Kuhmo's overheated - dealer recommends 4 tire replacement after 600 miles

[dkarg]

Hi all,

I'm curious if this has happened to anybody before. I brought in my '16 ACR that I'm still breaking in to have some warranty work done (evap system leak) and they just told me:

"All 4 tires have been over heated and the left rear tire is unable to be repaired".

The left rear lost 5 psi the only time I dropped the clutch on my driveway and left a 3 foot streak of rubber. I filled it up but it kept losing air since then.

My questions are:
- Are these tires so sensitive? What does "overheated" mean?
- I could see how the mini burnout could have damaged the rear tires (although I'd be extremely surprised), but how would it affect the front?

Thanks for any input,

Dominique

[VENOM V]

Lol, no way your tires are overheated, whatever that means. These Kumhos are good and grippy all the way to cord, as long as you have tread they are still good. The heat that you can put into them on the street is nothing like the abuse they see on the road course. In fact, the heat that is generated during very hard tracking can wear the fronts out faster, but they don't heat-cycle out like most other tires I've used.

As far as why it's leaking, I don't see how the burnout had anything to do with it. I suppose you could cause delamination if the tire was cold and was shocked by the high temp of a burnout, but seems unlikely. If you need a professional opinion on that tire, take it to Custom Alignment in Mountain View. They set up a lot of track cars and are the NorCal go-to for Vipers.

Which dealership?

[bluesrt]

do they still have tread?

[XSnake]

find another dealer

[mjorgensen]

Hi all,

I'm curious if this has happened to anybody before. I brought in my '16 ACR that I'm still breaking in to have some warranty work done (evap system leak) and they just told me:

"All 4 tires have been over heated and the left rear tire is unable to be repaired".

The left rear lost 5 psi the only time I dropped the clutch on my driveway and left a 3 foot streak of rubber. I filled it up but it kept losing air since then.

My questions are:
- Are these tires so sensitive? What does "overheated" mean?
- I could see how the mini burnout could have damaged the rear tires (although I'd be extremely surprised), but how would it affect the front?

Thanks for any input,

Dominique

Just have them rotated and call it good.

[Dman]

You admitted you did a burnout so your warranty is voided. lol

I can't imagine what they mean by overheated. You can damage these R compounds with cold temps that can sometimes cause cracks in the sidewalks and the tire is history, even if brand new. But overheated? You should check with a performance tire shop like suggested above. Do you have any tire issues you're experiencing or was this just offered up out of nowhere from the dealer?

[kverges]

The dealer network is an Achilles heel. They don't seem to know the old adage that pigs get fat and hogs get slaughtered. The tires are sensitive to hard trackwork, but as long as they have tread, they are good to go. A loss of tire pressure indicates a puncture of some kind, which might affect the carcass, but should be checked first. But "overheated," WTF?

[bluesrt]

Just have them rotated and call it good.

I actually have seen this in person where someone put the back on front and front on back one drivers side and was scratching his head at the race track complaining the car was really hard to steering and drove terrible. true story...lol he will never live it down

[fuggles]

As Venom said, no way you can overheat a front tire on the street. Possibly the rear with the burnout. Anyway, the rear isn't holding air so it is toast. You could probably get away with just replacing that one tire since you only have 600 miles on the others.

Or inspect, if no visible damage have it remounted and see if it holds air.

[dkarg]

They said the tires looked tracked. Hard. I barely finished breaking it in, it had 5 miles when it got to my place, the fastest I've driven it is 65mph +-15mph. CDJR in Fremont.
They're replacing one that "had a hole in it" and are ringing up kumho for replacement on the other 3.
I think I'll take it to mountain view out of curiosity. Thanks for all the responses.

[dkarg]

do they still have tread? they looked brand new top the eye to me, def no wires or wear. I'm going to post macro shots once I get them back.

- - - Updated - - -


As Venom said, no way you can overheat a front tire on the street. Possibly the rear with the burnout. Anyway, the rear isn't holding air so it is toast. You could probably get away with just replacing that one tire since you only have 600 miles on the others.

Or inspect, if no visible damage have it remounted and see if it holds air.

Exactly what I'm doing, thanks for the advice.

[Dfunk]

Post images of them. I want to see what over heated tires look like. :)

[dkarg]

No burnout, tire slip that left a bit of rubber in a burnout like fashion. I'd never do that, sensitive clutch, could happen to anyone ;-).

This happened at 5pm on a sunny day, tires would probably have been 70-100 F.

I was losing pressure on the left rear but no other tire problems.

[ACR PWR]

I actually have seen this in person where someone put the back on front and front on back one drivers side and was scratching his head at the race track complaining the car was really hard to steering and drove terrible. true story...lol he will never live it down


LOL.... really..

You don't need to own a car like this if they did that....haha

[Policy Limits]

Possible to replace air with nitrogen?

[FSTENUF]

I have just under 3000 miles on mine 1250 was the road trip home. Just about every other mile is either going to the track, running on the track or driving home from the track. I still have enough tread for at least one more track event or a long fall club cruise through the 2 lanes of Western Pa. I have had my tire temps jump 8 psi from cold to race temps and they show the heat cycle after every session. I will say this as soft as these tires are your 3 foot burn out may have put a small stone into the tread and that is why you are loosing air. Take the entire wheel and tire off the car and place it in a tank filled with water/dish soap. I bet you will find a trail of bubbles leading you to the main issue.

[ACR Steve]

Check valve stem . Spray soapy water on valve see if its leaking there . If not spray it all over ,where ever its bubbling is the leak. (If you have a pool just submerge the whole thing

[TrackAire]

Check valve stem . Spray soapy water on valve see if its leaking there . If not spray it all over ,where ever its bubbling is the leak. (If you have a pool just submerge the whole thing

I agree with ACR Steve.

Best leak detector is plain old Windex (the stuff you clean your windows with). Also, remove the valve cap and spray Windex into the valve stem, sometimes the valve core will not be tightened down all the way and it can slowly leak air out. The plus with Windex is that it evaporates to almost nothing leaving behind very little residue but foams up like shave cream with the smallest of leaks. Soapy water can be trickier due to the concentration of soap, how hard your water is, etc. You can also spray it along the bead of the tire where the wheel flange meets the rubber, any leaks will show up instantly. You can then rinse off the entire wheel and tire with water for final cleanup if you'd like.

Do not waste your time or money doing nitrogen....it has been proven that it will not stop leaks if you have a hole in the tire or a faulty valve stem. Plain old air is 78% nitrogen....22% more isn't going to do squat.

[GTS Dean]

They said the tires looked tracked. Hard. I barely finished breaking it in, it had 5 miles when it got to my place, the fastest I've driven it is 65mph +-15mph. CDJR in Fremont.


Those idjits don't even know that the tires were molded with only about 6/32" of tread groove depth brand new. I had the exact same response when I bolted my first set of BFG R-1s on my '93 RT back in 1994 and visited the dealership.

[Darius]

You should be taking it to Normandin in San Jose. Your dealer is jacking you. Find the hole in the tire and patch it. Or send it to me. I'll pay the shipping.

[ACRucrazy]

Those idjits don't even know that the tires were molded with only about 6/32" of tread groove depth brand new. I had the exact same response when I bolted my first set of BFG R-1s on my '93 RT back in 1994 and visited the dealership.

Lol

[bluesrt]

You should be taking it to Normandin in San Jose. Your dealer is jacking you. Find the hole in the tire and patch it. Or send it to me. I'll pay the shipping.

exactly-----------

[Bill Pemberton]

Only thing I would disagree with is if the leak is in the tire due to a foreign object ( nail , screw, metal, glass ) , pitch it do not patch it. Otherwise pretty obvious you are being led down the garden path by the Dealer.

[bluesrt]

unless you are running road America like a mad man, I would run all day long on a patch with a screw in it,been around tires too long, but some shops and most wont patch them due to liability, too much factor and not worth the lawyer yankee doodle fees.lol .... no disrespect there bill

[Bill Pemberton]

Sorry , absolutely foolish!! Racing for 35 years and do not know any reputable track tire service that will patch a high speed tire. It is not just Road America that has high speed corners , as we have two at a nearby track that are between 90-100 mph and a blowout at that speed is somewhat exciting. Lawyer fees aside , the real issue is safety and g forces new cars produce. All it takes is one viewing of a Nascar race and seeing the effects of a blown tire to realize one doesn't fix the fastest production car's tires with a patch!

[bluesrt]

as darius said, ill take it!! a small hole as the subject states is fine in my book, im not worried about it blowing, unless its by the sidewall

[Bill Pemberton]

Ask all of us that have had a track blow out or fast leak, and chat with any reputable race tire supplier or track service unit ---- fixing a DOT competition tire on a car that will hit the g's of an ACR is in my estimation similar to driving on the track without a helmet.

Going around an 65 mph turn and having the tire deflate quickly in a group of cars is possibly even more heartstopping than a blowout down a straight at 100 mph. This is a safetly issue not a legal issue.

[bluesrt]

a proper vulcanized tire will not let go, but I see where your at with this, im fine with it cause im the one repair patching my own tire,so I know its done right, iv patched them before on my acrx and never had a problem, done road America and Atlanta big boy tracks in advanced sessions. but they had pin holes in the middle of tread. but its all good everyone has a different view here wich is fine

[Bill Pemberton]

We beg to differ and just seen too many issues with tires over the years ,and I know not one of the 4 Tire Companies that sponsored me ever recommended patching for a track tire. Safety first, saving money on a tire or your life, each person can make that decision .

[MikeAdams]

Post pictures sidewall and inside of tires . Want to see inside of tire. Do not repair tire if you are going to use on track. Not worth the risk.

[dkarg]

Got my car back today.

Here are some tire pictures of the old and new ones.

Not taking into account the lack of skill of the dealer (it took them 8 days to change a tire, they ordered a front one), here is where I'm at.

- Got a new left rear that had a nail in it. Forgot to take it with me, need to go back.
- 3 "old ones"
- While taking pictures noticed the horrible "injuries" the repaved surface (repaved a week ago) is inflicting my tires.

Now I'm wondering:
- Tire's fault? (Kumho won't send an engineer, doesn't see anything wrong in the pictures. I'll cut them up the old one and send them a sample if it makes anything).
- Asphalt's fault? (I stuck a food thermometer and it's at 90F with 75F air temp, but I drive over it a 5-10mph for less than 1/2 mile).
- My fault?

Any advice appreciated. I'm with Bill tho, I won't track a repaired tire and want to get to the bottom of this.

1953319534195351953619537

[dkarg]

Here is two more pictures for completeness sake, of my Jeep running a weird no name brand "Fortera", and a Tesla with Michelin Pilot Sport.

The asphalt chips barely touch the Forteras and slightly blemish the Michelin's surface.1953819539

[TrackAire]

Now I'm kinda of confused.....maybe I'm not seeing it but I don't see a tire that was overheated. Are they worried about the little stone chips stuck to the tread?....do they think that means the tire is overheated? I don't think that is anything out of the norm for super sticky tires.

[dkarg]

Now I'm kinda of confused.....maybe I'm not seeing it but I don't see a tire that was overheated. Are they worried about the little stone chips stuck to the tread?....do they think that means the tire is overheated? I don't think that is anything out of the norm for super sticky tires.

To be honest I don't think their service department has worked on many vipers. As said, it took them 8 days to change 1 tire and in the process they ordered a front tire and had to take the tire somewhere else since they couldn't fit it on the rim in-house.

[dkarg]

You should be taking it to Normandin in San Jose. Your dealer is jacking you. Find the hole in the tire and patch it. Or send it to me. I'll pay the shipping.

I'll end up doing that. Their sales team has pissed me off so badly several times in the past that I wanted to avoid them, but I guess I'm stuck :-/

[bluesrt]

Your dealing with morons

[LmeaViper]

I actually have seen this in person where someone put the back on front and front on back one drivers side and was scratching his head at the race track complaining the car was really hard to steering and drove terrible. true story...lol he will never live it down


OMG can you imagine the shit and abuse a guy would take for years from something like this...LOL

[ACR Extreme]

Sorry , absolutely foolish!! Racing for 35 years and do not know any reputable track tire service that will patch a high speed tire. It is not just Road America that has high speed corners , as we have two at a nearby track that are between 90-100 mph and a blowout at that speed is somewhat exciting. Lawyer fees aside , the real issue is safety and g forces new cars produce. All it takes is one viewing of a Nascar race and seeing the effects of a blown tire to realize one doesn't fix the fastest production car's tires with a patch!

True.

It's interesting reading all these posts regarding the ACR - E with race tires simply respect the car buy new tires it's the least expensive repair.

Free Advice - it's worth exactly that - find a professional and listen.

First time at Road America - debated to run one last short session on the tires.

Made it thru loaded up the car strapped it down and the tire popped which could have happened just minutes before and put me in a wall upside down who knows.

Affording the ACR is one thing maintaining is another if you don't it's going to end poorly. It's not only the driver it's also out of respect for passengers other drivers especially on a race track!

[GTS Dean]

Here is two more pictures for completeness sake, of my Jeep running a weird no name brand "Fortera", and a Tesla with Michelin Pilot Sport.

The asphalt chips barely touch the Forteras and slightly blemish the Michelin's surface.1953819539
You are comparing apples and tomatoes. Both are red, round and you can eat them - but they aren't the same by a long shot. Your Jeep and Tesla tires were probably designed to last 40-80k miles with treadwear ratings in the 3-400s. The ACR runs on race tires with the minimum legal tread depth molded in and DRY GRIP as the primary design parameter. They have what - a 60 treadwear rating? They are going to pick up EVERYTHING loose on the pavement and sling it around your wheel wells. Some of it will embed itself in the soft rubber and work its way through the carcass and let the air out. If that bothers you, buy an extra set of standard Viper tires for everyday use. Bag your Kumhos and use them for the track.

[bluesrt]

Basicly you got hosed. Those tires were fine and dandy.

[dkarg]

Basicly you got hosed. Those tires were fine and dandy.

Agree. I'd give them hell if I had followed their advice and changed all 4. But after getting a screw into 1 I am on the "replace that thing". Camp. I gained an overpriced Kumho and Fremont CDJR lost a customer.

Furthermore will get some street rubber and another set of rims to match, saving the kumhos for track - otherwise my street is going to eat them up.

Thanks for the advice.