Higher RPMs and Oil Pressure drops

[Talon.Smith]

I've noticed an issue recently with my '14 T/A and not sure what to make of it. When I get about 4K+ RPMs the oil pressure drops pretty heavily to the point a couple times its flashed red for going below 25psi. Anyone ever had this happen and what should I do? It's been to the dealer and they say everything checks out.

[Nemesis]

Yep, just before my engine blew.

[swexlin]

Agree, that is not normal.

[Dr.Ron]

Did you properly check your oil level recently?

[mjorgensen]

Not normal if oil is properly full.

[KB Viper]

Check your oil immediately. This happened to me, I called Mark J and he suggested I pull over and check oil immediate and I was almost 4 quarts low.

[Talon.Smith]

I agree something is definitely not right, which is why I brought it to dealership. Lol. I haven't checked oil since I've took it to them. I can check again when I get home. I was just making sure I wasn't overreacting.

[BlueAdder]

Better be safe (and paranoid) than sorry dude.

[Talon.Smith]

Definitely low on oil. With engine hot, only comes up halfway to safe area. I ruled that out after taking it to HB Dodge which have been the guys I've taken it to since I picked it up... Won't be going back again. Lol.
Well, it's got an appt at A&C Performance tomorrow and we'll be taking a look at everything the dealership said was good to go. Hopefully no damage has been done as I haven't run her hard since the last oil change. I feel like an idiot, a humble idiot at that as I should have known better. Thanks guys

[swexlin]

Add oil before you drive it anywhere.

[SNK3BIT]

Does anybody on this forum ever check their oil level? This is why the engines are failing....just ask some of the speed shops.

[NT-ACR]

Does anybody on this forum ever check their oil level? This is why the engines are failing....just ask some of the speed shops.

Owner's shouldn't have to be checking their oil at each fill up and shitting their pants that their engine will fail any second. Get off your high horse!

[ellowviper]

Yeah...just ask the speed shops.....

[cashcorn]

Yes, Owners should be checking there oil levels at every fuel stop per owners manual. You should always check it every time, before start-up and after shut-down (it's a performance car!). I'd beat, 95% of all failures are due to low oil level. It's a forged motor... Hope all works out for you. A&C Performance would also be my first choice as well. good luck.

[ViperTony]

Per the owner's manual:

20216

[NT-ACR]

Yes, Owners should be checking there oil levels at every fuel stop per owners manual. You should always check it every time, before start-up and after shut-down (it's a performance car!). I'd beat, 95% of all failures are due to low oil level. It's a forged motor... Hope all works out for you. A&C Performance would also be my first choice as well. good luck.

My argument is that owner's shouldn't HAVE TO check their oil levels at every fill up. It's ridiculous.

Also, don't give me that "it's a performance car" bullcorn. There are plenty of other "performance cars" that don't require you to check the oil level at every fill up. Don't make an excuse for poor engineering.

[sadil]

The manual's verbiage is idiotic. The worst time to check your oil is at the gas station. It could take hours for your "sprung" oil to find its way back to the pan, especially in an 8+ Liter engine. The best time to check your oil is after the car has been sitting overnight or for at least a couple hours. First thing in the morning would be ideal for the daily drivers.

I agree with NT-ACR, you shouldn't have to check your oil every day.

But with all the things going on and problems on the table that haven't been explained, you can make that decision.

[commandomatt]

My argument is that owner's shouldn't HAVE TO check their oil levels at every fill up. It's ridiculous.

Also, don't give me that "it's a performance car" bullcorn. There are plenty of other "performance cars" that don't require you to check the oil level at every fill up. Don't make an excuse for poor engineering.

Reality is very different from your opinion. The fact is the its been shown that these Gen V cars are often using oil and that the level must be checked on a regular basis in order to make sure the engine doesn't starve. It's absolutely 'silly' (to use your favorite saying) to compare it to other performance cars since it is what it is. Who at this point cares what other cars require. If all it takes, to feel better about the car, is to check the oil, then this is truly not a big deal. Unless opening the hood and pulling out the oil stick is to much of an obstacle of course

Do you own a Gen V car ??? If so, do you not check the oil because it's 'ridiculous' to have to ?

[commandomatt]

The manual's verbiage is idiotic. The worst time to check your oil is at the gas station. It could take hours for your "sprung" oil to find its way back to the pan, especially in an 8+ Liter engine. The best time to check your oil is after the car has been sitting overnight or for at least a couple hours. First thing in the morning would be ideal for the daily drivers.

I agree with NT-ACR, you shouldn't have to check your oil every day.

But with all the things going on and problems on the table that haven't been explained, you can make that decision.

So if you prefer to check the oil in the morning...then do so (even though not recommended). Point is to check the oil often to make sure you are not running low. There is very little we really have to do to these cars and people are just getting to comfortable and spoiled with the 'Honda Accord' type of maintenance rituals . More time is spent on figuring out how to work their cell phones into the system than getting to know the mechanical aspects of the car

[Jack B]

You are taking this way too easy, if there is an engine problem I would put that dealer on notice that their inability to check oil contributed to or exacerbated the engine issue. At a minimum, give them your findings (low oil) and ask them to explain how they missed that, I would want to be looking directly at the tech when you ask the question.



Definitely low on oil. With engine hot, only comes up halfway to safe area. I ruled that out after taking it to HB Dodge which have been the guys I've taken it to since I picked it up... Won't be going back again. Lol.
Well, it's got an appt at A&C Performance tomorrow and we'll be taking a look at everything the dealership said was good to go. Hopefully no damage has been done as I haven't run her hard since the last oil change. I feel like an idiot, a humble idiot at that as I should have known better. Thanks guys

[ViperTony]

The manual's verbiage is idiotic. The worst time to check your oil is at the gas station. It could take hours for your "sprung" oil to find its way back to the pan, especially in an 8+ Liter engine. The best time to check your oil is after the car has been sitting overnight or for at least a couple hours. First thing in the morning would be ideal for the daily drivers.

I agree with NT-ACR, you shouldn't have to check your oil every day.

But with all the things going on and problems on the table that haven't been explained, you can make that decision.

Actually:

20217

And:
http://driveviper.com/forums/threads/12884-Oil-level-check-question?p=207444#post207444


Here's what SRT says about checking oil in a Gen 5. This is directly from SRT.

“So like we discussed – the 15MY has the updated dipstick to decrease the likelihood of wiping (has the s-bend in it) – so it should be easier to read on his car vs. previous years.

· The method you’ve mentioned (where the vehicle is warmed then sits for 5 minutes before checking the oil) is definitely the best method and you’re right, that is exactly what is in the manual.

o The reasoning behind it is that the engine will trap oil in galleries, components, etc and as you let the engine sit, that oil eventually drains down to the pan. Thus showing higher on the stick when your car sits for a while. Having the warm oil level at the full mark 5 minutes after turning the car off ensures that there is the correct amount of oil in the car.

o To answer your other question – it’s certainly reasonable to see large swings in oil level using those two methods to check the level. I would even recommend checking it within 1 minute of the 5 minute mark after shutting the car off – waiting to 10 minutes would probably show a completely different reading.

o Additional Note: It says this in the manual, but be sure to park on level ground – not doing that can change the oil level dramatically as well.”

[EZ 2B Green]

Isn't checking the oil very often only necessary during the break-in period? The Gen IV's were the same way (burned lots of oil for the first 1000 to 2000 miles). Mine did and now not a drop. I recall a thread that Gen V oil consumption drops drastically after a few thousand miles.

I'll be ready with spare quarts of oil when my Gen V arrives.

[ViperTony]

Isn't checking the oil very often only necessary during the break-in period? The Gen IV's were the same way (burned lots of oil for the first 1000 to 2000 miles). Mine did and now not a drop. I recall a thread that Gen V oil consumption drops drastically after a few thousand miles.

I'll be ready with spare quarts of oil when my Gen V arrives.

Same procedure is recommended during the break-in period:

20218

[darbgnik]

Isn't checking the oil very often only necessary during the break-in period? The Gen IV's were the same way (burned lots of oil for the first 1000 to 2000 miles). Mine did and now not a drop. I recall a thread that Gen V oil consumption drops drastically after a few thousand miles.

I'll be ready with spare quarts of oil when my Gen V arrives.

Generally, yes. My 15 sealed up tight after 1000 miles, but there are a few that don't..........

[uberpube]

The viper engine car oil pan has no real sump to it, its probably not that hard to uncover the pickup being so long and flat.

[EZ 2B Green]

The viper engine car oil pan has no real sump to it, its probably not that hard to uncover the pickup being so long and flat.

That is addressed by the swivel on the oil pickup.

[NT-ACR]

Reality is very different from your opinion. The fact is the its been shown that these Gen V cars are often using oil and that the level must be checked on a regular basis in order to make sure the engine doesn't starve. It's absolutely 'silly' (to use your favorite saying) to compare it to other performance cars since it is what it is. Who at this point cares what other cars require. If all it takes, to feel better about the car, is to check the oil, then this is truly not a big deal. Unless opening the hood and pulling out the oil stick is to much of an obstacle of course

Do you own a Gen V car ??? If so, do you not check the oil because it's 'ridiculous' to have to ?

The reason I compared it to other "performance cars" is because of this statement by cashcorn:

"You should always check it every time, before start-up and after shut-down (it's a performance car!)"

I interpreted that as cashcorn acting like this is something all "performance cars" do. Simple fact is that it isn't.

If owners WANT to check their oil levels at each fill up, that's completely fine. My point is that it's silly that they HAVE to.

As for whether I own a Gen V, the answer is, no. I've only owned two Gen 4s (an '09 ACR and a '10 ACR), so I guess that precludes me from having an opinion on this matter.

[Sub Driver]

Why is there so much push back on checking oil levels? I do this on all my vehicles. It seems ridiculous to think you should never have to do this...just laziness I guess.

[swexlin]

You are taking this way too easy, if there is an engine problem I would put that dealer on notice that their inability to check oil contributed to or exacerbated the engine issue. At a minimum, give them your findings (low oil) and ask them to explain how they missed that, I would want to be looking directly at the tech when you ask the question.

I agree with Jack 100%! Push back on your dealer, take a pic of the level on the dipstick.

[uberpube]

That is addressed by the swivel on the oil pickup.

Only to a degree, its still not sitting in 5" to 6" of oil immediately surrounded by close proximity walls like a drop sump pan. Thats why people are having oil pressure issues only being down a bit on oil.

[commandomatt]

As for whether I own a Gen V, the answer is, no. I've only owned two Gen 4s (an '09 ACR and a '10 ACR), so I guess that precludes me from having an opinion on this matter.

There is nothing 'only' about 2 Gen IV ACR's......awesome cars. Reason I asked about the GenV was that those that own them, regardless of their opinion about whether it's engineered correctly or not, inconvenient or seemingly redundant, should get used to checking the oil regularly for piece of mind. I know I will be

[ViperJon]

Many of us are spoiled having previous generation cars. Checking the oil regularly meant once a year or the next oil change.
The oil level seldom moved. Now I check it warm and cold after every drive.

[Special Ed]

You are taking this way too easy, if there is an engine problem I would put that dealer on notice that their inability to check oil contributed to or exacerbated the engine issue. At a minimum, give them your findings (low oil) and ask them to explain how they missed that, I would want to be looking directly at the tech when you ask the question.

And then looking in a mirror when you ask yourself the same question.

[swexlin]

Many of us are spoiled having previous generation cars. Checking the oil regularly meant once a year or the next oil change.
The oil level seldom moved. Now I check it warm and cold after every drive.

Yes, for whatever reason, the Gen 5 is different. By the way, we are not the only ones. I am over on the Hellcat forums as well, and excessive oil usage (and a hard-to-read dipstick!) are heavily discussed over there as well. Seems the 6.2 Hemi likes its oil.

[Martin]

Just for fun, I thought I'd comment... I had a Mercedes that never lost a drop of oil through it's entire lifespan. I also once had a Fiat that drank oil faster than it drank gasoline. Coincidence? I think not...

[NT-ACR]

Many of us are spoiled having previous generation cars. Checking the oil regularly meant once a year or the next oil change.
The oil level seldom moved. Now I check it warm and cold after every drive.

Exactly!

[NT-ACR]

There is nothing 'only' about 2 Gen IV ACR's......awesome cars. Reason I asked about the GenV was that those that own them, regardless of their opinion about whether it's engineered correctly or not, inconvenient or seemingly redundant, should get used to checking the oil regularly for piece of mind. I know I will be

I understand.

[donk_316]

I documented the oil level and amount needed at every fuel up.

Engine all but stopped using oil at 1700kms. Now I only lose a little oil through the DSE sealed system which I have no issue with. I would rather catch it than gum up my intake.

[Talon.Smith]

Wow. A lot more feedback than I expected, thanks everyone. We had to reschedule appt at A&C and will be taking a look on Monday now instead. I'm on my way to grab oil now as I'm not going to move it prior to being at safe zone. Honestly, I hadn't read the manual in regards to checking oil. I've always had oil changes every ~3k miles and checked fluid levels before and after hard runs. I will of course now check at every fuel up after it sits 5 mins.
Learned a lot... even a little from the keyboard warriors with nothing constructive to say. Lol. Thanks for your input nonetheless. :)

[Jack B]

1. Four qts down is not a bit.

2. Past viper pans have been baffled, as is the G5.

3. This is not a oil pan design issue. The ACR is routinely doing 1.2 G sweepers with no problems

I do not understand why you try to make an issue where there is none . Are there issues yes, but, this is not one.


Only to a degree, its still not sitting in 5" to 6" of oil immediately surrounded by close proximity walls like a drop sump pan. Thats why people are having oil pressure issues only being down a bit on oil.

[SNK3BIT]

Owner's shouldn't have to be checking their oil at each fill up and shitting their pants that their engine will fail any second. Get off your high horse!

Glad I was proven right Lol! Whether they should have to or not is beside the point....it's 130k car....check the fucking oil....takes 5 seconds. Smh!


Yeah...just ask the speed shops.....

Since you nailed me down....Todd at A&C said to check your oil often. He said the only blown motors he's seeing are people that are low on oil. He said one customer came in his shop with knock after a road course....he was 5 quarts low....so the customer put 5 quarts in and drove it to dealer and got a New motor under warranty.....man I hate talking for other people...call Todd im sure he wouldn't mind talking about it.

[SNK3BIT]

On a side note....my 2013 GTS just hit 10,000 miles. I run it pretty hard and occasionally add oil. I specifically asked Todd about these motor failures and he said he had full confidence in these engines....he was even in the process of buying another one.....he told me a story about one customers car on nitrous that was on the Dyno and the throttle got stuck at the top of 3rd in WOT position bouncing off the rev limiter for 40 seconds and the motors fine....his words not mine....ask him about it....just remember he's busy running a business

[swexlin]

That is what is so puzzling and frustrating about these failures. Many cars are run hard, raced, etc, no issues. Others are show queens driven lightly, and blow up. Yes, SOME are caused by low oil, but not all. And even though Dodge says it is normal, going through a quart per 1000 miles (like my car, and some others do) seems excessive to me. My 2 cents.

[SNK3BIT]

That is what is so puzzling and frustrating about these failures. Many cars are run hard, raced, etc, no issues. Others are show queens driven lightly, and blow up. Yes, SOME are caused by low oil, but not all. And even though Dodge says it is normal, going through a quart per 1000 miles (like my car, and some others do) seems excessive to me. My 2 cents.

Agree.....but im still checking it. Lol

[swexlin]

You and me both ! 11,400 miles on mine now

[SNK3BIT]

You and me both ! 11,400 miles on mine now

We should start a trend....higher the mileage the more your car is worth.....mine has 10,000 on it......ill sell it right now for 150K. Whos bidding? :D

[uberpube]

1. Four qts down is not a bit.

2. Past viper pans have been baffled, as is the G5.

3. This is not a oil pan design issue. The ACR is routinely doing 1.2 G sweepers with no problems

I do not understand why you try to make an issue where there is none . Are there issues yes, but, this is not one.

The pan design is fine, as long as its full of oil ... the issue is,its just not as forgiving as a design if oil level is low compared to a pan with a small box sump area....

[uberpube]

Yes, for whatever reason, the Gen 5 is different. By the way, we are not the only ones. I am over on the Hellcat forums as well, and excessive oil usage (and a hard-to-read dipstick!) are heavily discussed over there as well. Seems the 6.2 Hemi likes its oil.

With the Hemi, from what I have seen with a 6.1, it doesn't like Mobil 1, it seems to end up in the air filter box. I switched to ENEOS on mine and now it uses no oil between oil changes. The Jeep though is the same for oil level checking, if you check it cold it shows normal when its actually a little low, check it hot at a gas station and it'll be 5/8 inch lower on the stick.

[Viper Granny]

Wow. A lot more feedback than I expected, thanks everyone. We had to reschedule appt at A&C and will be taking a look on Monday now instead. I'm on my way to grab oil now as I'm not going to move it prior to being at safe zone. Honestly, I hadn't read the manual in regards to checking oil. I've always had oil changes every ~3k miles and checked fluid levels before and after hard runs. I will of course now check at every fuel up after it sits 5 mins.
Learned a lot... even a little from the keyboard warriors with nothing constructive to say. Lol. Thanks for your input nonetheless. :)

"Learned a lot..." You and me both. I've owned 3 Stealth TTs back in the day but I bought them used. Ive never owned this type of exotic with engine break in requirements. So glad I read this thread. Thanks to all respondents.

[Jack B]

My 5.7 Jeep GC does the same. My 13 would use a qt every 5000, my 15 uses no oil, but, it shows a qt diff from hot to cold.


With the Hemi, from what I have seen with a 6.1, it doesn't like Mobil 1, it seems to end up in the air filter box. I switched to ENEOS on mine and now it uses no oil between oil changes. The Jeep though is the same for oil level checking, if you check it cold it shows normal when its actually a little low, check it hot at a gas station and it'll be 5/8 inch lower on the stick.

[Sub Driver]

"Learned a lot..." You and me both. I've owned 3 Stealth TTs back in the day but I bought them used. Ive never owned this type of exotic with engine break in requirements. So glad I read this thread. Thanks to all respondents.

Every vehicle has engine break-in requirements.

[sadil]

Just for some interesting knowledge, the track guys in the UAE are using 15W50 or10W60 oil with 12-12.5L fill!

[swexlin]

Talon, any update for us?