Drove my first Viper today

[Enzo101]

So there's a bit of a story leading into this. I currently have a Shelby GT350. It was backed into while I was having lunch and the jerk took off before I found out about it. So after talking to the insurance the best way to deal with it is to fix and sell the car. (insurance is paying for the loss in value) So I decided I'll look for another and while I'm at it try to find the unattainable 350R. Three days later I got one for 5k over that I can order. So I ordered it and started thinking I can flip it for a reasonable profit and get something different. The Viper has always been a dream car of mine so I went to the local dealer who has one for sale and the owner of the dealership took me on a long test drive to show me some of its capabilities. We got back and he said here take your girlfriend for a ride, mind you I'm only 23. I was just amazed at it! It was so much better than I could have imagined. There were a few issues I had. The steering wheel sits a bit cockeyed, getting into second from third was a bit harsh, quite a bit a rattling in the cabin, the engine recall has me a bit concerned, the peddle box was really tight and I have relatively small feet, leather cracking in between the air conditioning vents (not sure if it's a common problem) Even with these issues I am still in love with the car! Right now I have to wait for my car to be repaired, get the R, and sell it. The car i have in mind is a Launch Edition just because it's the color combination I've been in love with. If any members can give me some advice as well as prices for a Launch Edition I'd really appreciate it. Mind you it'll be sometime next year before I purchase it. Thanks everyone!

[darbgnik]

I'm assuming it was used, with cracks and rattles, and grouchy transmission? Never heard of the dash cracking there, or anywhere for that matter. The pedal area is fairly tight, as you have the exhaust on one side of your feet, and the transmission on the other. Most of these cars are fairly solid, but there have been a couple recent used car purchases that turned into nightmare scenarios. I find the transmission, especially the shifter, great in the Gen V, every gear, every time.

I'm not about to talk about price, threads spiral downward from there if you do..... same as the recall issue.

One thing I will say, the car generally requires commitment, to get past the idiosyncrasies, to really enjoy. So if you have any doubts, I wouldn't recommend one. That being said, I love mine, and sold my last Lamborghini after having them both for a year, as a basis for my comments.

[Terminator02]

The leather is very high quality and my guess is it looks like any other true leather dash with just normal lines. Each gen V I have had or sat in looks the same at the areas you describe. The gear box is a dream. Shifts are like butter so it may just mean you aren't used to it. Pedals just need to get used to because they are geared for heel toe and makes it super easy to do so. I don't have small feet and have no issue with the pedals. Compared to the 350 I rode, the viper is actually more comfortable, suspension doesn't even feel much harsher. It's a huge step up from the 350 and I think with more seat time you will feel similarly.

Launch editions are fantastic cars and I love the color combo and how loaded they tend to be. I'm not a fan of that type of leather for the seats but many owners just love them. Seat wear will be common and again it's from the quality of the leather so it tends to wear by molding like a baseball glove to the owner.

Pricing will depend on miles, overall owner care and I'd suggest just keeping an eye on here, auto trader and eBay. It's a great time to buy a gen V IMO and don't see them dropping much more in value so whenever you flip the 350R I'd say find your deal. Welcome to the viper world. I used to have a terminator cobra (hence my name that I've kept since being a viper forum member when the cobra was expected to be a 2002). I was 22 when I got that car and it was one of the nicest vehicles I've owned. The viper was a natural progression. You won't look back but will miss the srt performance forums!

[sadil]

Lol 350R prices are a joke. Everyone is over paying for a car that is going to be built for 4+ years. I would flip it soon if I were you before the world realizes it is just another car and not a unicorn!

[Terminator02]

Lol 350R prices are a joke. Everyone is over paying for a car that is going to be built for 4+ years. I would flip it soon if I were you before the world realizes it is just another car and not a unicorn!

Very true bro. I get the whole first year hype thing. I think it's impressive ford has that devout following to begin with as I see it more with very high end limited cars. It's ok to pay more to have the first of something though I'd never do that. My 03 cobra was going for 5-10k over sticker and that kinda was the start of modern mustangs going for over msrp. I however paid X plan pricing and it was 34750 (original msrp) out the door after all taxes and everything.

These new cars will be going for invoice sooner than later no doubt. I'd flip that ASAP or it will be a loss IMO especially as the car will be updated throughout the life cycle just like last gens Shelby GT 500s and they got cheap really quickly.

[ssjcreeper]

The Viper is a special car, not just a special edition. As anyone on here can attest to, each drive is memorable. It's not without it's quirks, but in more than 6 years of ownership I still can't get over how much these cars make me smile.

From what I've observed of Launch Editions lately, prices can vary but overall they tend to carry a slight to moderate premium over a similarly equipped/mileage GTS, but a great deal can be had if you find the right dealer. It's a great time to get a Gen V. Tremendously fun cars.

[Vipes]

That's odd about the rattlling and dash cracks. I've never had a single rattle in mine and even my old 2006 never had any rattles. Maybe something is wrong with the transmission, my 2-3 shift is smooth and effortless.

[ViperPete]

Never heard of those rattles, cracking, or problems shifting.

Can you post pics of the cracked areas? Might be totally normal. My car has some "folds" in the leather that could look like cracks but is normal.

I'm glad you are considering a Viper! They are all special!

[sharmut]

@OP, really depends on your intended use, before you commit on the LE, look at the T/A. Started shopping in 2013, the LE was appealing, after hearing of an upcoming T/A version, decided to wait it out. Gave up the LE/GTS leather for TA suspension, brakes and never looked back.
As for the 2-3 shift, it should be smooth. Did you try adjusting the pedal closer to you? The clutch release is higher than most cars. Possible the clutch was not completely releasing as you shift?

[Enzo101]

Thank you all for your inputs and I'll try to answer them all. The Viper I drove was a 2013 with about 3800 miles on it. It was a GTS with the T/A exterior package. I'm looking for a toy really. I have a f150 for a daily and would like a weekend car that the girlfriend and I can take out every once in a while. I may have not been used to the transmission as some of you have put it but it is a wonderful gear box! The shifts are so tight and buttery. It was just the 3-2 shift that got me twice so I may just need some time with it. The rattling was coming from the back hatch. I didn't get any pics of the car but ill see if I can find a good pic of it from the dealers website.

[Larryskillzs]

As a S2000 owner, which has has one of the best gear boxes ever engineered, I find my Gen 5 gearbox to feel spectacular.

It's a little bit heavier than my S2000's but shifting on the street or track is very easy. You can't be lazy on your shifts, maybe that's the issue for you.

Any type of lazy inputs with the Viper will lag everything on the car. The Viper demands crisp shifts to make it feel great.

Good luck with your hunt for a nice Gen 5. Personally, a dealer that lets you go out for a joyride has me seriously guessing if that's the right Viper for you.

[Enzo101]

The dealer in the area knows me very well. I go there every other week and hang out with the employees. I live in a town of about 7500 and have the only 350 so they enjoy seeing it. The way they do their Vipers is the owner buys it personally and then puts it up on the dealership website. He drives it around every so often until it sells. Really great group of people but I totally understand why it would seem bad. I wouldn't buy the one they have anyway. It's black on black on black. Not my thing but looks spectacular!

[TrackAire]

Before going any further I'd recommend driving another Viper.....something doesn't sound right about this unit. Driving a couple of other Vipers can definitely let you know what to look for and be concerned about.

Good luck and hope to see in behind a V10 soon.

[LmeaViper]

Very true bro. I get the whole first year hype thing. I think it's impressive ford has that devout following to begin with as I see it more with very high end limited cars. It's ok to pay more to have the first of something though I'd never do that. My 03 cobra was going for 5-10k over sticker and that kinda was the start of modern mustangs going for over msrp. I however paid X plan pricing and it was 34750 (original msrp) out the door after all taxes and everything.

These new cars will be going for invoice sooner than later no doubt. I'd flip that ASAP or it will be a loss IMO especially as the car will be updated throughout the life cycle just like last gens Shelby GT 500s and they got cheap really quickly.

True. I waited until the end of 2004 to by my 04...got it at Xplan and zero %. Timing is everything.

With respect to the original post, what year mileage is on the car your were looking at? Something sounds wrong to me, as the Viper has the best gear box I ever drove by a huge margin. Also a guy at work who loves Porsche's was yapping to me about the offset wheel and its oddity, however knowing that I can't even tell when I am in the car.

The Viper is an absolutely amazing car and in my opinion in 5 years, when the GT350 is not the latest and greatest Ford item, then you will be more satisfied with the Viper.

[Dr.Ron]

Never heard of those rattles, cracking, or problems shifting.

Can you post pics of the cracked areas? Might be totally normal. My car has some "folds" in the leather that could look like cracks but is normal.

I'm glad you are considering a Viper! They are all special!

20331

I have 2 like this. Does anyone else have these? Is this normal leather?

Ron

[NT-ACR]

20331

I have 2 like this. Does anyone else have these? Is this normal leather?

Ron

I would assume that is due to the leather being pulled so tight in that particular region and not being properly conditioned over time with something like Lexal.

[zzmike]

20331

I have 2 like this. Does anyone else have these? Is this normal leather?

Ron

Mine looks like that also. It is conditioned on a regular schedule, so I don't think that is the cause. I think it is just a result of the stretching and the compound surface.

[texasram]

Mine looks like that also. It is conditioned on a regular schedule, so I don't think that is the cause. I think it is just a result of the stretching and the compound surface.
instead of wrinkles i have 2 small bubbles

[Boba Fett]

So there's a bit of a story leading into this. I currently have a Shelby GT350. It was backed into while I was having lunch and the jerk took off before I found out about it. So after talking to the insurance the best way to deal with it is to fix and sell the car. (insurance is paying for the loss in value) So I decided I'll look for another and while I'm at it try to find the unattainable 350R. Three days later I got one for 5k over that I can order. So I ordered it and started thinking I can flip it for a reasonable profit and get something different. The Viper has always been a dream car of mine so I went to the local dealer who has one for sale and the owner of the dealership took me on a long test drive to show me some of its capabilities. We got back and he said here take your girlfriend for a ride, mind you I'm only 23. I was just amazed at it! It was so much better than I could have imagined. There were a few issues I had. The steering wheel sits a bit cockeyed, getting into second from third was a bit harsh, quite a bit a rattling in the cabin, the engine recall has me a bit concerned, the peddle box was really tight and I have relatively small feet, leather cracking in between the air conditioning vents (not sure if it's a common problem) Even with these issues I am still in love with the car! Right now I have to wait for my car to be repaired, get the R, and sell it. The car i have in mind is a Launch Edition just because it's the color combination I've been in love with. If any members can give me some advice as well as prices for a Launch Edition I'd really appreciate it. Mind you it'll be sometime next year before I purchase it. Thanks everyone!

I'm on my 3rd Gen V Viper. All I can say is as others have suggested, drive another one. The pedal box is tight but so is the rest of the car. I love that about it. Good luck.

OH BTW - having owned several mustangs, I too have considered the 350R...

[texasram]

Technically there is no recall on the engine, just a customer satisfaction campaign, one detects for debris, the other re routes the breather on the drivers side to prevent oil getting into intake on long right handed sweepers, if it were an engine recall, all the engines would be replaced

[The_Ruski_Driver]

LE is the way to go, I may or may not be biased!

I think you'd really enjoy it! Everything happens for a reason and that person did you a favor by backing into your stang, you'll see ;)

BTW I am willing to let mine go if you're willing to pay the premium. Note also I turned down offers in the 80s.

[harley56]

I have a LE sitting next to my '96 Blue&White. That being said, I think there are more aggressive looking GenV color combos, but I liked the bookends. Anyway, I paid $80K for mine with 1,200 miles from a dealer. There are currently two on Autotrader at dealerships. One w/2,900 miles, other w/2,000 miles, both priced at $86,000 +/-

[dethred]

I would assume that is due to the leather being pulled so tight in that particular region and not being properly conditioned over time with something like Lexal.

That's seen all over my dashboard. I have the Laguna leather, but it's clearly the grain of the leather and how it's formed over the curves of the dash.

To the OP, try taking your shoes off, it'll give a lot more room down there. If any gear is difficult to engage, have the dealership change the trans fluid before you make your decision. The gearbox in these cars are probably the best in the world for a manual. So much feedback, very precise, short throws, and almost impossible to select the wrong gear.

[ViperSmith]

That's seen all over my dashboard. I have the Laguna leather, but it's clearly the grain of the leather and how it's formed over the curves of the dash.

To the OP, try taking your shoes off, it'll give a lot more room down there. If any gear is difficult to engage, have the dealership change the trans fluid before you make your decision. The gearbox in these cars are probably the best in the world for a manual. So much feedback, very precise, short throws, and almost impossible to select the wrong gear.
In never drive with shoes on lol.

[darbgnik]

I kind of feel like a poser, driving on the street in my track shoes....... but I do!

[Dman]

Having owned 11 mustangs, two GT500s, in the 800+HP range, and four Vipers, including a 2013 GTS. The trans should feel better than the mustangs linkage based shifter, notably. The viper has an amazing trans and shifter setup. I've upgraded shifters in every sting I've owned. If you're saying going from 3-2 got you, and that means a grind ... I have never had anything close to that and I'd be concerned.

I know some will lose their sh!t but keep in mind if you look at a '13 red track pack car or LE, these were very early builds on a gen that has had plenty of gremlins. These early cars were shake down builds, and they made a lot of them, an LE is not rare, with 150 built the exact same way, it's like buying a black viper. So just to keep it real, IMHO, I'd stay away from the red TP cars and LEs myself, if there's a later production run that you like.

Double check the leather is really cracked, if it is, then that's unusual as others posted, the leather in the GTS is a premium product, if it's cracked then something's wrong, you could negotiate the price down, see if bumper to bumper is in place and try to get it covered (good luck as I'm sure they'd say it's use related or something stupid). But do try to test another, your trans comment would stop me there, and make sure more than anything, you have a warranty. Early cars had issues with retention clips on the interior snapping or being installed wrong, this covered on warranty, my interior had creaks and rattles in front and in the hatch. After a dealer visit and them replacing 2 clip sets and a fix in the rear, it was completely silent - which is how it should be. Gen5s shouldn't have rattles, if it does, in the doors or hatch area, it can be fixed. Happy shopping.

[swexlin]

Well, I have a red Track Pack car, build date 4/1/13, so early, but not super early (first builds started coming off the line in 12/12, and through that winter). Bought mine with 7200, have 11,400 on it now. Only issue (so far, knock wood) is I had the diff replaced. Passed R28, does use some oil though - looks to be about a quart per 1200 miles or so (and I don't drive the car hard). Oh, and my passenger door panel came loose, that was, as DMan stated above, a retention clip, which was fixed.

Have the full leather Sabelt seats, which still look perfect (but I put a towel on the driver's seat, and rarely have a passenger). I keep the interior maintained with Adam's, and it looks brand new. Car runs great, and shifts great. I believe there were 100 Red Track Packs. So in Viper terms, they're not super rare, but in regular car terms, they're very rare, LOL. As a comparison, I had a 2007 SRT8 Superbee (1000 of them) and the only time you see one is at show. So a 150 or 100 build run a any car is still pretty rare. I've actually never seen an LE Gen 5 in person, for instance. I've actually seen more ACRs!

I wouldn't shy away from an early build car, as long as it's had the recalls done.

[ViperJon]

Scott did you buy an extended warranty? Your three years must be approaching.

[swexlin]

Scott did you buy an extended warranty? Your three years must be approaching.

Jon, yes, I bought it when I bought the car from Bill P. My warranty is through April 2020.

Also, as an edit to my other post, IF I were buying an early car, even if it passed R28, I would want one with at least 10,000 miles, in light of the engine issues. Not that cars with higher mileage haven't gone (or won't) but *most* have been at lower miles.

[texasram]

Jon, yes, I bought it when I bought the car from Bill P. My warranty is through April 2020.

Also, as an edit to my other post, IF I were buying an early car, even if it passed R28, I would want one with at least 10,000 miles, in light of the engine issues. Not that cars with higher mileage haven't gone (or won't) but *most* have been at lower miles. Whos engine has blown past 10k?

[swexlin]

Whos engine has blown past 10k?

Arizona Viper's - his had 12K. And it is a red Track Pack car like mine....

[v10tt]

Why do people pay over 100k for a 350R when they can be ordered at MSRP?

[The_Ruski_Driver]

Having owned 11 mustangs, two GT500s, in the 800+HP range, and four Vipers, including a 2013 GTS. The trans should feel better than the mustangs linkage based shifter, notably. The viper has an amazing trans and shifter setup. I've upgraded shifters in every sting I've owned. If you're saying going from 3-2 got you, and that means a grind ... I have never had anything close to that and I'd be concerned.

I know some will lose their sh!t but keep in mind if you look at a '13 red track pack car or LE, these were very early builds on a gen that has had plenty of gremlins. These early cars were shake down builds, and they made a lot of them, an LE is not rare, with 150 built the exact same way, it's like buying a black viper. So just to keep it real, IMHO, I'd stay away from the red TP cars and LEs myself, if there's a later production run that you like.

Double check the leather is really cracked, if it is, then that's unusual as others posted, the leather in the GTS is a premium product, if it's cracked then something's wrong, you could negotiate the price down, see if bumper to bumper is in place and try to get it covered (good luck as I'm sure they'd say it's use related or something stupid). But do try to test another, your trans comment would stop me there, and make sure more than anything, you have a warranty. Early cars had issues with retention clips on the interior snapping or being installed wrong, this covered on warranty, my interior had creaks and rattles in front and in the hatch. After a dealer visit and them replacing 2 clip sets and a fix in the rear, it was completely silent - which is how it should be. Gen5s shouldn't have rattles, if it does, in the doors or hatch area, it can be fixed. Happy shopping.

Haven't heard any LEs with gremlins, what are your sources?

[swexlin]

Haven't heard any LEs with gremlins, what are your sources?

The LEs are early build cars, which in general, *may* have some gremlins, as he described above.

[The_Ruski_Driver]

The LEs are early build cars, which in general, *may* have some gremlins, as he described above.

May have read it wrong. I'll assume it means that due to early build dates it's likely to have more issues than later build dates. While that may be true for most models, I would argue the GenV is an outlier. There has been no pattern for the R28 recalled engines and the engines that have blown up. Also no pattern for the whining diffs or the few replaced transmissions.

My opinion is the sporadicity can be attributed to the fact that they are hand built and tolerances will vary, excluding the bad batch of dirty blocks of course.

[ViperJon]

There's no rhyme or reason to the recalls. My TA had both and cars made two weeks before had just the one. Only FCA knows and they sure as hell aren't saying.

[swexlin]

May have read it wrong. I'll assume it means that due to early build dates it's likely to have more issues than later build dates. While that may be true for most models, I would argue the GenV is an outlier. There has been no pattern for the R28 recalled engines and the engines that have blown up. Also no pattern for the whining diffs or the few replaced transmissions.

My opinion is the sporadicity can be attributed to the fact that they are hand built and tolerances will vary, excluding the bad batch of dirty blocks of course.

I agree with this, yes. The VERY early cars had the rear defrost window shatter, for instance, but that was only a few cars.

[Bruce]

20331

I have 2 like this. Does anyone else have these? Is this normal leather?

Ron

I've seen 2 '13's sitting on dealer lots back in '14 that had worse wrinkles than in this picture but were located on the sides of the binnacle.

[texasram]

No one else has small bubbles instead of wrinkles there? and when i try to push it down it wont lay down like smthings holding it up

[zzmike]

Do you have pics? That may help us figure out what might be going on. I have no bubbles, just the minor wrinkling between the two center dash vent bezels. It is certainly not bad enough to justify a new dash.

[Jdmuscle]

Why are we even comparing a mustang to a Viper? Please don't insult the vipers. No matter what a mustang has in it.. it's still a cheap rental grade car with a better motor (maybe).

If anyone has paid close attention to the mustang will see the poor QC on the body panels, paint, panel rub, stick on strips (yuck), headlight alignment with the fender and bumper.. ford knows how to market a turd..

[nautoncall]

Why do people pay over 100k for a 350R when they can be ordered at MSRP?

Please let me and about 100 others know where you can order a 350R for MSRP. Ford has done a fabulous job with the flat plane crank...Ferrari revs in a Ford.

[Patentlaw]

Please let me and about 100 others know where you can order a 350R for MSRP. Ford has done a fabulous job with the flat plane crank...Ferrari revs in a Ford.


Let's cue the "It is a Mustang" crowd.
In about a year, when Vipers are not made anymore, things may change.
It's the "new" Viper owner that Dodge desperately wanted.........remember those comments? They saved the day.......

[texasram]

Please let me and about 100 others know where you can order a 350R for MSRP. Ford has done a fabulous job with the flat plane crank...Ferrari revs in a Ford.
The firing order in the mustang is the reason it still doesnt sound as good as a ferrari

[NT-ACR]

The firing order in the mustang is the reason it still doesnt sound as good as a ferrari

I think they both sound terrific, just in their own unique way.

[NT-ACR]

Why are we even comparing a mustang to a Viper? Please don't insult the vipers. No matter what a mustang has in it.. it's still a cheap rental grade car with a better motor (maybe).

If anyone has paid close attention to the mustang will see the poor QC on the body panels, paint, panel rub, stick on strips (yuck), headlight alignment with the fender and bumper.. ford knows how to market a turd..

Lol. You seem mad, bro. They're both awesome, NA, American cars. It's a great time to be a car enthusiast.

[darbgnik]

I think they both sound terrific, just in their own unique way.

I agree. The new Mustang sounds very, very distinct, in a cool kind of way. There's no mistaking it for something else! I also think the 350 is a great value, the 350R less so, and with the mark ups, not at all. For that kind of money, there are better options, but you can't argue the excitement. The only complaint anyone could reasonably make about the 350 is that it looks like every other Mustang, which is I suppose the same complaint most make about the Z06. But if exclusivity isn't high on your list, I can see the appeal.

As an aside, it's not just the firing order, it's also the engine bay packaging constraints that lead to the current manifold tube lengths that contribute to the more warble, than flat tone.

[SlateEd]

Drove a 350R at Lime Rock when Ford's Marketing team was taking it around to impress competitive brands, and it's a cool car no doubt... sounds unlike any other mustang, revs like mad.
But certainly not in the same league as a Viper and it sounds like the OP knows that too :-)

...on the transmission comment - you said 3-2 shift, right? so downshifting.. that would seem normal to be clunky if you're not used to it. Rev matching a downshift on the Viper if your ear and feet are conditioned to a mustang is not going to be smooth the first few times. Drive another one or a few, but glad you sound like you enjoyed it on the first try!

[texasram]

I agree. The new Mustang sounds very, very distinct, in a cool kind of way. There's no mistaking it for something else! I also think the 350 is a great value, the 350R less so, and with the mark ups, not at all. For that kind of money, there are better options, but you can't argue the excitement. The only complaint anyone could reasonably make about the 350 is that it looks like every other Mustang, which is I suppose the same complaint most make about the Z06. But if exclusivity isn't high on your list, I can see the appeal.

As an aside, it's not just the firing order, it's also the engine bay packaging constraints that lead to the current manifold tube lengths that contribute to the more warble, than flat tone.
not talking about exhaust just plain engine schematics anyone can change any engine note to sound different by changinf exhaust, but wont produce that intoxicating base engine note. Fact

[serpent]

The 350R is a cool ride and a hell of a deal for msrp. If that car was from one of the euro makes it would be 85k+.

I'd still get a viper over an R model.

[sadil]

I agree. The new Mustang sounds very, very distinct, in a cool kind of way. There's no mistaking it for something else! I also think the 350 is a great value, the 350R less so, and with the mark ups, not at all. For that kind of money, there are better options, but you can't argue the excitement. The only complaint anyone could reasonably make about the 350 is that it looks like every other Mustang, which is I suppose the same complaint most make about the Z06. But if exclusivity isn't high on your list, I can see the appeal.

As an aside, it's not just the firing order, it's also the engine bay packaging constraints that lead to the current manifold tube lengths that contribute to the more warble, than flat tone.

Would be interesting to throw the engine into a mid-engine car and route the exhaust up and backwards. I wonder how it would sound.

[NT-ACR]

Would be interesting to throw the engine into a mid-engine car and route the exhaust up and backwards. I wonder how it would sound.

An exhaust doesn't change the sound very much. Really just amplifies the volume.

[darbgnik]

An exhaust doesn't change the sound very much. Really just amplifies the volume.

I respectfully disagree. Compare a standard Gallardo, with 2 separated exhausts to say a Superleggera, with them joined. One sounds good, one sounds F1. Trust me, my Gallardo was the only car I ever did an exhaust on, and also the only one where it was worth it. Performance was negligible, but the sound was out of this world.

As I said, piston arrangement is the major factor in the 350's sound difference to a Ferrari, but dual exhaust, crossovered or not, and a single intake are also contributors. As said above, fact. lol.

[texasram]

I respectfully disagree. Compare a standard Gallardo, with 2 separated exhausts to say a Superleggera, with them joined. One sounds good, one sounds F1. Trust me, my Gallardo was the only car I ever did an exhaust on, and also the only one where it was worth it. Performance was negligible, but the sound was out of this world.

As I said, piston arrangement is the major factor in the 350's sound difference to a Ferrari, but dual exhaust, crossovered or not, and a single intake are also contributors. As said above, fact. lol.
But the firing order is the biggest sound characteristic between the r and ferrari

[NT-ACR]

I respectfully disagree. Compare a standard Gallardo, with 2 separated exhausts to say a Superleggera, with them joined. One sounds good, one sounds F1. Trust me, my Gallardo was the only car I ever did an exhaust on, and also the only one where it was worth it. Performance was negligible, but the sound was out of this world.

As I said, piston arrangement is the major factor in the 350's sound difference to a Ferrari, but dual exhaust, crossovered or not, and a single intake are also contributors. As said above, fact. lol.

Welp, I learned something new today.

http://www.caranddriver.com/features/this-is-why-various-engine-types-sound-so-different-feature

[darbgnik]

But the firing order is the biggest sound characteristic between the r and ferrari

Which is what I said in both my posts, including the one you quoted. Lol. But all good ;)

[NT-ACR]

Ok. So let's compare the 458's engine to the GT350's unit. The 458 has a cross linked intake plenum that essentially allows each bank of cylinders to have their own intake plenum.

http://www.italiazakka.co.jp/shop/goods_img/17754_0_03.jpeg
http://www.nsxprime.com/photopost/data/500/Ferrari_458.jpg

The GT350 on the other hand utilizes a more traditional intake that feeds both banks (it is the one on the right).

http://www.svtperformance.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/4-Shelby-GT350-Intake.jpg

Here are the specifications that I could find for both engines:

458- Total displacement- 4499 cc/274.5 cu in, Bore/stroke- 94×81 mm/3.7×3.2 in, Compression ratio- 12.5:1, UDDU crankshaft (up, down, down, up), Fuel injection- Direct

GT350- Total displacement- 5163 cc/315 cu in, Bore/stroke- 94x93 mm, Compression ratio- 12.0:1, UDUD crankshaft (up, down, up, down), Fuel injection- Port, Firing order- 1-5-4-8-3-7-2-6

Here's a terrific explanation of the 458's engine:


The intake system acts somewhat like the exhaust system in connecting two disparate events in the cam timing in order to enhance the energy output of the motor.

In the exhaust system, when the exhaust valve opens a powerful displacement wave of energy runs down the primary header pipe. When this wave reaches the collector and 'sees' all the extra area inwhich to expand it does so, and in the process, creates a moderately powerful negative pressure wave that travels back up the header pipe. If this negative wave should reach the exhaust valve when the piston is near TDC, then the low pressure wave can travel over the piston and up into the intake system, pulling in fresh mixture even before the piston starts downward.

In the intake system, once you have the air flowing forcefully as the piston passes mid-way in its intake stroke; air has reached its maximum velocity in the intake tract. As the intake valve closes, this air builds up behind the valve and, indeed, fills the entire velocity stack. Well this pressurized ari cannot stay down in the stack, so it expands back out of the velocity stack. The expansion depressurizes the back side of the valve, and this sucks mor eair back down the stack. If you can get a positive pressure vave to arrive as the intake valve is opening, you can push fresh mixture into the cyclinder even before the piston starts downward.

A header connects Exhaust valve opening, with the subsequent intake valve opening near TDC. A header can 'create' as much as 30 HP in a 458-class engine

A velocity stack connects intake valve closing with intake valve opening. The velocity stacks and feeding them clean high density air can 'create' as much as 90 HP in a 458-class engine.

The air box is a helmholtz resonator tuned to a 1/2 multiple of the velocity stack resonance. This resonance spresses the peaks and enhances the valleys of the velocity stakc, giving a broad wide torque powerband.

The various valves in the 360, 430 and 458 power-plants shows the increasing prowace of Ferrari in figuring out how to command and control the resonances. In the 458 version there are 3 valves, opeining the center valve couples the two airboxes (L&R) to broaden the TQ peak downward on the RPM scale. The 2 on the ends provide an even longer 'path' for the resonationi process, enhancing TQ even lower in the RPM scale. The air boxes do not 'create' power like the headers and velocity stacks, but they go a long way in broadening the powerband so the engine is more tractible and user friendly at places in the RPM bads far from peak TQ and peak HP.

Well, you did say you wanted to know.