Hi everyone, some questions about tires

[KLdy]

I come from the Corvette Forum, The C7 has failed me and I am looking for a new car

Purshacing a used Gen V Viper came in to my mind, it is a track-ready car without all the overheating mess

Many used 14-15 Gen V GTS are in the 70K-80K range

I am just confused on the tire size I hope that some one could help me

as I searched on Tire Rack the only two tires available is P0 and Corsa

As a guy who used both I really prefer PSS over Pzeros.

And I did some research a lot of people recommend PSS

but what is the correct size? Did you guys down size? Our aspect ratio is quite weird IMO.

Like on the C7 I have 19/20 wheels. so My fronts are 245/35 19, rears are 285/30 20.

But the Viper is 295/30 18 and 355/30 19.

Doesnt that forces me to use Pzero tho? I am a bit confused about this

but as soon as I switch to 285/35 18 with 345/30 19 I could use the PSS, but doesnt that offset the balance of the car and the ESP as well since

the fronts have a larger diameter now?

Whats your set up to run PSS on 18/19s?

Thanks for helping out

On the other hand, My friend has a Viper TA2.0 and he told me that the rear tires on the Viper last Longer than the Fronts, doesn't that also suggest the rears are too wide?

[Arizona Vipers]

I read this post 3-4 times and I still do not understand exactly what your asking... Buy the car, use factory tires, kick ass on the street and track.
If going faster on the track is important to you, get Hoosier's. There's a few different front tire size choices.

[KLdy]

I read this post 3-4 times and I still do not understand exactly what your asking... Buy the car, use factory tires, kick ass on the street and track.
If going faster on the track is important to you, get Hoosier's. There's a few different front tire size choices.


Sorry for the confusion

No that is not my point

I just want a tire which could be use both on track and street

Normal Pzeros seems like the only choice on tire rack

but some other forum members did recommend Pilot Super Sport, which means there are people using them

To me, PSS last longer on the street, more comfy and it is quieter than Pzero..

All of the cars I owned I swtiched them to PSS immediately

so I was wondering what tire combo should I run if I want to run PSS on stock 18 19s

[One Viper Bite]

The Corsa's have been proven by many to be a very capable street + track tire, not to mention the sizes required for the Viper are tuned for the car specifically. There are a few people running the Pilot Super Sports that have also given great feedback. Keep in mind most street + track tires do not come in a 355 section width but the Viper does just fine with 345s in the rear. Nitto NT05Rs, Invos, Michelin PSS, Toyo R888s all come in 345/30/19. Like Arizona Viper said, if you're looking for a dedicated track tire, the Hoosier's are the way to go.

P.S. Glad you're considering a Viper! I was in the running for a C7 Z06 about 3 months ago. It only took one test drive in the Viper and the light bulb went off in my head. It was the best choice I could have made. Don't get me wrong, the Z06 is a fantastic car. But the Viper is just special.

[cab33]

Check out the PZero Corsa's.

[KLdy]

The Corsa's have been proven by many to be a very capable street + track tire, not to mention the sizes required for the Viper are tuned for the car specifically. There are a few people running the Pilot Super Sports that have also given great feedback. Keep in mind most street + track tires do not come in a 355 section width but the Viper does just fine with 345s in the rear. Nitto NT05Rs, Invos, Michelin PSS, Toyo R888s all come in 345/30/19. Like Arizona Viper said, if you're looking for a dedicated track tire, the Hoosier's are the way to go.

P.S. Glad you're considering a Viper! I was in the running for a C7 Z06 about 3 months ago. It only took one test drive in the Viper and the light bulb went off in my head. It was the best choice I could have made. Don't get me wrong, the Z06 is a fantastic car. But the Viper is just special.

No, after everything I've been thru and throwing tons of money in to the C7, I'm finally done. The problematic Automatic, overheating transmission, overheating Engine, high oil temp. terrible quality, slow instrument cluster and infortaiment system. I'm done, looking for something that's actually track ready.

You know what. maybe FCA is terrible, Maybe Viper has less technology and electronic compare to C7, but at least it's a finished product, not a half-done. Words cannot describe everything I ve been

btw thanks for the info on the PSS, what front size should I be looking for if I want to run PSS? 345/30/19in the rear, but I don't think they make a 295/30/18 for the PSS Right?

[KLdy]

Check out the PZero Corsa's.

They dont last very long...

[J TNT]

Have grip and longevity do not go hand in hand . You'll have to decide which one you want .

[KLdy]

Have grip and longevity do not go hand in hand . You'll have to decide which one you want .
Yes that's why I choose PSS for most cars ,
so I was wondering if anyone is using them I'm just wondering what's there setup for the tires

[Andi]

I am so far unimpressed with the Pirelli PZero Corsa. I think the Pirellis are the weak link on an otherwise awesome car.

If Michelin made a PSS for the Viper we would all be switching to it from the Corsa. It's a better tire. Just does everything better, including taking track use in stride and maintaining grip levels for more heat cycles.

If only....

[KLdy]

I am so far unimpressed with the Pirelli PZero Corsa. I think the Pirellis are the weak link on an otherwise awesome car.

If Michelin made a PSS for the Viper we would all be switching to it from the Corsa. It's a better tire. Just does everything better, including taking track use in stride and maintaining grip levels for more heat cycles.

If only....

and cheaper.. .. that's why I want PSS, maybe it's gone quicker because the softer sidewalls on the track, but holy Pzero is terrible.
Corsa is suppose to compete with the Cup2
and it's not where near as good as cup2

[Dr.Ron]

As long as there is still at least a 1.2" diameter difference front to back you should be fine on the super sports. I just traded my 2011 Carbon Edition Z06 for my 2014 GTS.
I've been researching this question for track tires recently.

Ron

[Andi]

One thing to keep in mind is the front Corsas are a much softer compound than the rears - something that SRT did to combat the understeer from the large width difference front to rear. When we go with another tire, in close to the same sizes as stock or even narrower fronts, but with the same compound F & R, I would expect the understeer to increase significantly.

That's why I'm considering the Toyo R888 setup in 305/345 instead of the Michelin 285/345 setup, although I love Michelins..

**BUT** if you do the Michelin 285/345 setup, and get the increased understeer that I think you will, you can probably combat it by going with the base front / TA rear sway bar setup.

Cheers,
Andi

[KLdy]

One thing to keep in mind is the front Corsas are a much softer compound than the rears - something that SRT did to combat the understeer from the large width difference front to rear. When we go with another tire, in close to the same sizes as stock or even narrower fronts, but with the same compound F & R, I would expect the understeer to increase significantly.



That's why I'm considering the Toyo R888 setup in 305/345 instead of the Michelin 285/345 setup, although I love Michelins..

**BUT** if you do the Michelin 285/345 setup, and get the increased understeer that I think you will, you can probably combat it by going with the base front / TA rear sway bar setup.

Cheers,
Andi
Thank you very much for the answer
but if I go with the 285/345 set up my aspect ratio for the front tires will rise from 30 to 35, will that be a problem?

and how are the Tokyo R888s on the road compare to PSS overall? and how much understeer are we talking about??
I don't think it's bad for these cars to get a little bit of understeer for stability.

does adding more downforce to the front help with this situation on the 285/345 set up?

[KLdy]

As long as there is still at least a 1.2" diameter difference front to back you should be fine on the super sports. I just traded my 2011 Carbon Edition Z06 for my 2014 GTS.
I've been researching this question for track tires recently.
Ron

Hi Ron,
thanks for the answer
how many in terms of aspect ratio that 1.2 inch diameter?

I think you made a good choice on not trading in for a new Z06.

[One Viper Bite]

One thing to keep in mind is the front Corsas are a much softer compound than the rears - something that SRT did to combat the understeer from the large width difference front to rear. When we go with another tire, in close to the same sizes as stock or even narrower fronts, but with the same compound F & R, I would expect the understeer to increase significantly.

That's why I'm considering the Toyo R888 setup in 305/345 instead of the Michelin 285/345 setup, although I love Michelins..

**BUT** if you do the Michelin 285/345 setup, and get the increased understeer that I think you will, you can probably combat it by going with the base front / TA rear sway bar setup.

Cheers,
Andi

Agreed. You could go 345 in the rear and 285 on the Michelin PSS but I'm sure the fronts will change the behavior of the front end and will probably result in some understeer. A TA alignment and TA sways could help combat it but still may not be as good as having the 295 Corsas up front. But it sounds like you won't be doing a lot of aggressive tracking so the understeer that comes from the narrower PSS may be negligible for you.

I've heard great things about the Toyo R888sbut hear they are really loud which could be a hinderance for road driving. Not sure how they do in the wet either.

[KLdy]

Agreed. You could go 345 in the rear and 285 on the Michelin PSS but I'm sure the fronts will change the behavior of the front end and will probably result in some understeer. A TA alignment and TA sways could help combat it but still may not be as good as having the 295 Corsas up front. But it sounds like you won't be doing a lot of aggressive tracking so the understeer that comes from the narrower PSS may be negligible for you.

I've heard great things about the Toyo R888sbut hear they are really loud which could be a hinderance for road driving. Not sure how they do in the wet either.

I see.... so the understeer is what I should be concerning about

TA sway bars is a must do IMO
but the TA Alignment is a bit too Aggressive
Ido do some track driving.
right now with my C7 I do 1-2 track day per month

Seems like I need some work at the front end

I'm actually pretty confused on why vipers have difficulty with the fronts with the engine behind the rear axel and a nice weight distribution

although I do prefer the fronts to be lighter like the Lexus LFA

[One Viper Bite]

I see.... so the understeer is what I should be concerning about

TA sway bars is a must do IMO
but the TA Alignment is a bit too Aggressive
Ido do some track driving.
right now with my C7 I do 1-2 track day per month

Seems like I need some work at the front end

I'm actually pretty confused on why vipers have difficulty with the fronts with the engine behind the rear axel and a nice weight distribution

although I do prefer the fronts to be lighter like the Lexus LFA

I'd say give it a try and see how it feels on the 285 PSS. If you like that tire and have experience with it then it may be a winner for you. And I wouldn't say Viper's have "difficulty" with the fronts. Compared to a GT-R or Gallardo, I can't imagine the understeer being anywhere near as bad as those on 285s. Just may be more than expected in a Gen V Viper. TA sways should balance that.

[KLdy]

I'd say give it a try and see how it feels on the 285 PSS. If you like that tire and have experience with it then it may be a winner for you. And I wouldn't say Viper's have "difficulty" with the fronts. Compared to a GT-R or Gallardo, I can't imagine the understeer being anywhere near as bad as those on 285s. Just may be more than expected in a Gen V Viper. TA sways should balance that.

ops typo there I mean front axel haha

yes of course.

we'll see what happens after I do the purchase.

there's a 2014 black viper GTS for sale in Seattle In a few days( really like black vipers) with 514 miles on it. did the previous owner drove it home and garage it lol

it's 70K, Hope I could get it.

[Dr.Ron]

Hi Ron,
thanks for the answer
how many in terms of aspect ratio that 1.2 inch diameter?

I think you made a good choice on not trading in for a new Z06.

I was just looking into front vs rear tire diameter difference...I don't think the computer cares about the aspect ratios as much as the diameter deltas...but I'm new to a Viper! LOL

Ron



there's a 2014 black viper GTS for sale in Seattle In a few days( really like black vipers) with 514 miles on it. did the previous owner drove it home and garage it lol

it's 70K, Hope I could get it.

be careful! That's VERY cheap, and at those prices they usually are that cheap for a reason.

[Stealth]

I am so far unimpressed with the Pirelli PZero Corsa. I think the Pirellis are the weak link on an otherwise awesome car.

If Michelin made a PSS for the Viper we would all be switching to it from the Corsa. It's a better tire. Just does everything better, including taking track use in stride and maintaining grip levels for more heat cycles.

If only....

I respectfully disagree.

My 14' GTS has 7,000 mi., 3 HPDE days, factory alignment and the Corsas have been awesome and have lots of tread left, front and rear. My car also has TA Sway Bars. I have had my extra set sitting for months but have not needed them. In particular, the Corsas did not get greasy and slippery on the track. Each to their own. I also had a Gen IV Viper and ran Michelin PSSs and did not like them as much. Finally, Jon B. and Pirelli and possibly Tire Rack all have smoking deals on the P0s and Corsas. Good Luck.

[KLdy]

I was just looking into front vs rear tire diameter difference...I don't think the computer cares about the aspect ratios as much as the diameter deltas...but I'm new to a Viper! LOL

Ron



be careful! That's VERY cheap, and at those prices they usually are that cheap for a reason.

yes but 500 miles what could possibility go wrong

yes I was a bit worried as wellll

there's also a white one for sale in Texas for 70 with 5000+ miles on it. it's in the forum posts too, how's that

[Andi]

I respectfully disagree.

My 14' GTS has 7,000 mi., 3 HPDE days, factory alignment and the Corsas have been awesome and have lots of tread left, front and rear. My car also has TA Sway Bars. I have had my extra set sitting for months but have not needed them. In particular, the Corsas did not get greasy and slippery on the track. Each to their own. I also had a Gen IV Viper and ran Michelin PSSs and did not like them as much. Finally, Jon B. and Pirelli and possibly Tire Rack all have smoking deals on the P0s and Corsas. Good Luck.

Depends on how fast you go. The fast guys and girls don't get that kind of longevity.

[Dr.Ron]

I don't know, but how can it be $10,000 cheaper than all the rest of them?

Yeah, that white one at Vroom turns out has body/paint issues.

[KLdy]

I don't know, but how can it be $10,000 cheaper than all the rest of them?

Yeah, that white one at Vroom turns out has body/paint issues.

oh paint issues..
damn it I live in SoCal I can't personally check it out

maybe I should pay a visit in this summer to check it out

[AZTVR]

Yeah, that white one at Vroom turns out has body/paint issues.

Does it? I thought that some member looked at the low resolution photos with poor contrast of the white Viper and said that, in his opinion it "may" have body/paint issues; but, no one has actually looked at the car?

[KLdy]

Does it? I thought that some member looked at the low resolution photos with poor contrast of the white Viper and said that, in his opinion it had body/paint issues; but, no one has actually looked at the car?

\
Well I believe its sold already

I think for a 2014 its a fair price for 70K since the kelly blue book value does suggest around 70K for a excellent condition car

I meant for the black on in Seattle not the white one thats sold already

[Dr.Ron]

Does it? I thought that some member looked at the low resolution photos with poor contrast of the white Viper and said that, in his opinion it "may" have body/paint issues; but, no one has actually looked at the car?
My comment was based on his observations..The gaps WERE really off though.

\
Well I believe its sold already

I think for a 2014 its a fair price for 70K since the kelly blue book value does suggest around 70K for a excellent condition car

I meant for the black on in Seattle not the white one thats sold already
Is this 14 a GTS or a base SRT?

[KLdy]

My comment was based on his observations..The gaps WERE really off though.

Is this 14 a GTS or a base SRT?

Its a 14 GTS, I called them the guy said its not up for sale yet its going some sort of procedure, then when they get permission they can sale it..

Dont understand what that is , he also said it might be 3-7 days and they might not get it either.

[One Viper Bite]

Its a 14 GTS, I called them the guy said its not up for sale yet its going some sort of procedure, then when they get permission they can sale it..

Dont understand what that is , he also said it might be 3-7 days and they might not get it either.

$70K for a 500 mile GTS sounds suspiciously cheap. I would do some research and precede with caution...

I live in SoCal as well. When you make the purchase, hit me up so we can play!

[KLdy]

$70K for a 500 mile GTS sounds suspiciously cheap. I would do some research and precede with caution...

I live in SoCal as well. When you make the purchase, hit me up so we can play!

Will do my friend, but after purchasing the car I think it's gonna sit in my garage for a while since I barely know how to drive a manual.
Learned it but since then all my cars are automatic
don't even know how to do rev match yet
everything is theoretical

might get a Miata or GT86 to practice before I actually start driving that car more often

don't wanna ruin the clutch or anything

[City]

might get a Miata or GT86 to practice before I actually start driving that car more often

don't wanna ruin the clutch or anything
That would be a wasted move. If you've learned to drive a stick already, it will come back to you quickly. A Viper clutch is not going to wear much at all under "learning" conditions. Just get your Viper and take it easy for the first 10 hours of practice. Unless you're practicing burnouts or the like, you will not damage the clutch.

Worst case is you'll have to deal with the public embarrassment of stalling or bucking a "dream car" for a few hundred miles. No big deal. We've all done it at some point.

[KLdy]

oh OK I learned it while getting the license its been like 3 Years.

and no I don't do burn outs at all
waste of money and bad for the clutch IMO
I do like to do power slides tho :P

Yes that's part of the reason, haha stalling

I'll prob put a sticker on the back of the car

"New Manual Driver"

btw what will go wrong if I didn't do the rev match right?

[KLdy]

Thank you very much for the detailed explains from everyone

this thread has been very helpful

feels different than the corvette forum

very very different and helpful

I hope I could get a viper ASAP

I wish to keep that car for a long time

if anyone has a good deal on an SRT, GT, or GTS

[One Viper Bite]

oh OK I learned it while getting the license its been like 3 Years.

and no I don't do burn outs at all
waste of money and bad for the clutch IMO
I do like to do power slides tho :P

Yes that's part of the reason, haha stalling

I'll prob put a sticker on the back of the car

"New Manual Driver"

btw what will go wrong if I didn't do the rev match right?

The Viper's clutch is surprisingly forgiving. You shouldn't have a problem practicing in it.

And nothing will really go wrong if you don't rev match properly unless you're really pushing the car. A bad rev match at the limit can upset the cars balance under hard braking or on corner entry. Putting around town and not rev matching or rev matching wrong won't get you into any trouble.

Thank you very much for the detailed explains from everyone

this thread has been very helpful

feels different than the corvette forum

very very different and helpful

I hope I could get a viper ASAP

I wish to keep that car for a long time

if anyone has a good deal on an SRT, GT, or GTS

And yes, this community is awesome! I've only been a Viper owner for 2 months now and this community welcomed me with open arms and answered all of my dumb questions. It's a small community and I believe the Viper attracts more true car enthusiasts vs. the Corvette community. I feel the Corvette community certainly has its true enthusiasts but is riddled more with people with large wallets and even larger egos. The Viper, because it's a serious driver focused machine requires the understanding and respect of a more mature person. Of course, this is all just my opinion.

:)

[One Viper Bite]

Also, here is one I was looking at before I bought my 2013 GTS. It's only about 45 minutes outside of LA.

https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourc eContext=carGurusHomePage_false_0&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity=d2158&zip=91402#listing=135191751

[Stealth]

Depends on how fast you go. The fast guys and girls don't get that kind of longevity.

Agreed that if you are pushing hard enough (in a street car) you will get more tire wear. However, I think it also has to do with alignment, driving style and tracks run. I look forward to seeing you on track if you are in Southern California. I have tracked motorcycles and many high hp sportscars. I will try to keep your tail lights in distant sight!

[Dr.Ron]

Sounds like they're doing the R28 & R29 recalls. It takes a few days or so to get the results back & then they get the OK to sell the car...See if it was a buyback though..Check the carfax!

[ViperGeorge]

I gotta say I prefer the Michelin PSS over the Corsas or the PZeros. I have run the Michelin's on my 09 ACR on the One Lap of America and they did great. They do a skid pad event at TireRack and I placed like 7th out of 65 cars in the ACR. In the TA with PZeros I placed something like 40th. I could not get the tires to turn they simply chattered and skipped along the asphalt. The other Gen 5 in the event had the same issue, he placed dead last. The Gen 4 ACR on Michelin's was like 2nd.

The TA came with Corsas (illegal on One Lap) and I used them on the track. Looked like crap after one hard day at High Plains Raceway (tough on tires).

[TrackAire]

KLdy,
Welcome aboard. Here are my three pieces of advice:

1. Even before you buy a Viper, sign up at Bondurant for the 4 day course and go drive the heck of those cars. They are now Dodge so they have the Challengers and Vipers at your disposal. You will get to practice your heel/toe downshifting over and over again in a safe controlled environment (something you cannot do on the street or at the track). You just do it for like 15 minutes in a row with a instructor, without an instructor and again with an instructor. You will practice in a "skid car" that is just not available anywhere else. Your shifting will become very smooth and smooth is fast. You'll get to practice braking and lane changes under heavy braking. And of course they teach you about apexes and all the racing stuff to make you fast and smooth on the track. As a side bonus, you'll also get a good feel of the Viper and what to look for when you test drive ones you're considering buying. Just because it's on a dealers lot does not mean it is running right. By driving the Bondurant Vipers you'll know how the car should feel, shift and sound.

2. There is no such thing as a great street tire that will be a great track tire. If you're going to track more than 6 times a year, do yourself a favor a buy an extra set of rims with very track focused tires for the track. Keep the stock rims and tires for the street. The track tires will be much more predictable on the track and in my opinion much safer at the limit. Save the street tires for the street....much smoother, better wet weather handling and they'll be quieter.

3. Whatever Viper you buy, leave it stock for the first year and learn to drive it. The only thing you need to change is the tires, brake pads, brake fluid and get the correct alignment. Those four changes will make your car faster than 99% of anything else on the track. Now all you need to focus on is track time, track time and more track time:)

Good luck and have fun!

[Andi]

KLdy,
Welcome aboard. Here are my three pieces of advice:

1. Even before you buy a Viper, sign up at Bondurant for the 4 day course and go drive the heck of those cars. They are now Dodge so they have the Challengers and Vipers at your disposal. You will get to practice your heel/toe downshifting over and over again in a safe controlled environment (something you cannot do on the street or at the track). You just do it for like 15 minutes in a row with a instructor, without an instructor and again with an instructor. You will practice in a "skid car" that is just not available anywhere else. Your shifting will become very smooth and smooth is fast. You'll get to practice braking and lane changes under heavy braking. And of course they teach you about apexes and all the racing stuff to make you fast and smooth on the track. As a side bonus, you'll also get a good feel of the Viper and what to look for when you test drive ones you're considering buying. Just because it's on a dealers lot does not mean it is running right. By driving the Bondurant Vipers you'll know how the car should feel, shift and sound.

2. There is no such thing as a great street tire that will be a great track tire. If you're going to track more than 6 times a year, do yourself a favor a buy an extra set of rims with very track focused tires for the track. Keep the stock rims and tires for the street. The track tires will be much more predictable on the track and in my opinion much safer at the limit. Save the street tires for the street....much smoother, better wet weather handling and they'll be quieter.

3. Whatever Viper you buy, leave it stock for the first year and learn to drive it. The only thing you need to change is the tires, brake pads, brake fluid and get the correct alignment. Those four changes will make your car faster than 99% of anything else on the track. Now all you need to focus on is track time, track time and more track time:)

Good luck and have fun!

In my experience the Michelin PS2s and PSS's were awesome at taking track use and maintaining grip and tread. But I agree with everything else you said.

*** I COULDN'T AGREE MORE ABOUT BONDURANT!! BEST RACING SCHOOL I'VE EVER DONE. Can't wait to go back. ***

[isellpower]

You better hurry, I've got my 996 for sale and when it goes I'm buying the black car in Seattle. I'm only an hour or so away and I've been up to look at it and it's like new just like they say.

[XSnake]

They make the PSS;s in 295/345 combo.

If you are a VOA member there is a hell of a deal available on the Corsa's. http://driveviper.com/forums/threads/13960-VOA-Pirelli-Tire-Deal-Extended!