I actually like my ACR-E

[kverges]

With all the negativity that seems to prevail of late, I thought I would remark that I actually like my car. I've had no significant issues with it and it performs brilliantly on track, its intended environment. I am not overly concerned about the warranty being honored, in part because I have not and do not intend to make any modifications to it.

And with all the negative posts, I have tried to keep up and learn facts, but I've seen none. It appears to all be opinion and pretty negative at that.

Not that it will make any difference, but those of you who complain, complain, complain, you do know that you are hurting the value of your car on resale?

If there are genuinely negative facts, then I can certainly understand publicizing the facts. But there sure is a lot of noise and not much signal on what may or may not be wrong with some of the cars.

The few folks I personally know with Gen V cars have not had any problems, either.

I would sure love to see more posts with technical information on set up, handling improvements, and things like that but those seem to get lost pretty quickly with the proliferation of the speculative complaints about "spun bearings" and differential failures.

Anecdotally, my car is subject to the differential recall but I broke it in carefully and have no diff noise at present, so I am considering that a spare sitting on the shelf and waiting for me. I found it pretty proactive on SRT's part and consider it a positive, personally.

The car is sublime to drive, gorgeous to look at and a reason why my 991 GT3 is for sale.

I frequent Rennlist and the GT3 has clearly had its share of problems, and yet the owners there are very positive on the car and the brand. The Z06 has huge overheating problems on track, and yet the owners there seem to be as a rule far more positive, too.

[ssjcreeper]

Absolutely thrilled with mine. As much as I enjoyed my modded Gen III... I'm obsessed with my Gen V. Only regret was that I waited this long to upgrade.

[Martin]

Thanks for posting this. All the complaints and gripes I've been reading really don't have much of a positive effect, and to be honest, there are a lot more things in life that are screwed up that the antics of FCA really fall into the "first world problems" category. I mean, there are some things in life that deserve negative attention, but spending time bitching and moaning about a car?

Really bums me out personally because my major battle in life right now is a fight against cancer. I promised myself that when the doctors tell me I'm 100% out of the woods I'm going to spring for a new ACR-E - and hearing all the bitching and moaning about the Gen V and FCA is seriously taking the wind out of my sails.

[1of1TA1.0]

Agreed and good post Keith. I wish could get some rear knuckles so I could do a full write up on Installing ACR brakes onto a Gen V non ACR :)


Thanks for posting this. All the complaints and gripes I've been reading really don't have much of a positive effect, and to be honest, there are a lot more things in life that are screwed up that the antics of FCA really fall into the "first world problems" category. I mean, there are some things in life that deserve negative attention, but spending time bitching and moaning about a car?

Really bums me out personally because my major battle in life right now is a fight against cancer. I promised myself that when the doctors tell me I'm 100% out of the woods I'm going to spring for a new ACR-E - and hearing all the bitching and moaning about the Gen V and FCA is seriously taking the wind out of my sails.

[Bruce H.]

Great to hear you're enjoying your car. I've got about 25,000 miles on my '14 TA and just love it more every day. I have a very capable Viper Tech looking after my car, Garron on these forums, and he's kept it in tip top condition with fluid changes and minor warranty work. I thought my high mileage Supra TT and MR2T were the most durable track day cars imaginable, with over 100 track days between them without anything beyond normal maintenance, and the TA is on track to do the same...at a much higher performance level.

I drive mine as often and as far as I can come up with good reasons for, with a distant road course usually a part of that, and I hope you enjoy yours as relentlessly as I do.

[Rapidrezults]

As much as I don't like the way some things are being handled at the corporate level, I absolutely love my ACR-E and wouldn't trade anything for it. If my motor blows, I'll rebuild it better and stronger and continue to track the smack out of it. It is everything one could ever want in a street/track toy, and it also just happens to be made in America. :United_States:

[Augdog1964]

Amen! Me too! I have nothing but good things to say about FCA... just went through a buyback on my wife's Grand Cherokee Summit with the EcoDiesel... they know they had sensor issues, they bought it back and we bought a new 5.7 Hemi Grand Cherokee... and looking to buy another ACR-E just for fun and history...

My sons drive a Challenger, Charger, my wife's Grand Cherokee, my Hellcat, my Viper ACR-E, our lake house has a new Hard Rock Jeep Rubicon... they all sit next to my '68 426 Hemi Charger original red RT, and our 2003 Jeep TJ... so we are heavy MOPAR and they have always treated us right.

In case you are all ready... Thanks FCA!

Dave Bane
Richmond IN
Augdog1964

[zee]

My TA is a dream to drive. The motor issues are by far in the minority. Sucks about some of the stories we hear about mods and warranty, but again, way more positive than negative. I may need to let mine go due to my first born coming soon, but will try my hardest to keep it even if I can't drive it as much.

[ViperPete]

Thanks for posting this.

When you shine a light on what's wrong, what's wrong has a tendency to persist with greater power.

I love my car. Its magic to drive. Magic on peoples faces when they see it, and i just love the ownership (that includes all the stuff that has gone wrong with it) still no sour taste in my mouth.

[swexlin]

I too love my car. It's my second Viper, and as fun as m 03 was, this is a whole other lever. I'll have it 2 years October, bought with 7200 miles, now have 11,300. Car has been reliable so far, only warranty issue was my diff which whined at high speed, was replaced under warranty now hassle. (Interestingly the new diff makes a little noise too, but not like the old one).

My 03 never left me stranded in the 4 years I owned it, hope this one will be the same (knock wood!). Had an 07 SRT8 Superbee (miss it!) and I'm on my 4th Ram truck, and this one has been perfect so far. Its a Charger with a bed.

That being said - I hope I don't have any major issue, but if I do, I do, and we'll let the warranty handle it.

[mikesax]

With all the negativity that seems to prevail of late, I thought I would remark that I actually like my car. I've had no significant issues with it and it performs brilliantly on track, its intended environment. I am not overly concerned about the warranty being honored, in part because I have not and do not intend to make any modifications to it.

And with all the negative posts, I have tried to keep up and learn facts, but I've seen none. It appears to all be opinion and pretty negative at that.

Not that it will make any difference, but those of you who complain, complain, complain, you do know that you are hurting the value of your car on resale?

If there are genuinely negative facts, then I can certainly understand publicizing the facts. But there sure is a lot of noise and not much signal on what may or may not be wrong with some of the cars.

The few folks I personally know with Gen V cars have not had any problems, either.

I would sure love to see more posts with technical information on set up, handling improvements, and things like that but those seem to get lost pretty quickly with the proliferation of the speculative complaints about "spun bearings" and differential failures.

Anecdotally, my car is subject to the differential recall but I broke it in carefully and have no diff noise at present, so I am considering that a spare sitting on the shelf and waiting for me. I found it pretty proactive on SRT's part and consider it a positive, personally.

The car is sublime to drive, gorgeous to look at and a reason why my 991 GT3 is for sale.

I frequent Rennlist and the GT3 has clearly had its share of problems, and yet the owners there are very positive on the car and the brand. The Z06 has huge overheating problems on track, and yet the owners there seem to be as a rule far more positive, too.
THANK YOU for the post KVERGES!! It's hard to listen to "grown men WHINE"!!! I've put 20,000 miles on my 13-20,000 on my 14 an 10,000 on my 15- and so far an O2 sensor on my 13 was it!! I'm aware there have been issues-SUCKS for those guys- but we seem to have a WHINEY DOZEN of members who love to post their WHINEY OPINIONS-at the drop of EVERY problem!! I look at the other forums too-MANY more members-and even with their problems their WHINING is minimal to our site!! Very good observation on the members of all 3 sites- I'm off to put some MORE miles on a Viper before night falls- PEACE OUT!!

[Terminator02]

THANK YOU for the post KVERGES!! It's hard to listen to "grown men WHINE"!!! I've put 20,000 miles on my 13-20,000 on my 14 an 10,000 on my 15- and so far an O2 sensor on my 13 was it!! I'm aware there have been issues-SUCKS for those guys- but we seem to have a WHINEY DOZEN of members who love to post their WHINEY OPINIONS-at the drop of EVERY problem!! I look at the other forums too-MANY more members-and even with their problems their WHINING is minimal to our site!! Very good observation on the members of all 3 sites- I'm off to put some MORE miles on a Viper before night falls- PEACE OUT!!

I hope you see the irony of your post :D

[mikesax]

I hope you see the irony of your post :D

Yup-knew that was coming!!

[Lizzardking308]

Another positive thread! Who would have thought!?!

Got to put some miles on mine this weekend, still like Christmas morning every time I push that red button...

[Terminator02]

Yup-knew that was coming!!

Haha. All in good fun. I just like reading how many miles you put on your vipers. I'm daily driving mine and am loving every mile.

[VENOM V]

I don't get sucked into the negativity either.

I learned long ago that if you mod a car you're taking a risk that a warranty claim won't be honored so I leave my Vipers stock. Not judging anyone that mods, just saying it's not for me.

It is freakin track nirvana, the best track car ever made period. God bless America ��

[Viper Granny]

Whew! Glad I found this thread. I was beginning to worry even before my 2017's production begins, which should be soon since I got my vin July 7. Thank you all.

[TrackratViper]

I had a 2014 TA before getting the ACR. Both are awesome cars with no significant issues as far as I am concerned. I use the ACR as a track only car and just love its amazing handling and power.

[Policy Limits]

Even if you don't mod tracking voids warranty too apparently. Silly since the car was made for it especially variants like "time attack" and "American club racer" but a rebuild is chump change so suppose it's immaterial.

[Larryskillzs]

Can I love my 15' SRT as well in here, or is this thread limited to ACR-e's and T/A's only. :D

I love my Viper. It's amazing. I truly feel it will be the last true badass NA, manual only car created.

[CarolinaViper]

Great to see a post in the positive, was beginning to think this forum was like the all other types of media....bad new sells a lot more than good news. I am fortunate to be able to have purchased a 2015 SRT in May 2015, put over 11K miles, check the oil routinely, considered a Arrow PCM, thought that 20 more HP was not worth the risk of the warranty. Even with all the issues of the engines, (yes more problems than there should be with the low volume of cars), I am in the process of purchasing a new Gen V. Highly believe if I don't mod the Viper, I will not have any problems with warranty concerns.

[gcrain]

I love my ACR-E too, the feeling of connectedness with the car is unbelievable. Not to be crude but driving any other car feels like you are wearing the world's thickest condom.

The problem is I am afraid to drive it now. FCA's behavior is outrageous so I don't think it is unexpected that people are outraged.

I think people are already starting to calm down some and look at this from the perspective of how can we make FCA do the right thing. I want FCA to take care of the 2 people currently effected but more importantly they need to be more transparent about what the problem is. Whatever the problem is it is probably less scary than the unknown.

[BJG32]

Another "nothing wrong with my car (currently) so whats the problem?" post.

Keep your car stock and off tracks so you can increase your chances of feeling how you currently do.

Remember, we all felt the way you do at one point in time.

[kverges]

My car lives at the track. Literally. It is at MotorSport Ranch in track trim now and the next time I drive it will be on track.

[lmcgrew79]

Taking mine to autox tomorrow and to the track again in 2 weeks:) As for set up im pretty sure the car needs a bit more rake than what is stated as the factory setup. To me at the limit with either slicks or the factory tires with the 4 inch front and 5.5 inch rear rake there is still mid to corner exit under-steer, turn it is pretty good and the rear really seems hooked everywhere. I think ill go with a few extra turns and raise the rear to check the results, i have the rear wing on setting 1. I think the front camber max should be around 2.7 it still make be slightly to much as the car is stiff and dont roll much. 3.0 will destroy the inside edges of the tires in my experiance. Im planning on keeping mine stock, its as fast as 99 percent of the cars your gonna run with anyways. I may look into making a diff cooler setup as i think its a good idea and nobody else is making one that i know if. On a good note i just replaced my diff fluid after 3 track weekends and 3500 miles total and it seems to be in very good condition.

Minor issues to keep an eye one. Mine was one of the very early diff failures on my way home from pickup but they took care of it very quickly. It has burned a good bit of oil since day 1 but has really slacked off around 3000 miles. CHECK OIL OFTEN!!! Started throwing code P0430 and i swapped the rear 02 sensor which didnt clear it, then viper tech dave from roanoke suggested that i do the front sensor and it cleared it these are pretty cheap so i think its worth getting an extra front as i also heard a few sensors have went bad, The driver side exhaust side sill got toasted from end piece rolling down, just waiting on that from dealer, if you see your start moving you may wanna tack weld the end piece as a few have done it that i know of.

As Keith said the car is awesome, looks killer and is a terror on track!!

[BJG32]

My car lives at the track. Literally. It is at MotorSport Ranch in track trim now and the next time I drive it will be on track.

Like it should be, but fyi you now have no warranty.

[Arizona Vipers]

The reason why there aren't many "positive" posts at this point is that nobody wants to talk about their mods anymore. Who here now wants to post about their new mods when they know Chrysler is voiding warranty's for mods?
What else is there to talk about? What is the best wax to use? The best cell phone holder? When is the next Cars and Coffee?

I love my ACR too, but it sucks to buy a car like this and to not be able to do any mods whatsoever for fear of blowing a motor.
I've bought 60+ cars in the last 20 years or so and part of the enjoyment of buying/owning a car is modifying it. I would assume that 99% of the guys here are the same way.
Every car I have ever bought I have modified and I've never had one issue ever due to the mod, much less a warranty claim denied and I crank my Mercedes daily drivers to over 800 horsepower and run them hard.
My stock ACR does not sound like I want a car to sound. To pay $150K for a car and not even be able to change the mufflers because of the high rate of blown motors and knowing Chrysler wont warranty their manufacturing defect flat out sucks.

[ViperJon]

In my six months of ownership I've had two recalls (front passenger airbag and rear differential) and today once again being transported to the dealer to try to fix a stalling problem. Car can't go fifteen minutes without stalling just sitting there idling. And all before it has 1000 miles on it. Sorry if I'm not as thrilled as people who haven't had any issues. But I guess mentioning that makes me a whiner?

[Bruce H.]

In my six months of ownership I've had two recalls (front passenger airbag and rear differential) and today once again being transported to the dealer to try to fix a stalling problem. Car can't go fifteen minutes without stalling just sitting there idling. And all before it has 1000 miles on it. Sorry if I'm not as thrilled as people who haven't had any issues. But I guess mentioning that makes me a whiner?

Hey, isn't that more miles than you put on your TA the whole time you owned it? You loved that Gen V so much that you bought another, so I'm thinking you're going to love this one once some initial stuff gets cleaned up under warranty. I suspect if you whine in the future it'll be about selling that TA! :)

[kverges]

Like it should be, but fyi you now have no warranty.

Not sure why you say that. In fact it's been to dealer from track once already and even arrived in my trailer.

[CarolinaViper]

Another "nothing wrong with my car (currently) so whats the problem?" post.

Keep your car stock and off tracks so you can increase your chances of feeling how you currently do.

Remember, we all felt the way you do at one point in time.

Been to the track of five different occasions...had a blast and not worried about the engine.

[BJG32]

Not sure why you say that. In fact it's been to dealer from track once already and even arrived in my trailer.


19404

[Policy Limits]

I complained about quality control before it was popular haha

I had a friend blow his motor in his C7 and the dealer checked GPS to determine if he was on the track. He wasn't and they ordered a crate motor and replaced under warranty. Just seems silly if it were built for that purpose like TA or ACR

[BJG32]

Not sure why you say that. In fact it's been to dealer from track once already and even arrived in my trailer.


19405

[Dave292]

Love my ACR-E. No issues. Want issues??? Own a Gt3RS Porsche and deal with the coolant pipe issues for an engine out fix on every car and it's not covered by the warranty. Viper is a dream!!

[ViperSmith]

This forum is full of debbie downers.

people want to talk about enjoying the car and gets flooded with negativity.

there are legitimate issues but it isn't the norm. stop acting like it is.

[VENOM V]

Yep, but these waves come and go.

As far as the possibility of the factory denying a claim because it was tracked, that must be the exception not the norm. Not worried about it.

I'll add, I LOVE MY FREAKIN ACR! 4,000 mostly track miles, and before that 15,000 mostly track miles on my GTS. Rock solid. Wouldn't trade it for anything

[BJG32]

I felt exactly like OP until my engine went at 3500 miles.

Months of waiting and FCA replaced. ZERO problems to date besides oil burning at unusual rates. FCA said my engine was now solid and issues corrected. They put in a 2016 engine.

Like a fool i believed them and did mods that will use against me if I have warranty issues. I hope the 2 that went are because they didn't check oil levels...we'll never know the truth if they added after the fact.

Engines are popping and the perception is FCA is throwing their hands up. Its an $8k risk every time i start the engine.

My car feels "rock solid". They all do until they go. The reality is we have no idea what gremlins await us and the parent company is looking for ways to pass the buck to us.

I love my viper, but the fun factor is taking a beating. I choose not to be ignorant. As more engines pop it'll be fun to look back at the comments made about us tin foil hat wearing fools. More will join us, just pray its not you...

In the end I really hope for a solid resolution that protects us all. We deserve it.

[commandomatt]

I would be lying if I said that I wasn't a bit worried about what has come to light in the last month or so. I have had zero issues with my 2010 ACR and certainly hope that the 2017 ACRE that I have on order with Bill will be trouble free as well.

While I get that parts can be replaced and issues can be fixed, the fact is that I am 1000 miles from Woodhouse and any major work (even if covered) turns in to a major PITA.

I was originally going to get a 16 but decided to wait it out to get the last year Viper. I hope that what they have learned from previous years will be dealt with on this last batch or cars. I know....its wishful thinking but I have to look at it in a positive way.

I also have to say that anyone not getting their 2017 from one of the big 3 is taking an additional risk. While dealerships will tell you that they will take care of you if you have any trouble, fact is that once production stops, they will have very little incentive to keep a Viper tech on staff and be able to help you if something goes wrong. The big 3 will be selling, servicing and upgrading Vipers for years to come and they will be someone you can count on to go to bat for you. They have proven this by their actions in the past and I am sure they will be there down the road

So I hope that the next few months will show some positive (not the standard "I Love my Viper' feedback) from FCA, CAAP and from those taking delivery of their 17's. I cant wait to get behind the wheel of this last of a kind car

[yellowmz3]

Love my ACR

[Terminator02]

OP so you are upset there isn't more discussion on tuning, set up, and other focused discussions so you create a thread having nothing to do with that but state how you love the car and you are keeping it stock?(which we all know because you have said you are keeping it stock numerous in numerous threads while also giving armchair input on why modding a car is bad for the track). K. Awesome.

[kverges]

I have started a thread on my experience with setup, but gets light traffic:

http://driveviper.com/forums/threads/14176-Setup-notes-ACR-E?highlight=Kverges

As for the screen shot of Jorgenson's post I don't know that I'd consider that definitive on warranty coverage for use of car on track. If I abuse the car on track, like missed shift or not checking oil then that would bar coverage. But I've looked at the manual and warranty booklet and don't see an exclusion for track use, but maybe I missed it.

I can say I've gone track to dealer and had warranty work done, FWIW. And I've had similar experience with Porsche and McLaren and Mazda and others, I just don't see DE usage being an automatic denial. Now if SRT is saying it is, I'd like to know that because I think that such a blanket position is wrong, again unless the manual or warranty booklet have a track exclusion.

Maybe I will have a major problem and face warranty denial. But I've had neither so far and don't personally see the need to get worked up. I will say that the car is marketed for track driving and comes with a setup supplement so I would be surprised to see a warranty denial for doing what is in the manual. I've seen very few facts about the bearing problem, but maybe I missed an announcement by SRT or Arrow on their assessment of root cause. I know some folks are working hard with SRT and Arrow on getting root cause analysis to deal with warranty denials, but other than opinions that tunes can or can't cause failures or that debris has or has not caused failures (and I have not seen any quotes from or by SRT or Arrow on this) I don't know what is going on. The few photos I have seen are hard to interpret other than they sure look like lack of oil, but no scoring from debris at that bearing (maybe debris blocked a gallery?).

The sticky thread on engine failures appears to have very little traffic.

It just seems like a lot of speculation and a lot of it by people without any problems and a very powerful negative sentiment that I don't presently understand or share. So I thought WTH, how about a place for positive thoughts?

Granted, not objective, but that kind of thing seems hard to find when discussing problems with the car.

[Terminator02]

Well I think the forums typically bring out different characteristics about not only cars but the people when compared to real world interactions. I only found myself worrying about the bearing issues when perusing the forums and it didn't cross my mind when driving. It's just the nature of the Internet and forum culture.

I was with another albeit now much less crowded viper site since 2004 and the people and topics never change. People want steals when they buy then cry when they get offered nothing on resale, the popular posters have minion followers and a large amount of koolaid seems to be consumed by some.

With that, I found some awesome people from the forums and sifting through the douche baggary nets me great outcomes. I had a gen ll ACR and the harmonic balancer came undone ripping the crank threads apart. A 22k Chrysler quote turned to a 9k arrow rebuild quote which turned to a flat bed to a forum members home for pinning the balancer to the crank for practically free.

I just think viper owners are fanatical about the brand, upset at the end of production and current problems and it's just temporarily manifesting on the forums as an outlet. You are right, irl, everyone I know is driving and enjoying the car. I was just around 60+ owners in Michigan and no one was preoccupied about bearing failures. However it doesn't negate the importance of being educated on what's happening since it appears to be a pervading problem that may affect many people once they start driving the car more.

[swexlin]

Well I think the forums typically bring out different characteristics about not only cars but the people when compared to real world interactions. I only found myself worrying about the bearing issues when perusing the forums and it didn't cross my mind when driving. It's just the nature of the Internet and forum culture.

I was with another albeit now much less crowded viper site since 2004 and the people and topics never change. People want steals when they buy then cry when they get offered nothing on resale, the popular posters have minion followers and a large amount of koolaid seems to be consumed by some.

With that, I found some awesome people from the forums and sifting through the douche baggary nets me great outcomes. I had a gen ll ACR and the harmonic balancer came undone ripping the crank threads apart. A 22k Chrysler quote turned to a 9k arrow rebuild quote which turned to a flat bed to a forum members home for pinning the balancer to the crank for practically free.

I just think viper owners are fanatical about the brand, upset at the end of production and current problems and it's just temporarily manifesting on the forums as an outlet. You are right, irl, everyone I know is driving and enjoying the car. I was just around 60+ owners in Michigan and no one was preoccupied about bearing failures. However it doesn't negate the importance of being educated on what's happening since it appears to be a pervading problem that may affect many people once they start driving the car more.


Excellent post. As we always say, come for the cars, stay for the people. Since being a Viper owner, I've made lifelong friendships, that will long outlast my ownership of this Viper, or any car.

[Viper Girl]

Lets keep this on track...


the OP seemingly wants to read positive lighter hearted conversation about ACR-E's...
There are plenty of other threads to go post in... Every thread doesn't need to end in doom and gloom...

Not saying theres not an issue... it just doesn't need to permeate every thread...

[v10enomous]

Another positive thread! Who would have thought!?!

Got to put some miles on mine this weekend, still like Christmas morning every time I push that red button...

Ha... Yep. Taking the covers off is like unwrapping the presents...

[BAD BEAR]

In my six months of ownership I've had two recalls (front passenger airbag and rear differential) and today once again being transported to the dealer to try to fix a stalling problem. Car can't go fifteen minutes without stalling just sitting there idling. And all before it has 1000 miles on it. Sorry if I'm not as thrilled as people who haven't had any issues. But I guess mentioning that makes me a whiner?

Just be glad it wasn't your REAR passenger airbag and FRONT differential!:rolleyes:

[FSTENUF]

This is my 3rd Viper and my 2nd Gen V. I have waited a long time to have a car like this. It is your one stop shop for the best of both worlds. I can drive on the street and get so many thumbs up and nice ride comments that you feel like a rock star. Go to the track and just kick the crap out of every other car in your run class. It sucks that this is the end of the Viper as we know it but as long as I can get tires and parts when needed I will keep the car running down the street and track till they put me in a hole in the ground. Long live the Snake.

[Darius]

0 Problems with my ACR, doesn't use a drip of oil. MY TA used quite a bit at 1st, a quart every 500 miles or so when it was new but slowed down. My 2016 never changes. Every time I check it it's in the same spot. Just the luck of the draw I guess.

[darbgnik]

I show up to my dealership with rubber sausages still clinging to the tire treads from the track. They can test FCA's resolve on warranty all they want, it's not going to change how I treat the car one bit. The Gen 5 is the best Viper track car to date, with the ACR even besting that! Top up the tire fund, and carry on.

[gcrain]

I don't think they are revoking warranties for going to the track but they are refusing to fix issues that only show up at the track.

i.e. 3rd gear has a problem over 5k RPM. Well that is well over the speed limit so no soup for you.

Love my ACR but I do think we need to force FCA's hand on this one.

[kverges]

What is 3rd gear problem over 5K RPM? I run 3rd to redline on track no problem - or at least none that I have noticed.

If a dealer is saying over speed limit, maybe someone ought to remind them of the brake burnish procedure. I had to do that on track.

[ek1]

Like it should be, but fyi you now have no warranty.

BJG32 - Pls tell me where you are getting this from? I dont recall seeing anything specific about track driving (non-competitive and non-timed).

[ek1]

I have started a thread on my experience with setup, but gets light traffic:

http://driveviper.com/forums/threads/14176-Setup-notes-ACR-E?highlight=Kverges


I can say I've gone track to dealer and had warranty work done, FWIW. And I've had similar experience with Porsche and McLaren and Mazda and others, I just don't see DE usage being an automatic denial.

Mclaren officially covers non-competitive use of their cars on track, as long as you do a pre- and post- checks at the dealer and perform all scheduled maintenance at the dealer.

[gcrain]

What is 3rd gear problem over 5K RPM? I run 3rd to redline on track no problem - or at least none that I have noticed.

If a dealer is saying over speed limit, maybe someone ought to remind them of the brake burnish procedure. I had to do that on track.

It was just an example. There was a post a while back from somebody that was only having issues at high speed so the dealer refused to fix it based on the line that problems that are discovered at the track are not covered.

[Arizona Vipers]

I show up to my dealership with rubber sausages still clinging to the tire treads from the track. They can test FCA's resolve on warranty all they want, it's not going to change how I treat the car one bit. The Gen 5 is the best Viper track car to date, with the ACR even besting that! Top up the tire fund, and carry on. Amen!

[Nemesis]

My Vipers make my zipper tight (if you know what I'm saying) every time I get in them. Have I had issues, yup. Does that detour my love for them, NOPE.

[BJG32]

BJG32 - Pls tell me where you are getting this from? I dont recall seeing anything specific about track driving (non-competitive and non-timed).

19428

[dasvolk]

I've been gone for a while - what's wrong with the cars now??? Mine has been fine, but I haven't been driving it much...

I should point out that out of the ~11K miles I have about 5K are track miles.

[greygt3]

I'm with Keith on this the ACR is the cat's meow. I've tracked mine many times and never had a problem. I check the oil every time I drive it and the level has never moved. It's stupid fast and makes me look good. I couldn't be happier with the car.

[Snakebit10]

Other car companies are having difficulties with their top tier track models too. Porsche is arguably one of the best car brands.

Interesting read from a chap named LEVD:

http://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-gt3rs-and-911r/949985-talk-me-off-the-ledge-5.html

[ViperSmith]

19428

How many cars have been denied coverage when fracked? I've seen you post this like 10 times now but context is key.

Mark was pointing out the obvious, dodge can see where you were. It isn't indicative of some action to deny claims on any basis the car was tracked.

[Racingswh]

I like mine too.

We change it every event but I have never checked the oil even once. Car has 2600 miles and the oil has been changed 4 times. It will get changed again this week after this past track weekend.

I don't know what all the negativity is even about. Car seems to work just fine for what I use it for. Better than everything else I have ever had. There has never been even 1 issue with it.

[VENOM V]

Other car companies are having difficulties with their top tier track models too. Porsche is arguably one of the best car brands.

Interesting read from a chap named LEVD:

http://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-gt3rs-and-911r/949985-talk-me-off-the-ledge-5.html

Exactly. Two of the guys in a car club that I belong to have newer GT3s. Both of them broke at the track. Last time I tracked my friend's brother had a C7 Z06 that was having issues on the track. On the way home, I saw him broken down with a tow truck hooking him up. My friend's GT3 smokes like a ribeye on fire in a BBQ, to me there's no way that 2015 motor is going to last. It's scary how much it smokes. Same guy used to own a Ferrari 458, blew a sensor in the tranny at Buttonwillow Raceway. 3 tranny rebuilds and 6 months later, he was disgusted and sold the F-car. Tons of stories at the track from unhappy GTR owners too- blown trannies, you name it. My Mustang race car had a bone stock engine, except for longtube headers, cat delete, a CAI and a tune. Blew the engine. Turns out that the tuner now has a rep for bad tunes that causes engines to blow. Put yourself in the shoes of an auto manufacturer. Would you warranty an engine that runs leaner and has a less conservative tune due to an aftermarket tune? Sorry, but I wouldn't. That's a recipe for going out of business.

And anyone that thinks that you can tune a car and not be at risk of voiding the warranty loves to gamble. I don't care what brand.

Honestly I think there is a lot of naivete on this forum, or wishful thinking. This results in a lot of whining. Granted, there are cases that people have listed with legitimate gripes, so take it up with FCA. But man all this whining is getting OLD.

Vipersmith asks the right question. As many have said, we track our cars and have had them in for warranty work without issue. Never had a claim denied. This includes my 02 sensor that went out at Thunerhill Raceway, with speeds up to 140 mph in 107 F weather. FCA replaced the sensor, no issues at all. My cars are 100% stock, properly maintained, fluid levels always correct. I would not have expected them to pay for the 02 sensor if I had the car tuned.

I am VERY happy with my Viper's reliability, and nothing holds up better at the track.
I am VERY happy with the service I've received by my local dealer.

This ACR is the most satisfying vehicle I've ever owned by far. Simply a superstar at every track I show up to. Nothing can touch it.

[Malu59RT]

Exactly. Two of the guys in a car club that I belong to have newer GT3s. Both of them broke at the track. Last time I tracked my friend's brother had a C7 Z06 that was having issues on the track. On the way home, I saw him broken down with a tow truck hooking him up. My friend's GT3 smokes like a ribeye on fire in a BBQ, to me there's no way that 2015 motor is going to last. It's scary how much it smokes. Same guy used to own a Ferrari 458, blew a sensor in the tranny at Buttonwillow Raceway. 3 tranny rebuilds and 6 months later, he was disgusted and sold the F-car. Tons of stories at the track from unhappy GTR owners too- blown trannies, you name it. My Mustang race car had a bone stock engine, except for longtube headers, cat delete, a CAI and a tune. Blew the engine. Turns out that the tuner now has a rep for bad tunes that causes engines to blow. Put yourself in the shoes of an auto manufacturer. Would you warranty an engine that runs leaner and has a less conservative tune due to an aftermarket tune? Sorry, but I wouldn't. That's a recipe for going out of business.

And anyone that thinks that you can tune a car and not be at risk of voiding the warranty loves to gamble. I don't care what brand.

Honestly I think there is a lot of naivete on this forum, or wishful thinking. This results in a lot of whining. Granted, there are cases that people have listed with legitimate gripes, so take it up with FCA. But man all this whining is getting OLD.

Vipersmith asks the right question. As many have said, we track our cars and have had them in for warranty work without issue. Never had a claim denied. This includes my 02 sensor that went out at Thunerhill Raceway, with speeds up to 140 mph in 107 F weather. FCA replaced the sensor, no issues at all. My cars are 100% stock, properly maintained, fluid levels always correct. I would not have expected them to pay for the 02 sensor if I had the car tuned.

I am VERY happy with my Viper's reliability, and nothing holds up better at the track.
I am VERY happy with the service I've received by my local dealer.

This ACR is the most satisfying vehicle I've ever owned by far. Simply a superstar at every track I show up to. Nothing can touch it.

Todd, would you feel differently if your stock ACR blew the motor driving home from the track and warranty denied it based on the fact you track raced it? I'm not trying to be negative, just curious. People are not worried because the tune caused an issue, they are worried because something unrelated is being blamed for a known issue with the car.

When people talk about warranty denial, they generally don't mean for minor issues. The dealer has the ability to do a lot of work without much interaction with FCA. At a certain threshold or specific issue that the tech hasn't seen, SRT/FCA has to be involved and when they start poking around, then claims can be denied. For example, an O2 sensor isn't a big deal, but a motor would have to be approved before a replacement ordered. The dealer has the discretion to even cover a questionable item under good will, but most likely not an entire longblock.

[ViperJon]

This thread is a real revelation. People who have been lucky enough (and it is pure luck) not to have issues love the car.
Who'd a thunk it?

[ViperSmith]

Todd, would you feel differently if your stock ACR blew the motor driving home from the track and warranty denied it based on the fact you track raced it? I'm not trying to be negative, just curious. People are not worried because the tune caused an issue, they are worried because something unrelated is being blamed for a known issue with the car.

When people talk about warranty denial, they generally don't mean for minor issues. The dealer has the ability to do a lot of work without much interaction with FCA. At a certain threshold or specific issue that the tech hasn't seen, SRT/FCA has to be involved and when they start poking around, then claims can be denied. For example, an O2 sensor isn't a big deal, but a motor would have to be approved before a replacement ordered. The dealer has the discretion to even cover a questionable item under good will, but most likely not an entire longblock.

Has dodge not warrantied a car that has been tracked?

[Viper Girl]

Please stay on topic... this is not a thread for mechanical breakdowns or warranty issues.

Please start a new thread if you want to discuss other topics being brought up in this thread.

[VENOM V]

Todd, would you feel differently if your stock ACR blew the motor driving home from the track and warranty denied it based on the fact you track raced it? I'm not trying to be negative, just curious. People are not worried because the tune caused an issue, they are worried because something unrelated is being blamed for a known issue with the car.

When people talk about warranty denial, they generally don't mean for minor issues. The dealer has the ability to do a lot of work without much interaction with FCA. At a certain threshold or specific issue that the tech hasn't seen, SRT/FCA has to be involved and when they start poking around, then claims can be denied. For example, an O2 sensor isn't a big deal, but a motor would have to be approved before a replacement ordered. The dealer has the discretion to even cover a questionable item under good will, but most likely not an entire longblock.

Sorry mods, just need to answer this one because I think it's a good and fair question. Then I'll stop, I promise :)

If my stock ACR blew the motor driving home and warranty claim was denied, I would not feel treated fairly by FCA. However I have had first-hand experience that is quite the opposite. I was at Laguna Seca tracking, and a guy in a Gen V blew an engine. I know because I was first on the scene and diagnosed it. First thing I did was check the oil. It did not even register on the dipstick. Then I asked him if he checked the oil before tracking. He replied that he had NEVER checked his oil in the 6,900 miles of ownership. Ok, I asked him when the last time was that he changed the oil. He replied, never. This Viper had to have been four or five quarts low! He towed it to the dealer. FCA knew that he was at Laguna Seca when his motor blew. They knew that he had ignored a warning lamp, I believe it was low oil or low oil pressure. They have all of this data. And guess what? They replaced the engine at no charge, under warranty. That's going above and beyond the call on FCA's part. If you were FCA, would you have replaced that engine under warranty? I would not have. But they did.

I'm sure not every scenario goes that way, but that's what I've experienced first hand.

[kverges]

I started the thread with a little bit of rah-rah in me, in part because it was starting to get me down to see so much doom and gloom. If I'd had a catastrophic failure and no warranty coverage, I'd be upset, but then I see posts from people who had no problems swearing off the brand and wonder WTF? So my point was that my personal, anecdotal experience has been great in every way, and I wondered who else had the same.

I don't mind an objective debate about problems (e.g. I honestly don't think the car has enough front tire under it), including warranty coverage, especially if it is based on first hand experience. My non-scientific belief is that most of the cars, at least the 2016 ACR-E, are delivering as promised in the performance and reliability department. My further belief is that SRT will repair any problem with the car under warranty, even if used on track, absent abuse or modification.

I don't mind debating the latter point on this thread or anywhere for that matter, but in this thread my preference would be that anyone contesting my belief be the owner of the car involved and open their kimono about any possible abuse or modification, including mis shifts, not checking or changing oil, continuing to drive with excessive temperature or a warning indication, off track excursion, and so on.

For example, my car threw a light and mis-fire code while on track. I promptly exited track and kept rpms down and babied the car to the pit, and heard an ominous ticking sound near No 5 cylinder. I personally trailered my car to the dealer and they diagnosed and fixed a loose spark plug (doh - I probably should have looked for that!), went over the car in general, all at no charge and with not a whiff of recrimination over its obvious track use (I told them I was at MSR when code was thrown). Now maybe the tune would have changed if it was a bigger problem, I don't know. I tried to throw them a bit of a bone and asked them to make a camber and toe change, but they could not get the lowered car on their alignment rack.

I've also had the great honor and privilege to meet Erich Hueschele, who took the time to go over my car with me and recommend setup changes. He's a consummate driver, engineer and enthusiast and while warranty may be entirely outside his bailiwick, I refuse to believe that the man I met would say if my car broke on track that I am out of luck if I took good care of the car otherwise. In fact when I met him he was thrashing a TA in hot weather testing trying to break it as part of the plan to make sure the cars can be hammered on track (e.g. Bondurant school).

So my post was a bit of the "don't worry, be happy" variety, but I'm not a total goofball and happy to have reasoned discussion sprinkled about in the thread to go with the feel-good stories.

[Malu59RT]

Harold, I am assuming that based on Mark's post, track use has been an issue. The fact that the service manager at one of the largest Viper dealerships in the nation is telling you not to feel safe tracking your stock car, would give me concern. Mark sees and knows a lot more than what is posted on forums/FB, and may not be at liberty to discuss based on his responsibility to his client. If I am incorrect Mark, my apologies.

Todd/Keith, although this is a hypothetical parallel, imagine if over the next few weeks, we saw a thread pop up that said FCA denied a warranty claim based on data revealed from the car that the vehicle had been tracked. Then another thread saying the same. Mark comes online and says that they never had issues before, but all the normal warranty people are gone, and this is the new FCA. You would feel slighted, and you would also feel uneasy knowing that your car may give up the ghost on track. Would it be life ruining? Probably not, but a $25k bill is never easy to swallow.

All that said, I love my Viper. I have personally helped over 15 people get into Gen 4/5's based on my personal experiences with the Viper. Anyone that knows me, knows I beat the ever living crap out of my 2008, which is why I confidently told others that a Viper was a great car for them. I can't tell people that about Gen V's anymore, because I don't want them to risk a $25k bill for a motor that has a known issue, that FCA is not looking to cover.

[kverges]

Your sentiment seems well-intended, and one problem with forums is that we can't get definitive info from certain people who have professional and contractual responsibilities about disclosure. But in your case, it appears you have no problems with your car, right? If so, I don't understand why you are not only personally concerned, but telling others to shy away from buying the car based on what appears to be incomplete factual information and lots of speculation on this forum. If anecdotal bad experiences are the basis, then why aren't anecdotal good experiences equally valid? I and others in this thread have shared our good experiences and I'd just let others draw from this thread and others what they will.

I'd love word directly from FCA or SRT on exactly what problems might exist and exactly what use of the car is permitted under warranty. I doubt we will get that, in part because each claim will be decided on a case-by-case basis so there is no way to provide a satisfactory global answer.

Even your post is speculation and hypothetical and asks for the reader to imagine a bad sequence of events. As a counterpoint I am pretty confident that the owners manual and warranty booklet don't exclude track use. There is a "racing" exclusion but track driving is not racing; I have race cars that I race. Driving on track is the only way to safely explore the highly advertised performance envelope of this car and in fact the only place to lawfully conduct the CCM burnish procedure. My approach with any flak over a claim would be to politely ask for identification of the contract provision that would exclude coverage and the specific facts contended to fall within that exclusion. Other than modifications, which undeniably open the door to debate regardless of one's opinion of whether they can cause a problem, I've not heard any specifics that would answer this question one way or another regarding track use in and of itself. I have shared my personal experience of warranty work done after delivering my car, in a trailer, directly from track and so low the dealer could not even get it on their alignment rack.

Finally, unless you personally had a problem of which I am unaware, my personal beef with your post and others like it is a willingness to be negative without any personal bad experience as far as I know. In this thread anyway, I'd like to hear fact-based, personal experiences. I'm not saying bad ones should butt out, in fact I'd like to hear details and facts like answers to the query about why any warranty coverage was denied.

[Malu59RT]

Your sentiment seems well-intended, and one problem with forums is that we can't get definitive info from certain people who have professional and contractual responsibilities about disclosure. But in your case, it appears you have no problems with your car, right? If so, I don't understand why you are not only personally concerned, but telling others to shy away from buying the car based on what appears to be incomplete factual information and lots of speculation on this forum. If anecdotal bad experiences are the basis, then why aren't anecdotal good experiences equally valid? I and others in this thread have shared our good experiences and I'd just let others draw from this thread and others what they will.


I feel like I'm not supposed to reply, but I'm supposed to reply at the same time, haha. I will answer the questions you have asked me specifically, then I will bow out of this thread, unless asked again.

I'm personally concerned, because I can be the next person posting a thread about an engine failure, and having my warranty denied. I'm warning others because of a loss of confidence in the product, from what we are seeing posted by the two owners, as well as the service managers of the two largest Viper dealerships, and the reported number of engine failures. I personally know 3 friends that have had Gen V motors fail, one of which had to pay out of pocket to rebuild.

Regarding bad/good experiences, if I pay for something, I don't need to post online about how someone fulfilled their obligation (warrantying a part that broke). On the other hand, if someone finds a way to get out of an obligation because of an unrelated issue, that experience should be posted.

[swexlin]

I'm personally concerned, because I can be the next person posting a thread about an engine failure, and having my warranty denied. I'm warning others because of a loss of confidence in the product, from what we are seeing posted by the two owners, as well as the service managers of the two largest Viper dealerships, and the reported number of engine failures.

I know I feel this way as well. Others may not agree. It's like my family history with cancer - both parents, my uncle, and my grandfather. Doesn't mean I will certainly get it, but my chances are pretty good. As miles accumulate on these cars, if there is an inherent design problem, it means changes are better than slim that there will be problems.

That being said, when these cars are running right, they are glorious to drive!

[commandomatt]

.

Regarding bad/good experiences, if I pay for something, I don't need to post online about how someone fulfilled their obligation (warrantying a part that broke). On the other hand, if someone finds a way to get out of an obligation because of an unrelated issue, that experience should be posted.

Wow...DR. Doom. In your world, where only the negative aspects and experiences should be shared....it must always be raining !

I would think this would be a really bad place if positive feedback (regardless of it it was expected or not) would not be shared. Imagine all the businesses who would not exist if we didn't tell others how well we were treated or how everything was delivered as expected.

For every bad report or thread about the Gen V, there has to be dozens of good ones. I am not suggesting to not look closely at the bad ones but they should not overshadow the fact that the majority of owners (on this forum) have had a great experience with their car