbling quality to it, because it's objective. I may hypothesize one thing at the beginning of the experiment, and then get data back which tells me that I was completely wrong. That's a humbling thing to experience, and it helps expose you to your own bias and subjectivity. You are a data point of one, and a biased one at that. And while I'm not sure what it means to be "Viper educated" or how that even pertains to disputing hard market data, I am sure that being aware of real market data would be the first step in being "Viper educated". And yet, you can't seem to wrap your mind around the market data.

Perhaps it's because you're dealing with a different class of car. You have an incredible garage, and I imagine that you run with people that have similarly impressive cars. They aren't the norm, and neither are you. I never meant to insinuate that you were, nor that your cars were. As I mentioned earlier, your ACR is in a completely different class and this data isn't relevant to it. But it is relevant to OP, and for that matter, the Viper market at large.

You can subjectively disagree with this, but you should also be aware that you haven't provided anything concrete or legitimate to support that disagreement. It's based on your feelings and experience, and while I'm sure that's vast and credible, it isn't market data.



Yes, though I'm not sure how ownership qualifies/disqualifies someone from being informed on this topic. The data is public. If anything, ownership induces bias and renders one less fit to discuss this topic rationally.



This is great advice, and a nice observation.

I've noticed the same thing: These are special cars. Some would say, collector cars. Or perhaps more accurately, affordable collector cars. Collectors are passionate, and even more-so when they worked hard for the car(s) that they own. This is the story of many Viper owners. Hard-working, passionate people that earned their cars and truly love them. In my opinion, that's what makes this community so great. But it also means that you'll run up against a lot of different valuations, because these cars hold different values and meanings to different people.

Your approach to Viper values is flawed from the get go. With so few Vipers produced in its 25 year life span, any outliers, high and low will throw off your "data" big time. As my engineer friends often say...when the results disagree with the theory and the data, scrap the theory and the data and believe the results. This "data" reminds me of "data" that people often go onto the Cobra R forums with. It's absolutely hilarious! People go on there all the time stating that a 2000 Cobra R is worth $25K because all of the "data" says so, only no one can ever find one for sale that cheap. I know what I paid for mine and what it took to get / find mine and I can tell you with respect to my Cobra R, or any of my Vipers, "data" may be a starting point, but with rare cars such as these, it doesn't mean much as any given GTS may have multiple reasons for being worth more, or less than the "data" suggests. Is a popular color, was it a forged motor lumpy cam year, ABS year, B/W, red GTS vs. just about any other color, etc., etc., etc.

[BlknBlu]

Welcome to the 2005 Buyers guide. Sorry I couldn't resist.

Bruce

[slitherv10]

...and thus why the Viper is dead

[slitherv10]

Hey OP...

The way some people here are explaining to you the viper and its value, you would be crazy to even consider buying one.
Spend 35-38K for a clean low mile Viper and it will be worth 20K in a few years according to some on this thread. Your better off buying a clean civic R spec or Jeep wrangler as they hold values well and you will be rich in no time.

[COI]

If the testosterone rush of owning a Viper comes from "getting a good deal" then you're looking at the wrong car. Too many variables go into the value of a car.
Does it need new tires? How many miles? Maintenance history? Has it been damaged? Etc., etc., etc.

Buy a Viper and then never tell anyone what you paid for it. I guarantee you'll be in the overwhelming majority of happy Viper owners.

[Wd40]

Civic R. Lol!!

[sambo32]

Possibly looking to purchase a 2002 RT/10, is yellow more common for this year. There are a few low mileage yellow one on the market, raging in price from 44k to 49k. My preferred color is red, but might consider yellow.

[Wd40]

interested to see where else this thread can go..
To a dispute on value to now someone looking for an rt/10 ��

[sambo32]

interested to see where else this thread can go..
To a dispute on value to now someone looking for an rt/10 ��

The tile does say "Looking for a Gen2 " so I though this was the right place for my question.

[Bill W]

Dodge built 545 RT/10 Vipers in 2002. There were 181 red, 178 yellow and 186 graphite metallic

34821

[sambo32]

Thank you for the chart.

[Baked]

I have a 2000 GTS, black with silver stripes, with a Paxton supercharger and corsa exhaust if interested. Canadian car with ~ 33k miles.34823

[Wd40]

Pm sent. Feel free to shoot over some more info

[Matt Dillon]

I have a 2000 GTS, black with silver stripes, with a Paxton supercharger and corsa exhaust if interested. Canadian car with ~ 33k miles.34823

I Thought he wanted a RT/10?

[Wd40]

No sir... that was someone else that decided to post here as well. Definetly GTS!

[ellowviper]

One of One...before the Gen-V 1 of 1 program!!

[slitherv10]

As I write this I’m at the Toronto Fall Classic Car Auction, a 1996 B/W GTS crossed the block. 4500km on the odometer and original owner. Very good condition.

SOLD FOR 82,500 Canadian dollars.

Canadian dollars. US dollars would be how much?

[Viper98]

$63311.89