Oil Cooler Line Replacement - Gen IV

[Steve M]

Posted this on VCA a while ago...hopefully it will help somebody here too.

A while back I noticed my stock oil cooler lines leaking a bit - there was a single drop of oil on the floor, so I decided I'd better take care of the problem before it turned into a bigger one. It seems that these lines are prone to leaking either at the crimp or the quick disconnect; mine was leaking at the crimp on the lower line at the block.

Rather than replace them with the stock lines, I decided to go with the Viper Specialty pre-made lines seen here:

http://viperspecialtyperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=22_34&products_id=196

It didn't look like it would be a hard install - that was a poor assessment on my part. I decided to install the lines in conjunction with my oil change...6 hours later, I finally got it done. My hands hurt like hell too.

A couple tips to make this install easier:

1. Don't do it on your back like I did...big mistake.
2. The portion of the quick disconnects that screw into the block and oil cooler were incredibly hard to loosen...I'm pretty sure God Himself did the original tightening. These fittings are also rather large - about 1.25", which meant that I didn't have a wrench or a socket that would fit them. 10" and 12" adjustable wrenches came in very handy, especially for the upper fitting on the block.
3. Unscrew the two 10mm bolts that hold the A/C condenser line to the oil pan...you can bend it out of your way, and it makes things much easier.
4. It should be obvious, but do the longer line first, and expect it to take 2-3 times longer to get this one in place than the shorter line.
5. You might as well do this install in conjunction with an oil change - you'll be removing the oil filter to be able to access the lines.

As it turned out, both stock oil cooler lines were leaking - the lower one at the crimp near the block, and the upper one was leaking at the quick disconnect also near the block. Oh, and I now realize why these were quick disconnect fittings...this would have been much easier if I had just replaced the lines with OEM ones. Hopefully this will be the last time I have to deal with these stupid things for a LONG time.

I will say...the Viper Specialty lines are very nice, and look pretty too.

[Steve M]

And Dan Lesser's pointers in response:




Yes, your experience is fairly typical without either having the pan off, or having access to the exact tools needed. It can be done other ways, but as they say, the right tool for the job!

A few more pointers:

1. It is 1000x easier to do this install with the pan off.

2. The best options for tools are a 1.25" socket for removal, and a 1.25" stubby open ended wrench for install.

3. Install the long line first, and install the ENGINE sides first.

4. 45* fittings are engine side, 90* is oil cooler.

5. Two people makes the install easier, the second person just holding the line up in place and keeping tension off while starting threads.

6. Of course, clean up the fitting area both before and after fitting removal, you don't want dirt making its way into the lines or ports during install.

7. Pop the clips out of the QD fittings after pulling the plastic back and remove the lines, then use a socket to remove the adapters.

8. Replacing OEM lines with OEM lines will NOT solve the seeping issue. It is a design flaw, not defective parts. Nearly all of them have the problem sooner or later to some extent.

9. Wrap the fittings and/or wrench with masking tape or electrical tape to prevent scratching them during install.

To which I added:

1. Yes, dropping the pan would have made it much easier...it was always in the way. Having never dropped a Viper oil pan (to include never seeing it done), I was hesitant to even try.

2. A 1.25" socket (it also looked like a 32mm metric would fit, but I'm not even sure if those exist) would have made removing the factory adapters MUCH easier, especially that upper one on the block.

5. A second set of hands would have been mucho helpful - I spent a solid hour working on getting that first line in place on the block side, mostly because I could only get one hand up there to both hold the line and tighten the fitting.

9. I had good luck keeping the fittings looking nice by using a set of anodized aluminum AN wrenches I had from working with stainless braided lines in the past - they were good for installing your lines, but didn't have enough leverage (by design) to loosen the OEM adapter fittings.

[FLATOUT]

Did this on my Gen 3 and will do it on my Gen 4 when the stockers start leaking. I sourced my own AN fittings and made my own hoses.

Good mod to fix a factory issue.

[J TNT]

Thanks for sharing ! This winters project :)

[slitherv10]

Posted this on VCA a while ago...hopefully it will help somebody here too.

A while back I noticed my stock oil cooler lines leaking a bit - there was a single drop of oil on the floor, so I decided I'd better take care of the problem before it turned into a bigger one. It seems that these lines are prone to leaking either at the crimp or the quick disconnect; mine was leaking at the crimp on the lower line at the block.

Rather than replace them with the stock lines, I decided to go with the Viper Specialty pre-made lines seen here:

http://viperspecialtyperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=22_34&products_id=196

It didn't look like it would be a hard install - that was a poor assessment on my part. I decided to install the lines in conjunction with my oil change...6 hours later, I finally got it done. My hands hurt like hell too.

A couple tips to make this install easier:

1. Don't do it on your back like I did...big mistake.
2. The portion of the quick disconnects that screw into the block and oil cooler were incredibly hard to loosen...I'm pretty sure God Himself did the original tightening. These fittings are also rather large - about 1.25", which meant that I didn't have a wrench or a socket that would fit them. 10" and 12" adjustable wrenches came in very handy, especially for the upper fitting on the block.
3. Unscrew the two 10mm bolts that hold the A/C condenser line to the oil pan...you can bend it out of your way, and it makes things much easier.
4. It should be obvious, but do the longer line first, and expect it to take 2-3 times longer to get this one in place than the shorter line.
5. You might as well do this install in conjunction with an oil change - you'll be removing the oil filter to be able to access the lines.

As it turned out, both stock oil cooler lines were leaking - the lower one at the crimp near the block, and the upper one was leaking at the quick disconnect also near the block. Oh, and I now realize why these were quick disconnect fittings...this would have been much easier if I had just replaced the lines with OEM ones. Hopefully this will be the last time I have to deal with these stupid things for a LONG time.

I will say...the Viper Specialty lines are very nice, and look pretty too.


It's informative write-ups like this and people like you that makes these sites a good place to be.

Thanks

[Joel]

Yes, it is easier with the pan off. I put a swinging pickup on my '03 and wish I had done the switch then. The Viper Specialty lines are great and fairly easy to install particularly if you have an extra set of hands and have an old wrench you can modify if need be - ie. cut. Taking the oil pan off is no big deal but it would be close on your back unless you can get the car pretty high up. I got an extra gasket but could have re-used mine - they are a bit pricey because they are designed to be re-used. If you tackle this project, I would really urge taking the pan off. It gives you time to look around in there and to check things out and it is easy to install a swinging pickup then too.

[Viper Specialty]

Thanks guys!

To add on here,
-Yes, this is FAR easier with the pan off. Easy removal really.
-A sacrificial wrench comes in very handy
-Aluminum wrenches prevent scratches, but in a pinch a wrap of masking tape will help- change it often or it will break through.
-The adapters are tight, and best to use a 1-1/4" socket with a breaker bar.
-New fittings are a 1-1/16" hex size.
-Install longer line first, and always start on the engine side.

[ACRucrazy]

I am just waiting for the day I have to do this to mine.

[SNKEBIT]

I am just waiting for the day I have to do this to mine.

Should have been yesterday.................... I see it marked it's spot.

[Alex Mills]

Crazy that it's such a common issue. Mine started leaking as well but I had them replaced by the dealer under the extended factory warranty that the previous owner paid for.

[Late Apex]

Steve M I saw your other post about this on the VCA and it really got me thinking about replacing mine on my 09. So I spoke with my Viper tech about the stainless ones and he said they are nice but he has seen very few OEM Gen 4 lines that leak. He inspected mine and all good for now. Good post BTW

[Steve M]

Steve M I saw your other post about this on the VCA and it really got me thinking about replacing mine on my 09. So I spoke with my Viper tech about the stainless ones and he said they are nice but he has seen very few OEM Gen 4 lines that leak. He inspected mine and all good for now. Good post BTW

As long as yours are still good, might as well keep going with them...the only reason I replaced mine was because I noticed a drop of oil on the floor. It doesn't look like they fail catastrophically...at least mine didn't.

[Detroit Muscle]

I had the same issue two weeks after I got my 05, notice a very small drop of oil on the garage floor. Took it to the local Dodge dealer, and made sure they had a Viper Tech., and it was one of the oil cooler lines. I decided to have the dealer replace both lines, thinking if one stated leaking, the other will soon. $500, later problem was solved. I have worked on / build several of my muscle cars, but after just looking under that Viper. It was something that I didn't even want to try. Or maybe I'm just getting lazy.

[intense]

$500, later problem was solved.

But if you replaced the factor lines with factory lines you'll almost certainly be doing the job again. It isn't to bad a job to do by yourself. Sounds like you can handle it. It really only takes a few hours.

[swexlin]

And Dan Lesser's pointers in response:



To which I added:

1. Yes, dropping the pan would have made it much easier...it was always in the way. Having never dropped a Viper oil pan (to include never seeing it done), I was hesitant to even try.

2. A 1.25" socket (it also looked like a 32mm metric would fit, but I'm not even sure if those exist) would have made removing the factory adapters MUCH easier, especially that upper one on the block.

5. A second set of hands would have been mucho helpful - I spent a solid hour working on getting that first line in place on the block side, mostly because I could only get one hand up there to both hold the line and tighten the fitting.

9. I had good luck keeping the fittings looking nice by using a set of anodized aluminum AN wrenches I had from working with stainless braided lines in the past - they were good for installing your lines, but didn't have enough leverage (by design) to loosen the OEM adapter fittings.

Steve and I dropped my oil pan yesterday to replace the gasket. Not a bad job, about a zillion bolts holding it in. Biggest challenge is holding it tight over your head while your buddy starts some of the bolts back in. My oil cooler lines on my 03 were replaced a couple years ago with OEM, and you bet I keep my eye on them.

[Detroit Muscle]

I'm hoping to have a Gen IV before I have to deal with that issue again:D

[FrgMstr]

Just found my lower leaking while post-teching from CoTA and pre-teching the car for Texas Mile next month. If I get the Viper Specialty hoses, what wrench do I need for install on these? 1.25" open end like mentioned above? (Was not sure if it was specific to Viper Specialty hoses are not.) Thanks.

[pony23]

Great info. I better check my lines while my car is in the air for the winter. Perfect time to do this.

[Steve M]

Just found my lower leaking while post-teching from CoTA and pre-teching the car for Texas Mile next month. If I get the Viper Specialty hoses, what wrench do I need for install on these? 1.25" open end like mentioned above? (Was not sure if it was specific to Viper Specialty hoses are not.) Thanks.

It was 1.25" for both removing the factory ones and installing the Viper Specialty ones.

If you end up going with an aftermarket assembly from someone else, make sure the fittings they use are up to snuff. The Viper Specialty lines aren't cheap, but it's because he is using the best fittings available, which IIRC were around $60 per fitting when I looked into sourcing them myself. Whatever you do, don't use an aftermarket solution that relies on an o-ring boss to AN adapter fitting to make it work at the block and oil cooler connections.

[FrgMstr]

It was 1.25" for both removing the factory ones and installing the Viper Specialty ones.

If you end up going with an aftermarket assembly from someone else, make sure the fittings they use are up to snuff. The Viper Specialty lines aren't cheap, but it's because he is using the best fittings available, which IIRC were around $60 per fitting when I looked into sourcing them myself. Whatever you do, don't use an aftermarket solution that relies on an o-ring boss to AN adapter fitting to make it work at the block and oil cooler connections.

Thanks!

I sold industrial hose and tubing for over ten years. The Viper Specialty ones are Aeroquip brand hose, and it is top notch stuff, but I pinged VS to find out the spec on the hose. You need the right inner tube for the right application. Also, I would like to know who if the manufacturer on the fittings. Yeah, I could go have some made today, but quite frankly buying a purpose built product for a specific (and time tested) application and size is usually the way to go. :) JTS has some, but their fitting configuration is a bit "odd."

[Steve M]

Given that they are going into an aluminum block and oil cooler, I'll stick with the aluminum fittings. At the end of the day, the most important thing is that both sides of the fitting are swivel ends so they can compensate for the block movement relative to the frame.

[FrgMstr]

Those are great looking assemblies, aside from the color on the fittings. Contrary to popular belief, you get more reliable fitting attachments with those types of compression fittings rather than crimped on fittings. Many thanks for the specifics.

Dan confirmed tube composition as well and these are made of what is needed on the inside in this application.

[Steve M]

Those are great looking assemblies, aside from the color on the fittings. Contrary to popular belief, you get more reliable fitting attachments with those types of compression fittings rather than crimped on fittings. Many thanks for the specifics.

Dan confirmed tube composition as well and these are made of what is needed on the inside in this application.

Aside from the color? Everyone knows red is the fastest color, especially for fittings carrying oil to and from the cooler.

[JTS VENOM PERFORMANCE]

Thanks!

I sold industrial hose and tubing for over ten years. The Viper Specialty ones are Aeroquip brand hose, and it is top notch stuff, but I pinged VS to find out the spec on the hose. You need the right inner tube for the right application. Also, I would like to know who if the manufacturer on the fittings. Yeah, I could go have some made today, but quite frankly buying a purpose built product for a specific (and time tested) application and size is usually the way to go. :) JTS has some, but their fitting configuration is a bit "odd."
I honestly have been relying on "others" for feedback and fitting style on the gen IV units, and even the gen III units, we now have a customer with a gen III that is local, also a gen V that is local, both great friends, and we got fed up and went and purchased a Gen IV ACR for us to use to produce items, so all lines wil now be test fitted by us instead of us relying on others, all of ours use braided line, and we have our own crimper so our oil and ps lines both are crimped, not using the AN fitting, we found using the normal AN fittings that overtime they tend to seep, nothing against others products its just we prefer the crimp method, we are continually taking suggestions and making changes to make sure everything is top notch, for instance one of the ps fittings on the GEn III's has eluded us for years, because of size, so we are starting to actually produce the fitting ourself, since its not a produced part. thanks guys.

[J TNT]

I used Gen 4 lines on my Gen 3 , the Gen 4 Lines are slightly longer and work fine . fwiw.

[JTS VENOM PERFORMANCE]

I've noticed they are very similar, I think we can adjust ours, even adjust the price some, and have them fit both models, we will be working on it,

[jvm728]

As a newbie gen iv owner, Is this something I need to put some attention to asap?

[J TNT]

If you see oil sweating /leaking from the front right side of the engine , then it's most likely the oil lines . If there is no leak then it's a non-issue .

[01sapphirebob]

As a newbie gen iv owner, Is this something I need to put some attention to asap?

Probably something to watch for. I think these are kinda like the GEN I head gaskets. Its not a matter of if but when. I've had a mystery leak with my GEN IV. It ponly happens in the winter months but due to the location I'm strating to think it could be the oil cooler lines.

[FrgMstr]

As a newbie gen iv owner, Is this something I need to put some attention to asap?

I specifically check mine every time I am under the car. After CoTA, where the car got ran pretty hard and saw some temps that it does not all the time, my lower was leaking badly enough that it was dripping down onto the lower radiator coolant line. So, if it is not leaking, great, but if you see it seeping, or dripping, certainly it is time to change those out before you have a bigger failure on your hands.

So when you change the oil, or have it changed, have the tech give those a look while he is under there.

FWIW, mine are under warranty, and I would rather pay for a solution that I had more long term confidence in. That said as well, getting some garage time with a project is not exactly on something I hate to do. ;)

[Steve M]

As a newbie gen iv owner, Is this something I need to put some attention to asap?

Just keep it in the back of your head...mine started leaking within my first year of ownership (I bought mine when it was about 3 years old with 9,500 miles on it). The first sign was a drop of oil on my garage floor.

[FrgMstr]

I honestly have been relying on "others" for feedback and fitting style on the gen IV units, and even the gen III units, we now have a customer with a gen III that is local, also a gen V that is local, both great friends, and we got fed up and went and purchased a Gen IV ACR for us to use to produce items, so all lines wil now be test fitted by us instead of us relying on others, all of ours use braided line, and we have our own crimper so our oil and ps lines both are crimped, not using the AN fitting, we found using the normal AN fittings that overtime they tend to seep, nothing against others products its just we prefer the crimp method, we are continually taking suggestions and making changes to make sure everything is top notch, for instance one of the ps fittings on the GEn III's has eluded us for years, because of size, so we are starting to actually produce the fitting ourself, since its not a produced part. thanks guys.

The biggest variable in building a good crimped hydraulic hose is the fabricator. There is an art form to building solid hydraulic hoses. The next is the equipment and materials used. Aeroquip is hands down the best in the business with Gates and Goodyear coming up from behind. (I have sold all of those as well as Alphagomma.) Aeroquip's AQP line of products is hard to touch in terms of quality and in terms of price as well. :) But you get what you pay for. Viper Specialty confirmed product specs and that was good enough for me.

I liked the way VS is doing its end with 45 degree elbows and I also like less adapters coming into play than on your assemblies.

I am not beating your company or product down, just giving you my honest opinion of why I spent ~$50 more on the VS' product.

[saxon_schmauderer]

I cant seem to find decent -10 stainless braid rubber hose. Any suggestions?

[Viper Girl]

The beginning of this thread is very helpful to other owners who will need to repair their oil lines. Actually it should have been moved to the How-To section months ago when this started to preserve this info for others.
It is really unfortunate the direction this thread has taken, its time to get this thread back on track...

[JTS VENOM PERFORMANCE]

There are a couple companies that make quality lines, and we work with most of them , we try to work together as a group to help everyone, or that's my way of thinking. but yessir all of our products are quality, we have been crimping for quit a few years now, our oil lines come with a lifetime warranty to the original purchaser, and yessir we are since we have our own in house gen IV, looking at doing our own design, instead of having to rely on answers from others.
either way, Dan, Sean , myself will usualy work to help everyone as much as we can sir, keep rockin!

[01sapphirebob]

So when these (OEM) lines start to go where are people typically seeing oil leak from? Ive got a leak somewhere but cant seem to track it down. Only two things that we have come up with is coolant and possibly oil cooler lines. The drips are on the pass side of the car.

[J TNT]

If you get under the car and look at the Right Front of the engine were the lines go to , it will be obvious ,LOWER OIL line may also be wet with oil . Coolant will be orange in colour . OEM Fittings are 1 1/4 " .

[01sapphirebob]

A couple pics of the leak...

http://i1313.photobucket.com/albums/t558/weilandfrk/3A97B187-A1E7-4E51-903F-A379F9937F70_zpsj3urb31s.jpg (http://s1313.photobucket.com/user/weilandfrk/media/3A97B187-A1E7-4E51-903F-A379F9937F70_zpsj3urb31s.jpg.html)

http://i1313.photobucket.com/albums/t558/weilandfrk/008CB1F5-60E9-4462-B159-0E2CB00978A3_zpsfopjggac.jpg (http://s1313.photobucket.com/user/weilandfrk/media/008CB1F5-60E9-4462-B159-0E2CB00978A3_zpsfopjggac.jpg.html)

[01sapphirebob]

anti freeze from the looks of it

Get it on a hoist, you will find a drip point on one of the hoses fairly quickly im sure

Its up on my 4 post right now BUT got another car parked underneath it.

[01sapphirebob]

Perfect, should be an easy find when the time comes to get under it.

Thanks!

[Steve M]

As already stated, when an oil cooler line is leaking, it is blatantly obvious when looking at the line.

In your case Bob, I'd start looking around the coolant reservoir. I've heard of those cracking during header installs when people push them out of the way to wiggle the header in on the passenger side...clearance is already tight over there due to the engine being offset to that side. Just food for thought...otherwise, it'll likely be one of the lines where it is clamped on. Rarely do lines leak in the middle.

[proedge]

I'm confused why the lines from Viper Specialty are $326 for the ones with the ugly red fittings and $400 for ones with black fittings. The lines from JTS are $289 with black fittings. Are they made from differnent hose/ have different fittings?

[Steve M]

I'm confused why the lines from Viper Specialty are $326 for the ones with the ugly red fittings and $400 for ones with black fittings. The lines from JTS are $289 with black fittings. Are they made from differnent hose/ have different fittings?

My guess (and this is purely a guess) - he's probably taking the red fittings, having them stripped and re-anodized to black.

Personally, I liked the red fittings...probably because it is similar to venom red under certain lighting conditions. They certainly don't look bad to me once installed.

[Viper Specialty]

I'm confused why the lines from Viper Specialty are $326 for the ones with the ugly red fittings and $400 for ones with black fittings. The lines from JTS are $289 with black fittings. Are they made from different hose/ have different fittings?

The black fittings are made by a completely different manufacturer, and shipped clear across the country. They cost considerably more, as well as shipping costs. The JTS hoses are fundamentally different than either VSP option, and cannot be directly compared.

The red fittings are actually by far the most popular, probably 25:1. The red looks great on just about any of the colors, as the engine is red, along with the calipers and some of the interiors. Black is best for Color Matched engines.

[Steve M]

...and there you have it. I had never seen them in black, hence my guess.

[01sapphirebob]

As already stated, when an oil cooler line is leaking, it is blatantly obvious when looking at the line.

In your case Bob, I'd start looking around the coolant reservoir. I've heard of those cracking during header installs when people push them out of the way to wiggle the header in on the passenger side...clearance is already tight over there due to the engine being offset to that side. Just food for thought...otherwise, it'll likely be one of the lines where it is clamped on. Rarely do lines leak in the middle.

Thanks Steve. Its gotta be coolant. Just weird that it is only leaking in cold temps. I'll have to track it down this spring.

[Cowger]

I'll just add that I went with the "DIY" solution, purchasing AN fittings and hose online. After barely being able to make these brand new fittings not leak (having to tighten them far more than I would have expected), I have very little confidence that I could remove them and find them to be in a re-useable state. From what I now understand, all these AN fittings are not the same.

I would be a happier knowing that I have a set in there made by someone who knows what they are doing (e.g. Dan), (e.g. NOT Dodge! : )

Bryan

[Steve M]

I'll just add that I went with the "DIY" solution, purchasing AN fittings and hose online. After barely being able to make these brand new fittings not leak (having to tighten them far more than I would have expected), I have very little confidence that I could remove them and find them to be in a re-useable state. From what I now understand, all these AN fittings are not the same.

I would be a happier knowing that I have a set in there made by someone who knows what they are doing (e.g. Dan), (e.g. NOT Dodge! : )

Bryan

Yes, AN fittings are not created equal. I too thought about fabbing up a set myself since I had made plenty of both rubber and Teflon core hoses in the past, but decided to go through Dan to save myself the trouble of getting the fit just right. Plus, I know Dan only uses quality parts, and that to me was worth it.

The fittings themselves need to swivel on both sides of the joint...anything less, and you'll likely end up with problems. That alone ups the price of the fittings. My time is worth more today than it used to be, so I don't mind paying someone to save me a potential headache.

[FrgMstr]

Viper Specialty Oil Cooler Hoses installed.


http://kylebennett.com/files/hfpics/ViperOilCoolerHoses01.jpg

http://kylebennett.com/files/hfpics/ViperOilCoolerHoses02.jpg

http://kylebennett.com/files/hfpics/ViperOilCoolerHoses03.jpg

http://kylebennett.com/files/hfpics/ViperOilCoolerHoses04.jpg

[Steve M]

I should have dropped that stupid oil pan when I did my install...could have save so much grief. There was a world shortage of cuss words that day, because they were all coming out of my mouth.

[Viper Specialty]

Just a note above, on Gen-4's, the best fit for the longer hose is usually over the relay box, under the short line, then dip under the frame bar and up to the port. Not that you will have any problems, just make sure its not being awkwardly forced into anything.

[FrgMstr]

Just a note above, on Gen-4's, the best fit for the longer hose is usually over the relay box, under the short line, then dip under the frame bar and up to the port. Not that you will have any problems, just make sure its not being awkwardly forced into anything.

Actually, I tried it that way and it had a bad bind to it against the relay box. Actually broke one of the relay mounts off trying to get it mounted there. That is why you see the second relay connected the way you do now.

[Viper Specialty]

Actually, I tried it that way and it had a bad bind to it against the relay box. Actually broke one of the relay mounts off trying to get it mounted there. That is why you see the second relay connected the way you do now.

Wow, that's an odd one. Perhaps there is a difference in interpretation, as we have installed/sold many, but haven't run into that tight of a bind in the other orientation. Perhaps someone with a Gen-4 set will see this and chime in with a photo.

This is Gen-3 and a Hybrid Gen-3 [Hybrid: Gen-4 w/o Relay Box running Gen-3 hose lengths FYI]

https://scontent-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/1656339_10101596061975958_786581200_n.jpg?oh=22d43 83331a6ca5f707abbf2f9ab0aa0&oe=554D5400
https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/422612_10100462269440288_506427552_n.jpg?oh=0c2317 298f6219d1b501b9dd3740ba6a&oe=55896AB2&__gda__=1431053620_07b3f6995b3cada0bf82bff98c6c96b f

[FrgMstr]

No offense, but considering the relay box is missing in that picture, it is worthless for giving advice on Gen IV fitment IMO.

[Viper Specialty]

No offense, but considering the relay box is missing in that picture, it is worthless for giving advice on Gen IV fitment IMO.

I would agree, which is why I said I hope someone may chime in that has a set on a Gen-4. I cannot find any photos in my build records where enough is assembled it use the picture... and its driving me nuts. I know exactly which car had photos of them, but they are missing!

However, the routing is still very similar, relay box or not. The main point was to illustrate the opposite orientation. The Gen-4's were sized on an actual Gen-4, and have been installed here many times.

[Steve M]

Stand by...

[FrgMstr]

Here is a link to some full resolution pictures, one of the original OE lines installed.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/p44fopey9025ojn/AAC2R2XlhIuTPUJovZ6qomc5a?dl=0

For reference, that box is 6" long, 2.5" tall, and extends 3" away from the side (1" of that is the connector terminal).

The issue is that the hose is too long to fit with that box there compounded by the fact that the 45 degree elbow at the block really needs to be a 90 degree as well to ever accommodate getting by that box. The hose's bend radius would not come into play with a 90 degree fitting. Had that relay box not been there, it would have fitted and routed perfect.

[Redx]

Looks great FrgMstr, did you replace or re-use your oil pan gasket upon installing the oil pan? What was the torque on the bolts?

[FrgMstr]

Looks great FrgMstr, did you replace or re-use your oil pan gasket upon installing the oil pan? What was the torque on the bolts?

I reused the gasket as it was in good shape. I did clean all surfaces well, and used RTV at the T Joint on the corners of the mating surface as specified in the manual. Torque was 23n-ms / 200 INCH pounds on fasterners 1 - 16. The four at the back by the flywheel are 95 INCH pounds.

Edit: That said, I have the exhaust pulled off right now too as I am putting straight pipes back on and I have not run the engine yet. RTV has a 1 day cure time as well. We will see if it pukes oil or not by lunchtime tomorrow hopefully. :D

[Steve M]

I've got a lot of stuff in the way (catch can and MCS remote reservoirs, but you can kinda see how mine routed):

https://i.ibb.co/gJhKLSG/Line-Routing.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/pr1pK1B/IMG-9749.jpg

http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn227/meentss02/Viper/IMG_97531024x768_zps82fadf26.jpg

http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn227/meentss02/Viper/IMG_97631024x768_zps66f3e863.jpg

[FrgMstr]

I've got a lot of stuff in the way (catch can and MCS remote reservoirs, but you can kinda see how mine routed):

I am going to suggest that my long hose is longer than yours. :) And I did not want to bend it hard over the corner of the back of that box. Not saying that it will ever cause an issue with how heavy duty that hose it, just chose not to as it did not "feel" right to me.

[Steve M]

I remember it taking a while to get it where it felt "right"...it took some wiggling and shoving, but it finally gave in and let me put it where I wanted it.

[Viper Specialty]

Bingo.

Steve M posted exactly what I was looking for. All hoses [by generation] are exactly the same length, that I can promise, ha.

Now that I look at Steve's however, I am beginning to think the comment I had in the original instructions with regard to the long hose location over/under the bar being different by generation may have been an old notation that should he been removed. I cannot find any reference photos for G4 that indicate the actual installed sets being run under, nor can I remember. I am vaguely remembering it may have been a test-fit set that we decided against using on the production version in light of the over-bar method as used on G3. I will correct this in the notes.

[FrgMstr]

Tell me the lengths on the hoses and I will give that a measure.

I still think with the relay box there, obviously it was not planned for with Gen IV hoses, a 90 elbow would be a much better solution. This was you would not have the hose pushing so hard against the relay box. Just an opinion from a guy that sold industrial hose for 10 years in Houston. :)

[Steve M]

Bingo.

Steve M posted exactly what I was looking for. All hoses [by generation] are exactly the same length, that I can promise, ha.

Now that I look at Steve's however, I am beginning to think the comment I had in the original instructions with regard to the long hose location over/under the bar being different by generation may have been an old notation that should he been removed. I cannot find any reference photos for G4 that indicate the actual installed sets being run under, nor can I remember. I am vaguely remembering it may have been a test-fit set that we decided against using on the production version in light of the over-bar method as used on G3. I will correct this in the notes.

It's been a couple years since I did this install, but I don't remember the hose running under any bars.

[FrgMstr]

Here is the OE configured picture I took before I started my install so I would have reference. Full resolution pictures in the dropbox link above as well.

http://kylebennett.com/files/hfpics/Viper2008OilCoolerLines.jpg

[Cowger]

I should have dropped that stupid oil pan when I did my install...could have save so much grief. There was a world shortage of cuss words that day, because they were all coming out of my mouth.

Man, ain't that the truth! It actually looks like a pleasant job with the pan gone. With pan = about as far from "pleasant" as you can get...

[FrgMstr]

First test run went well with Viper Specialty hoses, got it up to temp, no leaks. Perfect. :)

[Leslie]

Thanks guys for this thread and the pics, sent a copy to my mechanic so I can get this done after the snow melts:)

My leak is minimal right now but I want to take care of this before it goes any further, '08 ACR with 19k miles.

[FrgMstr]

Looks great FrgMstr, did you replace or re-use your oil pan gasket upon installing the oil pan? What was the torque on the bolts?

Saw this thread pop up with Leslie posting in it and I thought I would follow up. Ran the car well over 100 miles in one drive and got under the car when I got back.

The oil cooler lines in perfect shape with no issues, not a drop of leakage. And the re-used oil pan gasket did perfect as well.

[kirkinsb]

I have had VSP's oil cooler lines for about 5 months now. It was one of the first things I had fixed when I bought my used Gen 3. The oem lines were dripping on the garage floor. Dans are bone dry 5 months later....and am sure they will be for many years to come. I recommend them.

[Redx]

Just finished installing these, i thought id be sneaky and do it pan on, big mistake. Got them both off with the pan on, less than 10 minutes. Getting them on was another story, its dam near impossible to get them straight on. Pulled the pan, not too bad. Should be mentioned that theres 15 M8 bolts on the bottom, 4 M8 bolts for oil pan to transmission, 2 M6 bolts for the ac compressor line, 2 M6 bolts for flywheel cover, and 4 M6 bolts tucked under the flywheel cover. Installed the pan, be careful of the swinging pickup and you have to get your hand up in there to get it through the hole in the baffle.

All in all, took me about 4 hours, probably would have been a bit easier with two people, with one person holding the line up top. I also routed them the way frgmster did, it was way too tight on the relay box and support tube the preffered way. Also used offset snap on 1 1/4" and 1 1/16" for removal and install, made life a lot easier that way. I would suggest using a 1 1/4" and 1 1/16" crowsfoot as that would have been helpful (didn't have them with me today :( )

[venomous08]

I have done them before without removing the pan. Wasn't to bad, but I guess my definition of bad is different from others..

Main thing was getting the original lines to release from the fittings, and remove coolant lines from the cooler to get enough clearance to remove lines from the cooler.

[FrgMstr]

I also routed them the way frgmster did, it was way too tight on the relay box and support tube the preffered way. Also used offset snap on 1 1/4" and 1 1/16" for removal and install, made life a lot easier that way. I would suggest using a 1 1/4" and 1 1/16" crowsfoot as that would have been helpful (didn't have them with me today :( )

Glad to have some back up on my opinion on the routing. That relay box being in the way makes a big difference, but honestly, even with those routed over the top, it does not stick out or look bad.

Agreed on the wrenches, also, getting straight wrenches in on the oil cooler would have been easier with the cooler removed.

[Redx]

I have done them before without removing the pan. Wasn't to bad, but I guess my definition of bad is different from others..

Main thing was getting the original lines to release from the fittings, and remove coolant lines from the cooler to get enough clearance to remove lines from the cooler.

Did you replace them with the VSP lines or stock? Stock for stock would have been easy, the VSP lines require a bit more to install.

[venomous08]

Did you replace them with the VSP lines or stock? Stock for stock would have been easy, the VSP lines require a bit more to install.

VSP lines. Gen4 north of 10k miles so it was developing the normal leak we all know about.

[Redx]

VSP lines. Gen4 north of 10k miles so it was developing the normal leak we all know about.

I commend you on that, i just couldn't do it, that takes skill lol.

[venomous08]

I commend you on that, i just couldn't do it, that takes skill lol.

I don't think I got away unscathed. I think I ended up with the normal cuts from stuff like this in tight spaces. I think the powers came off with a crows foot (lower line) upper had to use an open ended wrench. Have several sets with different angles so found the one that fit.

Cooler side was tough especially when trying not to make a mess with coolant. If you can get the OE quick release to let go it isn't that bad.

[Redx]

Really? I did the tops in no time without even pulling the coolant lines. I didn't realize these were two piece hoses, I pulled them off complete.

[venomous08]

Really? I did the tops in no time without even pulling the coolant lines. I didn't realize these were two piece hoses, I pulled them off complete.

Yep they are. That's what helped on the lowers going into the block.

[Mamba003]

My day has come. Ordered lines from Dan. They'll add some extra bling as well. Thanks Dan. Another quality part!

[Viper Specialty]

My day has come. Ordered lines from Dan. They'll add some extra bling as well. Thanks Dan. Another quality part!


Tom, you just couldn't use the same username you had on the other forum, huh? LOL

I am sitting here like "Who is this guy? Did I miss an order somewhere...?"

Built your lines yesterday, out the door today.

Thanks!

[Steve M]

A couple years later, mine are still doing well, and by doing well I mean not leaking like the shitty OEM lines. Well worth the effort in hindsight.

[Mamba003]

So I am in the middle of tackling this. Getting the originals off was too bad. After reading this thread I figured getting the stock quick fit adapters off was going to be a pain in the butt however mine weren't too tight. Now to get the new lines on is a different story. How the hell do you get the back top line on when you have to hold it and try to thread it at the same time? I tried for 15 min and gave up, cleaned up and drank heavily. Going to tackle again next week. Any pointers or recommendations would be appreciated.

[Viper Specialty]

So I am in the middle of tackling this. Getting the originals off was too bad. After reading this thread I figured getting the stock quick fit adapters off was going to be a pain in the butt however mine weren't too tight. Now to get the new lines on is a different story. How the hell do you get the back top line on when you have to hold it and try to thread it at the same time? I tried for 15 min and gave up, cleaned up and drank heavily. Going to tackle again next week. Any pointers or recommendations would be appreciated.

This is why the pointers recommend a second person, or taking the pan off. A second person to hold the line in place from the top and get the angle correct while you screw in from the bottom makes it a lot easier.

[That other crazy expensive line option that can be installed nearly without tools that I suggested keeps looking better and better, eh? LOL!]

[Steve M]

Yep...if you haven't dropped the pan, you might think about it. It took me a solid 2 hours of messing with it by myself before I finally got it.

[Mamba003]

I'll try to have someone help from top side. Yes the idea about slip fit sounds great now that my arms and hands are covered in cuts and scratches.


This is why the pointers recommend a second person, or taking the pan off. A second person to hold the line in place from the top and get the angle correct while you screw in from the bottom makes it a lot easier.

[That other crazy expensive line option that can be installed nearly without tools that I suggested keeps looking better and better, eh? LOL!]

[venomous08]

I'll try to have someone help from top side. Yes the idea about slip fit sounds great now that my arms and hands are covered in cuts and scratches.

That's called creating memories lmao...

[Ninjazx71]

Looks like I'm in the same boat and need to replace the lines. When I had my clutch slave cylinder replaced the other month, the tech saw a little oil at the fittings and just tightened them up thinking that took care of it... couple weeks later, a few drops on the garage floor shows it's still happening.

For those that had these replaced by a dealer... is this something any Dodge dealer should be able to handle, or is it still recommended to seek a Viper Tech shop? Also, any input on what the labor costs should be for this type of replacement along with an oil change? Shop that fixed my slave cylinder, brakes and alignment quoted me like $450 in labor (I supply the oil cooler lines) to do the work and change the oil. Thought that was a bit high, but maybe not?

[Steve M]

The job isn't that hard...obviously I'm not a Viper tech, and I handled the replacement just fine. It is one of those "pull off the old, install the new" types of deals...if you can find a wrench and turn it, you can do it.

That said, I'd have a bigger issue with what gets used to replace them - the factory lines use a piss poor seal design that eventually fails. If you replace the lines with OEM, you'll end up in this same boat at some point in the future. If you are going to the trouble and/or expense of doing this, I'd highly recommend using Dan's lines...he uses fittings that are actually worth a damn. It ain't cheap, but good fittings are never cheap.

[Ninjazx71]

If you are going to the trouble and/or expense of doing this, I'd highly recommend using Dan's lines...he uses fittings that are actually worth a damn. It ain't cheap, but good fittings are never cheap.

Definitely going with a non-OEM set of lines... don't want to be doing this again in a few months/years... BTW... sitting in the Marriott in Dayton right now. LOL! Shitty, rainy day, so I'm guessing you don't have the Viper out. HAHAHA.

[Steve M]

It is a shitty, rainy day indeed...had my car out last night knowing full well that it would be a rainy mess today. It is most definitely at home tucked away in my garage at the moment.

[ACtechOPS]

Dan's hoses are pure quality, that's my review on VSP website. Same thing when I bought my car, had it on the lift and noticed the leak, dealer tightened the oil cooler fittings and I went on my way. Naturally, that didn't work. Have about 13,000 miles on them with no issues over last few years. Did not drop the pan to install, did it on axle stands with basic hand tools. It was awkward but not a huge ordeal. Using OEM replacement should not even be an option, the poor quality crimping issues have never been resolved - you are literally throwing your money away. About to do a Texas run 4,000 mile round trip!

[SSGNRDZ_28]

[That other crazy expensive line option that can be installed nearly without tools that I suggested keeps looking better and better, eh? LOL!]

What is this option, Dan? Something you offer?

[Viper Specialty]

What is this option, Dan? Something you offer?

Sorry for the delay, just saw this.

Basically, I have been considering acquiring the tooling to produce a new hose design, it would be crimp type rather than screw type ends, but the big difference is that it would use a hose end/adapter that uses a clamshell clamp to hold the ends together. Basically, you would screw the adapters into the block with a socket [just like OE], slip the hose over the adapter, and then snap a clamshell clamp over it. The look cool as hell, and require no tools for connect/disconnect. Very similar to Wiggins clamp design. We use them in other applications, and they work incredible well. The only downside is that they [fittings/clamps] are not cheap, and the hose they are designed to work with is also extremely expensive... not to mention the tooling. The hoses could be made with either 2 or 4 disconnects, and the disconnects could be placed on the fittings, or on the hose [think either side of the hose end "elbow"]. I just dont know if there would be a market for such a product, but if you factor in 3-4 hours of shop time to install the standard style vs. 1 hour for this type, it begins to make a case.

[Mamba003]

Yeah considering my car is still in pieces it makes a whole hell of a lot of sense at the point. Damn it. Dan the plane ticket is in the mail.

[Mamba003]

Well I wrapped this up yesterday. Man was that s pain in the ass. It is a two man job since someone needs to hold the lines in place to relieve tension to start threads. They don't turn that easily. I did manage to get two hand up, one by the fitting themselves and the other towards the front to hold the line. I lost a decent amount of anti freeze so will have to pick some up from dealership. Thank god that is over with and I'll be back in the saddle shortly. Thanks Dan for a great solution.

[Rocket]

Just ordered a set of new lines from Dan today as I noticed the signature single drop of oil mark on the floor. It is confusing when you look up at the leak as the oil will be dripping from the AC line that runs under the oil pan. And speaking of the oil pan - mine is definitely coming down when I do the install based on the comments and the pictures. Thanks for all of the tips!!!
http://driveviper.com/gallery/data/500/medium/20160121_103654.jpg
http://driveviper.com/gallery/data/500/medium/20160121_103728.jpg

[FrgMstr]

Pull that pan for sure, makes it 100 times easier. Also you can inspect the crank and give the pan and good cleaning the see if there is anything in there that should not be.

[FrgMstr]

And Dan's assemblies are top quality.

[viper04blk]

I am going to be ordering up my lines today. I wont be replacing them for quite sometime as the cold will ensure my hands bleed alot more when they get cut.

Question: why do people talk about loosing collant? Dont you drain the oil, remove the hoses, replace the hoses. Why would collant be lost?

[FrgMstr]

I am going to be ordering up my lines today. I wont be replacing them for quite sometime as the cold will ensure my hands bleed alot more when they get cut.

Question: why do people talk about loosing collant? Dont you drain the oil, remove the hoses, replace the hoses. Why would collant be lost?

It is easier, and somewhat advisable to remove those cooler lines that are on that heat exchanger too as they get in they way of installing the new oil coolant lines. So you will get a bit of coolant loss there. No biggy, just fill the reservoir and bleed out any air when you are done.

[viper04blk]

I am trying to determine if I should get the JTS venom lines or the Viper specialty performance lines. Aside from the price, can anyone explain the pros/cons?

[FrgMstr]

I am trying to determine if I should get the JTS venom lines or the Viper specialty performance lines. Aside from the price, can anyone explain the pros/cons?

I went with the Viper Specialty lines as I like the way they configure the fittings a bit more cleanly on the ends and the bends look to be more fitting than the JTS. The JTS are good hoses as well, and I don't think you would have any issues, and are running $300 now (http://shop.jtsvp.com/product.sc?productId=669&categoryId=242). My post in this thread is here will full pics of both ends attached (http://driveviper.com/forums/threads/146-Oil-Cooler-Line-Replacement-(Gen-IV)?p=113173&viewfull=1#post113173). Dan's hoses are $50 more (http://viperspecialtyperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=196). Just comes down to preference on how the ends are configured. I liked Dan's better.

Also worth mentioning is that JTS uses crimped on fittings where Dan's are screwed on. Generally speaking, and I used to sell industrial hose, crimped on fittings are more durable IF those are installed correctly. But fact of the matter is that these hoses are spec'ed so far beyond what is actually needed for the application, that it is almost silly.

[viper04blk]

I cant seem to find anyone with a review on the JTS lines. With exchange rate/shipping the JTS lines are over 100 bucks cheaper then dans. I will keep looking for a review on the JTS lines.

[viper04blk]

My oil pan gasket leaks a little bit (just barely). And the last owner has a receipt in his folder he gave me for having the lines replaced. The dodge dealership replaced the lines with OEM lines... so I bet they reused the oil pan gasket and thats why it leaks slightly. So, I know I will drop my oil pan, as this will cure my current oil leak problem (oil pan gasket) and any future oil leak problems.

[Viper Specialty]

What it boils down to is this:

VSP lines use 1-piece hose ends that are native O-Ring Boss like the Viper ports. JTSVP lines use a standard JIC hose end that uses a JIC to O-Ring Boss adapter. As a result, our ends are true double swivel, and when installed and tightened they will still swivel in two directions. When JTSVP lines are installed, they can twist only at the hose. When the engine torques, you will be pulling on the JIC adapters as they are rigid. Our lines are Stainless Braid and then Nylon covered, JTSVP appear to be Kevlar OR Stainless, Stainless by itself causes damage, and Kevlar by itself frays with contact.

Comparison aside, we have eliminated JIC from our builds for multiple reasons. The primary reason being that the "assembly ring" on the hose end nut can gall, and that will cause the hose end to be ruined, and it becomes a nightmare to R&R the hose. The secondary reason is that O-Ring Boss is natively nearly immune to loosening from vibration and torque influences, as the O-Ring on the fitting acts as a "lock-tite", as well as tightening torque having no influence on the sealing ability of the hose end. JIC ends can loosen with vibration, and can leak from being both under and over torqued.

As pointed out above, Crimp hose ends are generally more reliable than screw together, assuming correct assembly. However, as also pointed out, either of these line types so far exceed the actual use, that its effectively a moot point in either case. The reality is that either line type will serve you well compared to OEM.


Now, all of that said... to add even more confusion to everything, we actually have a second and third version of these lines in the works.

V1.0 everyone knows and loves, and is nylon covered stainless braid with reusable direct-port hose ends, in either red or black.

V2.0 will be an alternative version of V1.0, which will use crimped hose ends, still of the direct port type with no adapters. It will use a CSM covered quad-layer hose, with a PTFE inner, Stainless reinforced Silicone mid-layer, covered with a Kevlar braid, and then molded with a textured rubber outer protective covering. Pretty much the best hose on the face of the earth when it comes to longevity, appearance, and not damaging other components. Will be available with Black/Nickel or Black/Gold hose ends.

V3.0 will be a V2.0 hose assembly, but with Quick-Disconnect type hose ends, available with either 2 or 4 QD's. This will radically simplify installation, and allow tool-less line disconnect once the adapters are in place. More money up front, but will save HOURS of screwing around on install and any future engine service... each time. Do not however confuse this with a JIC/ORB adapter type hose, these are Dual O-Ring swivel hose ends with built in full-flow QD sleeves and adapters, and the QD clamps have quadruple safeties to prevent accidental disconnect, three are passive and one is active. Really cool stuff, and completely race-bred.

Example:
https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/t31.0-8/10924267_10102561792494258_5380924175269603755_o.j pg

[FrgMstr]

QD fittings sound like pretty crazy overkill considering the high quality hose you are using will likely never wear out during the life of the car. LOL! Especially with the swivels on both ends... I highly doubt the set I bought from you will ever fail.

[Viper Specialty]

QD fittings sound like pretty crazy overkill considering the high quality hose you are using will likely never wear out during the life of the car. LOL! Especially with the swivels on both ends... I highly doubt the set I bought from you will ever fail.


I would totally agree, there is absolutely nothing wrong with the current version, and more than likely we will continue to offer them as-is.

The main reason for the over-kill is to cut down the install time. V3.0 will be a 30 minute install, *with* the oil pan on. No need to pull the pan, disconnect coolant lines, or anything of the sort. Another bonus is of course for guys who pull their engines, pre-oil their engines, etc. A couple hours now becomes minutes. Side benefit, gone will be the days of having to be careful with fittings for fear of scratching the hell out of them.

And of course... they look cool. LOL

Basically, we will probably eliminate the Black version of V1.0 as they are a pain in the ass to make, which will then be replaced by V2.0. We will keep the Red V1.0, Black V2.0, and offer the QD options for V3.0 on request. Now that we have the ability to crimp these in house, we can whip up lines on request rather than shelf-stock them pre-made in production intervals.

[06SRTCoupe]

So, do you have the new version oil lines available now and if so, how much are they? Mine factory ones are starting to seep!

[Viper Specialty]

So, do you have the new version oil lines available now and if so, how much are they? Mine factory ones are starting to seep!

Sorry, not available yet, its going to be another month or two as we are still waiting for some of the tooling.

Costs are not yet set, but please be aware they will be significantly more expensive than the current version. The CSM hose is 50 bucks a foot, fittings cost more, QD's aren't cheap, etc. It is NOT a cost conscious option, it is a "best of everything" option. I may explore offering the non-CSM hose option as well, which forgoes the outer CSM cover and is instead standard Kevlar woven outer... this gets the price down a good bit.

Side note: These lines, technologies, QD's and fittings are all Fuel Rated and Professional Racing Approved, which is the main reason we are jumping over to this capability... so if anyone needs fuel lines made, we will be able to supply anything you want. These lines are lighter, more reliable, more flexible, wider fitting selection, smaller fitting size, do not permeate fuel smell like rubber lines, and have far better flow rates by size compared to standard market offerings. QD options available on size -8 and up fitting, size -6 hose and up [jump-size hose end]

[FrgMstr]

I would totally agree, there is absolutely nothing wrong with the current version, and more than likely we will continue to offer them as-is.

The main reason for the over-kill is to cut down the install time. V3.0 will be a 30 minute install, *with* the oil pan on. No need to pull the pan, disconnect coolant lines, or anything of the sort. Another bonus is of course for guys who pull their engines, pre-oil their engines, etc. A couple hours now becomes minutes. Side benefit, gone will be the days of having to be careful with fittings for fear of scratching the hell out of them.

And of course... they look cool. LOL

Basically, we will probably eliminate the Black version of V1.0 as they are a pain in the ass to make, which will then be replaced by V2.0. We will keep the Red V1.0, Black V2.0, and offer the QD options for V3.0 on request. Now that we have the ability to crimp these in house, we can whip up lines on request rather than shelf-stock them pre-made in production intervals.

Yeah, I would have popped for QC hose ends if I could have put my hands on those the first time around. Make'um and I will sing your praises. Changing these things is a huge PITA without a lift....I bought a lift since then!

Aeroquip finally get off their ass and spot you a crimper?

[Viper Specialty]

Aeroquip finally get off their ass and spot you a crimper?

Haha, I wish. Had to buy one... good 'ole Section 179 "buy it before Uncle Sam takes it all anyway" this year.

However this one is not AQP. It can do them, but its specifically designed to fit the special full-close dies for the racing hoses mentioned above in standard form. If I jump to AQP I just need to dies and cones for them instead.

[JTS VENOM PERFORMANCE]

not sure really, we use quality crimp fittings, that will swivel any direction and we do them in house, and offer a lifetime warranty on our oil lines, we supply many vendors, but yessir we do crimp our own hoses in house and plumb all our vehicles

[Alex Mills]

I just wanted to say thanks to everyone for this thread for all of the tips and tricks in regards to installation.

My second set of OEM lines (replaced under warranty and mentioned way back on page 1 of this thread) have started leaking too so I just bought a set of lines off JonB. Looks like they're the JTS ones?

http://i.imgur.com/S5mzsPJh.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/S5mzsPJ.jpg)


Anyway, when I do go to install them, you guys will have saved me a ton of headache! :)

[Rocket]

I just completed the project and it ranks near the top for being a royal PIA!!! Bought Dan's (Viper Specialty) lines and they are top quality - so I don't expect to ever have to do it again - which is a good thing! I don't have a lift - so had the viper up on blocks which provided decent access. Getting the old lines and fittings out was a breeze - simply removed the spring clip and the old lines pop right out. 1 1/4" socket and the fittings were out in about 10 minutes. This was so easy, I thought, maybe I can put the new lines in without taking down the oil pan - wrong! Fought at it for about an hour and finally realized what everyone had said earlier - just drop the pan. After dropping the pan - easy access to get the lines in place. My take-aways:

Drop the oil pan - gasket is good and reusable - and just need to add a dab of RTV in each of the corners.
A 1 1/8" crowsfoot open end wrench would make the job easier.
Taking the cooling lines off of the oil cooler makes it easier to tighten the oil lines (but a crowsfoot wrench might obviate the need to remove.)
Dan - the V3 version you mention sounds great (if you can get the cost down) as not dropping the oil pan would be ideal.

[Parmenion1_00]

Totally agree with slithers comment. Spot on.


It's informative write-ups like this and people like you that makes these sites a good place to be.

Thanks

[mdsrt10]

Is the issue with the oil pan that it makes it difficult to start the threads on the VS lines, or is there more to it than that. I got under the car and looked at the lines and I didn't see how having the pan off would help much. Mine's a 2008. Thanks!

[Viper Specialty]

Is the issue with the oil pan that it makes it difficult to start the threads on the VS lines, or is there more to it than that. I got under the car and looked at the lines and I didn't see how having the pan off would help much. Mine's a 2008. Thanks!

That's part of the issue. The main problem is that there is just no room for hand access or to swing a damn wrench! With the pan off, it is much easier.

However, since the last time I posted, we now have FIVE versions of oil lines. Four of these five versions use QD engine side fittings, and as a result are much faster and easier to install even with the pan on. Also for what its worth, the ProPlus and HS79 offerings "fit" Gen-4's better due to the availability of additional fitting angles in creased hose flexibility. The Standard lines do not have a fitting angle available that completely eliminates the hose pointing towards that goofy fan relay box that they put on the Gen-4 applications.

Standard: http://viperspecialtyperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/22_34/products_id/196
ProPlus 2QD: http://viperspecialtyperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/22_34/products_id/264
ProPlus 4QD: http://viperspecialtyperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/22_34/products_id/265
HS79 2QD: http://viperspecialtyperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/22_34/products_id/262
HS79 4QD: http://viperspecialtyperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/22_34/products_id/263

[mdsrt10]

Thanks for the info! Sounds like the stock fittings are torqued pretty tight. How tight do your standard lines need to be tightened? Since there's no way to get a torque wrench on it what do you guys recommend to get them on correctly?

[Viper Specialty]

Thanks for the info! Sounds like the stock fittings are torqued pretty tight. How tight do your standard lines need to be tightened? Since there's no way to get a torque wrench on it what do you guys recommend to get them on correctly?

All of our fittings are O-Ring Boss, and are not torque sensitive, since they seal with an o-ring. Anywhere from 25-50 ft/lbs is acceptable.

Secondly, please keep in mind what I mentioned above. You have a 2008, which being Gen-4, does fit better with the higher grade lines. Any are fine, but keep that in mind... 3 hours, banged knuckles and lots of swearing can quickly become 30 minutes with the top-end offerings. If paying for someone else to install, these balance out on cost pretty quickly.

[viperBase1]

I understand the OEM lines kinda suck, but are they easy to install?

The VSP webby says they're working OffSite 'Till further notice.. prolly cuz of the deep freeze they're in.
Called and left VM to get ETA on delivery.

[Steve M]

I understand the OEM lines kinda suck, but are they easy to install?

The VSP webby says they're working OffSite 'Till further notice.. prolly cuz of the deep freeze they're in.
Called and left VM to get ETA on delivery.

I wouldn't care if they walked out of the box they were shipped in and installed themselves...okay, maybe if they did that, but short of them installing themselves, I wouldn't waste my money on something I know would fail again.

Do it once, do it right, and move on. It's probably been about 5 years since I installed Dan's lines in my car, and although I was cussing up a storm at the time, I'm glad to know I should never have to do it again.

[Lizzardking308]

The VSP lines are WELL worth the wait. Hands down an essential upgrade.

[viperBase1]

I wouldn't care if they walked out of the box they were shipped in and installed themselves...okay, maybe if they did that, but short of them installing themselves, I wouldn't waste my money on something I know would fail again.

Do it once, do it right, and move on. It's probably been about 5 years since I installed Dan's lines in my car, and although I was cussing up a storm at the time, I'm glad to know I should never have to do it again.


The VSP lines are WELL worth the wait. Hands down an essential upgrade.

Thanks man, I read the historical documents and hear your words!

Timing is everything.
The SoCal Viper crew is having a cruise next Saturday n' I really want to go.

During an oil change YESTERDAY (to 5W-50.. prepping for the cruise) I discovered the Oil Cooler Line leak. No big surprise.
Looks like it just started too.. so I'm catching it early. But I'm concerned the increased oil pressure from the 5W-50 is just going to make things worse.
Especially on a 4 hour cruise. AND I really REALLY don't want to drop the oil pan after a fresh oil change.

Dan from VSP responded to an email (on a Sunday even!) and said delivery is probably a couple weeks away. :(
Was looking to get the Pro-Plus [2] Quick-Connect Oil Lines with the 30 minute easy-peasy install-o-rama feature.
Has anybody here installed those? Are they really that zippy?

No doubt I can have the OEM lines in hand by Wed.. and it looks like they clip in.
So was just trying to verify if the OEM install is as easy as it looks.
Has anybody here done the OEM replacement?

Thanks again.

[Steve M]

That's a tough spot to be in, but from what I've seen and what I saw on my own oil cooler lines when they leaked, these things don't fail catastrophically. If it were me, I'd probably just go at risk and do the 4 hour cruise. If you are really are concerned, just go ahead and swap in the new OEM lines, knowing that you'll need to readdress the situation down the road at some point. You'll still need to add some additional oil after the swap though, because you'll lose some from the oil cooler and lines during the swap. Obviously not a whole pan's worth though.

[Rocket]

I wouldn't even think twice about not doing the cruise with the old lines and not worrying one bit - even with the heavier oil. The old lines never seem to catastrophically fail and at worst, the leak is best described as a weep.

[Viper Specialty]

To clarify, the (2) connect version of the pro-plus are out of stock, *for good* until I am back up north. I can only build them up there, not down here. I have (1) set of the other three higher end line versions left in stock, and a few sets of the standard versions. The 2QC-PP just happens to have sold out first since I left. In any case however, they would ALL be delayed at least a week to ship, as they are in NY inventory, not FL.

[ForTehNguyen]

is there a DYI or instructions to do this. My G5 started having some leaks

[FrgMstr]

is there a DYI or instructions to do this. My G5 started having some leaks

Overall a PITA. Get the wrench to put the new fitting on the block, and pull the oil pan when doing it as the process is made about 95% more simple and less time consuming with the oil pan pulled. You can re-use that oil pan gasket so no cost there. You will need to replace a bit of RTV gasket at the corners of the pan when you replace it.

[ACtechOPS]

I did it without removing the oil pan but access at the block is very awkward. I agree with the comments, these lines historically develop a slow leak at the crimps. First thing I replaced on my car, but it was obvious they had been leaking for many miles. I suspect they were original and my '04 had 67k on the clock. Since then, complete drive train has been replaced/upgraded. Turns out the VSP lines were cheap in comparison. Been running mine for 4 years with no issues, Dan makes quality stuff. I would do the drive without any worries.

[swexlin]

I wouldn't even think twice about not doing the cruise with the old lines and not worrying one bit - even with the heavier oil. The old lines never seem to catastrophically fail and at worst, the leak is best described as a weep.

This. I'm on my replacement (OEM) lines in my 2013, and the 2nd replacement block fitting (the original replacement leaked almost immediately).

[ForTehNguyen]

im reading the QD fittings dont require to drop the pan to install , but what about taking the original lines off? Is there any sealant I could apply to stop the leak. I have the 10 year powertrain warranty also so i cant exactly get the aftermarket lines, but I dont want to take the car in only to have it leak again.

edit: just read an earlier post you can just disconnect factory lines and unscrew fitting, then sounds like hte QD goes in the same way

[swexlin]

My Viper tech has done so many, he did it pretty quick, without dropping the pan. I'm sure it will leak again shortly......

[FrgMstr]

im reading the QD fittings dont require to drop the pan to install , but what about taking the original lines off? Is there any sealant I could apply to stop the leak. I have the 10 year powertrain warranty also so i cant exactly get the aftermarket lines, but I dont want to take the car in only to have it leak again.

edit: just read an earlier post you can just disconnect factory lines and unscrew fitting, then sounds like hte QD goes in the same way

Changing OE lines is easy due to the QD fittings at the block.

[viperBase1]

So as it turned out, even the fine folks at SoCalMoparDirect.com can't get the OEM lines to me till next week.
I'll be placing my order with Dan at VSP shortly and I'll just wait it out.

N' we're gonna go on the Viper Cruise regardless. Gonna wrap the weeping lines to try and contain the mess and better monitor/gauge the oil loss.
N' yes I'll carry some backup 5W-50 in the trunk!

Thanks for all the input guys, really appreciate the knowledge share and the access to the Historical Viper Documents (HVD ®). :orange: :devilish:

[swexlin]

I don't think you need to wrap anything. You won't lose enough to notice. Many people have their lines leak for weeks or months without noticing.

[ttrentt]

N' we're gonna go on the Viper Cruise regardless. Gonna wrap the weeping lines to try and contain the mess and better monitor/gauge the oil loss.
N' yes I'll carry some backup 5W-50 in the trunk!

Don't stress it, the lines have been leaking on my car for a long time AFAIK -- these lines won't explode with the way they are crimped, they will just leak slowly. I think my car drops 1 drop every 6-7 days. This is very low on my list of things to replace.

[swexlin]

Don't stress it, the lines have been leaking on my car for a long time AFAIK -- these lines won't explode with the way they are crimped, they will just leak slowly. I think my car drops 1 drop every 6-7 days. This is very low on my list of things to replace.


Good post. Usually, more of a nuisance than anything.

[viperBase1]

So did the Viper Cruise Saturday and all went well. No prob.
In a strange turn of events, it appears the weeping of the Oil Lines has stopped.. maybe it was the heavier oil. Dunno.

[swexlin]

So did the Viper Cruise Saturday and all went well. No prob.
In a strange turn of events, it appears the weeping of the Oil Lines has stopped.. maybe it was the heavier oil. Dunno.

They always come back....LOL! Glad you had a good trip.

[Redx]

Just putting the motor back in from arrow, they had the lines off and I can’t remember. I’m assuming the longer line goes the port nearest to the engine mount(rear most part of engine), and the shorter to the port near the oil filter(forward part of engine)?

[Steve M]

Just putting the motor back in from arrow, they had the lines off and I can’t remember. I’m assuming the longer line goes the port nearest to the engine mount(rear most part of engine), and the shorter to the port near the oil filter(forward part of engine)?

Correct...just verified on mine.

[Redx]

Correct...just verified on mine.

Thanks Steve!

[V10 505]

I ended up replacing my oil cooler lines with the ones from JTS. They were a great help on the phone and the install went really easy for me. Removal of the original lines was quick and easy as others had stated with the 1 1/4" socket and install of the new lines was actually really smooth, the only thing I removed was the air box to get at the upper connections. The motor connections took a bit to get my hand in the right position to get the fittings started but after that using a 1" wrench between the frame and the oil pan I was able to tighten them up without issue. Not sure maybe the wrench I had just had the perfect offset on it.

[A2008]

Just a coincident, I replaced my oil lines also this past weekend. I too was very skeptical and read every post about how tough these lines were going to be. I prepared by purchasing Dan Lessor's Pro Plus lines that have the clamp attachment for the fittings that goes into the engine block. Next I had a 1-1/4" combination wrench along with a socket, and a crows wrench just in case. I also had the 1" and 3/4" wrenches and sockets as well. I disconnected the lines from the stock socket fitting that goes to the block. The combination wrench worked perfectly to removed the fittings from the block. It wasn't tough to break loose at all. I then installed the new fittings from Dan. Next I was able to disconnect the fittings at the cooler end. I used a crows wrench on the outside one and a regular wrench on the other one. Dan's the new lines clamped easily in place at the engine block. When mounting the other end to the oil cooler, I did have to disconnect the cooler in order to tighten the lines there. Overall this job was a lot easier than I expected. I was prepared to drop the oil pan, but found I didn't need to. Once I had everything laid out and ready to go, the overall job from start to finish, took me ( by myself) less than 1 hour. The only other part that came off was the oil filter. Now I will say, having the vehicle on my lift was one big advantage. Having the right part and the right tools makes all the difference.

[viperBase1]

Done!

Timed the job with the semi-annual oil change (6 months / 1078 miles 5W-50 :orange:).
Old oil drained out looked great.. was just starting to change color a bit.
We are so good to these damn cars!

My experience was pretty much the same as everyone here has had.
I was using a Lift and took my sweet time.. and was in no big rush.

Drained the oil an removed the oil filter.

Old lines came off the engine block real easy.. too easy for my taste. Took no effort at all to break 'em loose.
But yea, was tough using the giant 1 1/4" combo wrench (from Amazon (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000Q6JAOA/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)) in such a tight space.

Hey V10 505, you said your wrench had a good offset that made it easier. Which one was it? A wrench with just a little more offset woulda helped.
?: What's the 1 1/4" socket for? I bought one but didn't find an opportunity to use it. Didn't see how to remove the OEM line from the mount nut.

Getting the OEM lines off the Oil Cooler was a different story.
The back line broke loose and came off with ease (1 1/4" combo wrench).
The front line was stuck.

Had to remove the air box, DSE cold air intake and DSE OCC.. and then the Oil Cooler itself. N' shazaaam, saw the front of the engine for the first time!
I think the 1 1/4" Crows wrench is the right tool for this particular job.. so kicking myself for not grabbing one.

Farbricated my own lines with parts from Summit Racing (huge thanks to Late to the Party (https://driveviper.com/forums/threads/21368-On-the-Lookout-For-Two-Years-Now?p=344094&viewfull=1#post344094)).
Took my sweet time doing this.

Still, was a little tough connecting the new line fittings to the block connectors.. it's just such a tight space.

Then buttoned her all back up, primed the oil filter and added the rest of the new oil.
Done!

She fired right up, no leaks and no dash lights.
Took a peak under the car last night and all is well.
So happy to have this job done.

Those OEM lines so sssSSSUUUUUUuuucccckkkkk.

On a scale of 1 to 5, I give this job a solid "3 Wrenches". N' that's with a Lift!

[efnfast]

My lines are starting to puke oil and need to be replaced .... I'm making my own lines since I have too much spare startlite laying around to not do it myself, lol ..... is it correct that the fittings on the oil cooler and block are just -10AN o-ring?

[viperBase1]

LINK: Summit Racing Parts List (https://driveviper.com/forums/threads/21368-On-the-Lookout-For-Two-Years-Now?p=344094&viewfull=1#post344094)

The OEM fittings are 1 1/4". The new AN fittings are -10AN (from the Summit parts list).

[01sapphirebob]

Must be that time of year. My lines started to leak a couple weeks ago. They finally caught up with me. Plan on making my own lines. Lets see how this goes...

[efnfast]

LINK: Summit Racing Parts List (https://driveviper.com/forums/threads/21368-On-the-Lookout-For-Two-Years-Now?p=344094&viewfull=1#post344094)

The OEM fittings are 1 1/4". The new AN fittings are -10AN (from the Summit parts list).

10AN ORB ... that's what I thought ... thanks!

[99RT10]

Must be that time of year. My lines started to leak a couple weeks ago. They finally caught up with me. Plan on making my own lines. Lets see how this goes...

For $230, I couldn't pass up the deal. I have done a couple. Surprised how easy it was, even on my back. If you have a lift, piece of cake.

https://driveviper.com/gallery/member-galleries/p1455-20180318-215033-resized.html

https://driveviper.com/gallery/showfull.php?photo=1456

[blankline9]

I know this thread is dated but wanted to say thanks to everyone for all the info on these oil cooler lines. I decided that I wasn't interested in dropping the oil pan so i bucked up and bought the oil cooler lines from Dan @ viper specialty performance. I opted for the pro plus lines with the 4 quick disconnect fittings. WELL WORTH the cost to me! It honestly took me more time to get my viper up on jack stands in my garage than it did to actually get the old lines off and the new ones on. It took about 25 mins to get the old ones off and the new ones on.

I used a regular (not deep well) 1 1/4" socket on a 1/2" drive ratchet to get the lines off at both the oil cooler and the engine. No need for dropping the pan or special crows feet wrenches or anything like that. My OEM ones that I took off were in pretty rough shape and had been leaking for a while judging by how cruddy they were. The new fittings went right on using a 1" regular socket on a 1/2" drive ratchet.

So for anyone that needs to change theirs out, I highly recommend that you hit Dan up and get his QD lines.

[Fatman2006]

Does anyone know if the Prefix oil cooler lines are nylon or stainless steel?

[Ramtuff]

Nylon