Save the Viper Keep up with the quot Jones s quot

[Pappy]

The only way I was going to keep up with the "Jones's", (AKA AZ) with my ACR was to mod it heavily and beat it to death, so I decided to finish an old track car project to preserve the Viper. Basically, it is a 56 Corvette body (stop laughing until you hear the rest) on a sophisticated, high-travel/low-roll fabricated suspension, 515 inch all aluminum BBC moved back 14 inches, 335/18 and 345/18 tires/wheels, big StopTechs. lots of aero mods and carbon fiber, and hopefully weighing in at 2600# dry. I am replacing my current IRS with a Detroit Speed DecaLink (for strength) and Larry's Engine and Marine (known for his offshore BBC race motors) is building a stout BBC: big bore/short stroke aluminum Brodix (4.6 bore/3.875 stroke), Calles crank and rods, 13:1 JE's, Comp Cams solid roller, TD shaft rockers, Daily billet dry sump, and a Hogan fabricated sequential injection intake system. Shane Tecklenburg is integrating the MoTec ECU (computer, sensors, injectors, harness, tune) and AZ convinced me to add a stand-alone BMW ABS system which will provide inputs to the MoTec for traction control, if I decide to go that way. The clutch is a Tilton triple-disk carbon assembly and I have a TKO 600 extreme built by American Speed (rated for 950 ft/lbs) with a .82 fifth gear. Should be a ball.

Pappy

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[99RT10]

That is a very cool project. Great compromise!!!

[TA Two Oh]

Nice to see that car come together, especially with such a top quality build!

[1of1TA1.0]

Badass! Can't wait to see the finished project and hear how you like it on track!

[BrianACR]

That's gonna be nasty!

[Pappy]

A few parts starting to roll in.

Pappy

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[Special Ed]

I knew your engine builder, Larry, forty years ago when we drag raced boats on the Colorado river. A very nice guy and great engine builder. Wow I suddenly feel old.

[Pappy]

Motor progress.

Pappy

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[Pappy]

Who says you can't put a 12 inch wheel with a 335 on the front of an old C-1 Corvette? Wheels came in today - Forgeline GA-3Rs, 18X12 front, 18X12.5 rear.

Pappy

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[Pappy]

335 and 345 Hoosier R-7s mounted on Forgeline 12 and 12.5 inch wheels.

Pappy

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[Pappy]

Just needs the harness and a dyno run....

Pappy

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[Arizona Vipers]

Badass Pappy! I didn't even know you were doing this thread until today! When is the dyno?

[Pappy]

The harness for the Motec ECU was finished and shipped last Thursday. Shane T. is doing the tune. We might be able to get the motor on the dyno this week. In the meantime I am finishing the install of the Detroit Speed multi-link rear suspension (Decalink) - that will complete the suspension.

Pappy

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[Arizona Vipers]

So what are we talking here, 2700 lbs, 750whp? That's the feeling I get! hehe. Next time I see your wife I need to remind her to up your life insurance :smilielol:

[Arizona Vipers]

I love the color of the Forgelines, what color do they call that?

[Pappy]

I love the color of the Forgelines, what color do they call that?

Satin Gunmetal. I talked to Forgeline about "titanium", but they told me that rubber sticks to that coating, and that the satin gunmetal was more forgiving and easier to clean. We'll see what the motor makes, but should be around 850 at the crank, so 750 whp is possible. It is a big bore (4.6 "), short stroke (3.875") 515 C.I. 13:1 race gas motor with a big road race solid roller and sequential injection on a Motec, so it should make good power for a NA motor. As for weight, with all the changes (aluminum motor, light weight Tilton clutch assembly, and probably a heavier rear suspension set-up) I've kind-of lost the bubble. I'm hoping for 26-2700 lbs dry, but 2800 would not surprise me.

[Pappy]

Short update. Still working on installing the new rear suspension. A couple of progress photos attached. Getting closer to hunting a 9-liter in Arizona - LOL.

Pappy

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[Arizona Vipers]

Short update. Still working on installing the new rear suspension. A couple of progress photos attached. Getting closer to hunting a 9-liter in Arizona - LOL.

Pappy

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Badass Pappy!!!! Can't wait to see this badboy fire up!!!!!

[Martyb]

Awesome project, my all time favorites are the 56 and 57 Vettes. Can’t wait to see it at the track!

Marty

[Pappy]

Finally got the motor on the dyno. 852.71 peak HP @ 7100 rpm, 685 peak torque @ 5900 rpm. Should be enough.

Pappy

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[steve911]

That is Really cool build! With all that Aero in the rear, what are you going to use in the front to hold the nose down?

[Pappy]

That is Really cool build! With all that Aero in the rear, what are you going to use in the front to hold the nose down?

It has an air dam, splitter with tunnels, belly pan, and there are diffuser tunnels outside the frame rails but inside the rockers. Here is an early photo of the air dam, but I have since changed the splitter configuration - made it larger and added tunnels underneath. Since I moved the motor even further back (out of necessity to deconflict the lower control arms and the dry sump pump), I am also now able to vent the radiator upward out the hood, which should help.

Pappy

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[Pappy]

Here is the dyno sheet for the new motor. The AFR was a little fat, especially from 3500-4500, and the timing was only at 34 degrees, so there is a little more to gain with tune. I'll look at that once I get it installed and on the chassis dyno.

Pappy

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[Pappy]

For anyone looking into a fuel cell, I highly recommend Fuel Safe. They custom built this one for me to my specs, and it came out exactly as ordered. Scott at Fuel Safe was very responsive. The cell is 19+ gallons with a 1.76 gallon fuel trap for road racing. It is FIA certified and has a .063" aluminum powder coated can, pro bladder, internal Aeromotive A1000 pump, -10 outlet, -8 return with a Setrab fuel cooler built into the return line, and a -12 vent with roll-over protection. Forced cooling air comes from side scoops to the fuel and differential coolers. One step closer to getting on track.

Pappy

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[1of1TA1.0]

Super bad ass Pappy!

[Arizona Vipers]

What's the latest Pappy?

[Pappy]

What's the latest Pappy?

As you know I got slowed up installing the fuel cell. It had the wrong flapper valves in the collector, so I had to wait for the correct ones - NASCAR billet aluminum with O-rings. I am finishing up a little fiberglass/carbon work installing a fuel filler door in the trunk lid so I don't have to open the rear deck lid every time I refuel. Still hope to finish this thing this summer.

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Then I went to Sonoma to watch a buddy's new TTU, tube-chassis, LS-powered TTU car. It was a combined TransAM/NASA event and the field was packed. I saw a couple of Vipers - one Comp Coupe and a white Gen V.

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Pappy

[Arizona Vipers]

Post pics of the pics of the custom fuel filler through the trunk!

[Pappy]

Post pics of the pics of the custom fuel filler through the trunk!

Hey Cable. Here's a construction shot. With the wing on the deck lid with supports that go through to the frame, I didn't want to have to open the deck lid every time I refueled, so I put a door in the deck lid above the fuel receptacle. The "shield" on the bottom of the deck lid keeps spilled fuel from going into the trunk.

Pappy

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[Arizona Vipers]

Very cool! :dude3:

[Pappy]

Update. Finally got the motor moved back as far as I could and still have a space for a driver - #1 plug is 19" behind the front axle centerline. Rebuilt the frame X-member to accommodate the set-back, movement of the motor to the right, and the rear-mount starter. Mark Williams built a really nice 18" 7075 aluminum drive shaft. Firewall, Tilton 900-series pedals, and Woodward steering shaft going back in this week. I also added an OMP HTE-R Carbon seat. Making some progress.

Pappy

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[Arizona Vipers]

We need more updates and pics Pappy!!!!

[Pappy]

Switched from StopTechs to AP Racing brakes. Ryan Linder is finishing up the headers (SS, 2.25" tubes, SPD merge collectors). This coronavirus thing isn't all that bad - traps folks, myself included, in the garage - maybe I'll get something done. I had to add a gantry crane to the garage - the motor is now so far back that a boom engine hoist won't reach.

Pappy

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[Arizona Vipers]

Switched from StopTechs to AP Racing brakes. Ryan Linder is finishing up the headers (SS, 2.25" tubes, SPD merge collectors). This coronavirus thing isn't all that bad - traps folks, myself included, in the garage - maybe I'll get something done. I had to add a gantry crane to the garage - the motor is now so far back that a boom engine hoist won't reach.

Pappy



WOW! Works of art!!

[Pappy]

WOW! Works of art!!

Thanks! They look even better welded up.

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[Pappy]

These should stop it! Finspeed is building me a second set of wheels. Had to use a Corvette DP forging on the rear to get the backspacing I needed.

Pappy

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[Arizona Vipers]

Can't wait until this is done Pappy!!!!

[Pappy]

Got a 6XD sequential on order. I am going to stay with a stick shifter with the hi-res load cell for WOT shifts for a while - might consider a paddle upgrade later. X-ineering will do the integration with my MoTec ECU. JJ Furillo (Ultimate Performance Speed Shop) is building my JRI shock/spring package. Should have them in a week or so. Also decided to sell my OMP seats (HTE-R carbon and WRC-R carbon). The head support on the HTE-R is just a little wide for my roll cage causing me to lose a couple of inches of leg room. I will probably contact TKO and see what they have available. Looks like I could get this thing finished by late fall.

Pappy

[Pappy]

A couple of new things. I got my JRi shocks - Pac spring bump stops and 550# springs for a starting point. I also got the BMW throttle drive motor installed. It hooks to the Wilson TB with conventional linkage and is controlled by a GM DBW throttle. That allows me to get an ignition cut for WOT, no-clutch upshifts and a "smart" auto-blip through the MoTec ECU for no-clutch downshifts.

Pappy

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[Pappy]

6XD sequential transmission initial install. Rear-mounted starter cleared just fine (had some initial concern). Since my motor was pushed back so far, the normal shifter would not work - too far back. RTS provided me with a prototype C6 shifter that I could install further forward. Built brackets off a frame crossmember. Need to install the heim'd shift rod from the shifter to the back of the transmission. Mark Williams is building a new driveshaft since the one for the Tremec I took out was a little short. My MoTec harness is currently being modified to accommodate the shift load sensor, gear position indicator, and DBW throttle so I get an ignition cut for WOT, no-lift upshifts and no-clutch downshifts.

Pappy

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[Pappy]

Come on Viper, show me what you got.....

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Pappy

Edit: It fit....barely.

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[Arizona Vipers]

Holy mother mary of God! LOL! Badass!!!!!! When does it fire up?????

[Pappy]

Seat from TKO Motorsports going in.

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[Exhlr8n]

What an awesome build. Love it. Hope you get it on the track soon!

[13COBRA]

I forgot all about this thread...

Pappy, what's the completion ETA?

[Pappy]

I forgot all about this thread...

Pappy, what's the completion ETA?

I'm getting close to getting it on a chassis dyno to finish setting up the drive-by-wire throttle and ignition-cut/auto-blip for the sequential, as well as a final engine tune. Then I need to clean up some of the aero and some cosmetic stuff. I hope to get out to the new "Paddock" track with Cable for test-and-tune this Spring. Since everything is virtually brand new and untested, there will be a lot of break-in and chassis tuning to do. Getting close.

[13COBRA]

I'm getting close to getting it on a chassis dyno to finish setting up the drive-by-wire throttle and ignition-cut/auto-blip for the sequential, as well as a final engine tune. Then I need to clean up some of the aero and some cosmetic stuff. I hope to get out to the new "Paddock" track with Cable for test-and-tune this Spring. Since everything is virtually brand new and untested, there will be a lot of break-in and chassis tuning to do. Getting close.

This is exciting, thanks for posting progress pictures. Definitely looking forward to how you end up with it!

I'm looking into ignition cut/auto-blip for my VCC. Not a lot of options for a mechanical throttle body.

[Pappy]

This is exciting, thanks for posting progress pictures. Definitely looking forward to how you end up with it!

I'm looking into ignition cut/auto-blip for my VCC. Not a lot of options for a mechanical throttle body.

Ignition cut is not a problem, but for the auto-blip I ended up adding a BMW throttle drive motor to my Wilson Dominator throttle body. I did see a couple of stand-alone auto-blip systems that use a separate, programmable solenoid on the mechanical linkage to activate a throttle blip. The ignition cut is essential to enable WOT, no-lift shifts with a sequential, but as far as I am concerned the auto-blip for down-shifts is a nice-to-have. Heel-toe works and you are off the throttle, so speed of the downshift doesn't really affect lap times like the up-shift does.

[Arizona Vipers]

I'm getting close to getting it on a chassis dyno to finish setting up the drive-by-wire throttle and ignition-cut/auto-blip for the sequential, as well as a final engine tune. Then I need to clean up some of the aero and some cosmetic stuff. I hope to get out to the new "Paddock" track with Cable for test-and-tune this Spring. Since everything is virtually brand new and untested, there will be a lot of break-in and chassis tuning to do. Getting close.

:dude3:

[GTS Dean]

What a magnificent effort. Truly amazing!

[13COBRA]

Ignition cut is not a problem, but for the auto-blip I ended up adding a BMW throttle drive motor to my Wilson Dominator throttle body. I did see a couple of stand-alone auto-blip systems that use a separate, programmable solenoid on the mechanical linkage to activate a throttle blip. The ignition cut is essential to enable WOT, no-lift shifts with a sequential, but as far as I am concerned the auto-blip for down-shifts is a nice-to-have. Heel-toe works and you are off the throttle, so speed of the downshift doesn't really affect lap times like the up-shift does.

PM'd.

[Pappy]

Update. Making final suspension adjustments. JRI shocks, AP brakes, Detroit Speed multi-link rear suspension. Soft spring, big bar, lots of caster with front suspension on bump stops at full compression. I suspect there will be a lot of adjusting to do on track!

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[Arizona Vipers]

Glad to see it coming along Pappy! What's left after suspension???

[Pappy]

Glad to see it coming along Pappy! What's left after suspension???

Electrical

[Pappy]

A small update. Plumbing the Tilton 900 series pedals/78-series masters was a lot of fun since the MCs pivot in front bearings and the plumbing in and out has to be flexible to accommodate the movement. Brown and Miller (BMRS) helped me with that and provided all of the other hoses and hard lines for the engine - water, power steering, dry sump, coolers (oil, trans, differential, and power steering). Plumbing is complete. I am currently building a new CF front undertray with diffuser tunnels to direct air toward the diffuser side pods. I am using one of TKO Motorsports Gen V front extended splitters and support cables so it can be easily swapped out if damaged. I am also using their Viper rear diffuser strake extensions - I like the way they work on the ACR and are replaceable. Running out of excuses to not fire this thing up and get to the track for test & tune. That said, I am still a one-man-band, and I don't move very fast. LOL

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[GTS Dean]

such a sanitary and impressive build!

[Arizona Vipers]

Great update Pappy! Let's get this to Atessa soon along with my turbo car!