You know what's ironic?

[Terminator02]

How the reviews changed for the viper over the years. I was looking at old reviews online and almost every review noted a quiet ride, a comfortable ride and a fantastic interior. Each review was consistent in noting how firm and comfortable the seats are. It's terribly sad that magazines and online media have little integrity to write an honest opinion. They write only what they think the reader wants to hear, what their biggest sponsor wants to hear or to compete with their competition. I mean almost every single review positively noted the very traits they now dismiss in their obnoxious reviews. I really didn't read any new reviews prior to jumping to my gen V. I just remember how great the buzz was prior to its release when I was still in my 2000 ACR. It's absolutely as ironic as ironic can be!

[Arizona Vipers]

Man don't even get me started... It's the magazines that killed this car... Hmmm, an american sports car with a giant bestly motor that slay's on the track for $90K...
These guys will all repent in 20 years.....

[duffman04]

Its disappointing on their part, for sure. But its not just the Viper. When any car is new it gets the hype, then something new comes out and magically the performance numbers seem to go down and the new car is better (but only better than the old car's current #'s). I've seen it in reviews of tons of different cars.

Bottom line, watch/read magazine reviews for the entertainment value and nothing more.

[Martin]

I chalk it up to the pussification of America (and most of the rest of the world)....

[lochnessmonster]

The articles have one useful purpose............bird cage liners. I don't own a bird, but if I did, I'd take great satisfaction watching him take a dump on them. :)

[Terminator02]

The articles have one useful purpose............bird cage liners. I don't own a bird, but if I did, I'd take great satisfaction watching him take a dump on them. :)

I'm going to go get a bird right now.

[lochnessmonster]

I'm going to go get a bird right now.

Hahaha.....awesome. I highly recommend the green winged macaw. My late father had two, Robert and Skipper. Man, those things took huge dumps!! The perfect auto journalist bird.

[SharpMan]

Technically it's not irony.

Irony would be getting run over and killed by the ambulance coming to save you after a crash.

Can you link to the old reviews? I'd like to read them as I've never heard a Viper described as having a quiet or comfortable ride and a fantastic interior though I've always thought it rode just fine and I like the interior.

[Policy Limits]

I chalk it up to the pussification of America (and most of the rest of the world)....

U got it. Pdk and tampon holders are in demand. Pssshh

[Ripper]

The articles have one useful purpose............bird cage liners. I don't own a bird, but if I did, I'd take great satisfaction watching him take a dump on them. :)



Wife has two birds. Thanks for the useful tip!

[Vprbite]

Technically it's not irony.

Irony would be getting run over and killed by the ambulance coming to save you after a crash.

Can you link to the old reviews? I'd like to read them as I've never heard a Viper described as having a quiet or comfortable ride and a fantastic interior though I've always thought it rode just fine and I like the interior.

I have to agree with this. I remember in 2 different occasions hearing/reading that it was an "axe murderer on wheels." I have never seen a journalist describe it as anything besides a torture box with a big American motor in it. I've read "the white trash supercar" and "the mullet" of supercars, but never have I heard it called quiet and smooth.

[Nine Ball]

About 10-15 yrs ago, I did freelance photojournalism and feature shoots for a few popular automotive magazines. Here is my take on the most recent magazine writers. In the past, magazines hired genuine car enthusiasts who had a talent for writing. They loved their job, and loved cars. I still know several like this, but they tend to gravitate to the magazine titles like Hot Rod, Super Chevy, Muscle Mustangs, and other enthusiast-fueled titles.

The automotive press/media type magazines, like Car & Driver, Road & Track, Motor Trend.... I've met a few of their staff, and many of them are just soft men who have been convinced that they are actually car guys. This is what happens when you hire journalism majors who have a propensity for writing, and then ask them to write about cars. They like to pretend they actually know the subject, but us true car guys can see right through most of their cliche' statements and sappy, wordy crap. Most of these types don't even own a performance car. Worse, you might find them in a Prius, or even a BMW 3-series or Audi, which they perceive as actual performance cars. They don't get it.

Tony

[FLATOUT]

Bingo!

I follow a few of those types on Instagram and their spare isn't filled with turning wrenches and racing, it's hanging out out the beach or pretending to be a 5 star chef at home.



About 10-15 yrs ago, I did freelance photojournalism and feature shoots for a few popular automotive magazines. Here is my take on the most recent magazine writers. In the past, magazines hired genuine car enthusiasts who had a talent for writing. They loved their job, and loved cars. I still know several like this, but they tend to gravitate to the magazine titles like Hot Rod, Super Chevy, Muscle Mustangs, and other enthusiast-fueled titles.

The automotive press/media type magazines, like Car & Driver, Road & Track, Motor Trend.... I've met a few of their staff, and many of them are just soft men who have been convinced that they are actually car guys. This is what happens when you hire journalism majors who have a propensity for writing, and then ask them to write about cars. They like to pretend they actually know the subject, but us true car guys can see right through most of their cliche' statements and sappy, wordy crap. Most of these types don't even own a performance car. Worse, you might find them in a Prius, or even a BMW 3-series or Audi, which they perceive as actual performance cars. They don't get it.

Tony

[Terminator02]

To those asking for the reviews just Google 2013 viper review. Motor trend and many other rags mention the seats being a plus and the cabin being luxurious. There were no mentions of entry exit difficulty. The leg burns were still there. Honestly many 2013 reviews praised the very things they have distaste for.

[darbgnik]

Bingo!

I follow a few of those types on Instagram and their spare isn't filled with turning wrenches and racing, it's hanging out out the beach or pretending to be a 5 star chef at home.

This is the sad truth Andy, I'm pretty sure most of them don't own a complete $75 Sears socket set, so how much of an enthusiast could they be?

I personally have read and of the major mags for years. I do watch the MT head 2 head series on youtube on occasion, for entertainment value only. Unless of course Randy is talking, then I actually listen......

[kverges]

The press I have read is pretty positive. So positive that I went back to the well and ordered a 2016 that I love. I've owned at least one viper continuously since 1993 and by 2008 the C7Z06 was a better car, lighter for the frack, more useful, and had an amazing 7000 rpm 7 liter V8. I had pretty well resigned myself to just having my 2001 and 1992, but changed my mind recently. Why? B/c Dodge and the journos showed how quick the ACR Extreme is. As for being car guys, The vast majority of the Viper owners in my neck can't go around a corner on track to save their lives. Most wax, and cruise to see spring flowers or cars & coffee or other non performance events. Those who do participate in performance events think the mile and street racing is what these cars are for, and want to add power, not skill. I know about 4 guys in DFW area personally who track their Vipers (IMO the main design goal for the car, and definitely so for the TA and ACR). I see far more GT3 and Cayman/Boxster and Miata on track than Viper.

Don't get me wrong, I love my Viper. The journalists did not kill it, it's a combination of things IMO. First, they just plain are harsh and crude. Go try a 1992 (and I have one). That harshness is not all gone, and a reputation is hard to shake anyway. Second, the world has gotten where For some unknown reason folks will pop for a luxury SUV but not a sports car (me I'd have a used pickup and Sportscar way before a SUV in same budget). Look at the death of the Supra and RX7 for examples, while Cayenne, Rover and even Bentley sell tons of SUVs. Third, I think there is a bit of market saturation and the GenV probably went too upmarket. For me personally, I said to myself I'd rather keep similar looking 2001 GTS rather than spend $80K plus that car for a GenV, as I did not really care about the luxury items. The ACR Extreme changed that mindset for me, but I have to admit My GT3 and ACR are very similarly priced and the GT3 is a better all around car with Porsche pedigree to support its upmarket price (although I will probably sell mine in favor of the ACR). But I know I'll see more GT3s at the track and will have to drive the hell out of the ACR to be faster (last time I went to COTA) I was lapping my GT3 faster (2:24) than any Viper that weekend (although I think skillful car guy drivers are getting ACR Extremes that the car's potential may finally be showing on track). I think SV is at COTA this weekend or next and hope to see some ACR times under 2:20.

Finally, the so-called Vette and Viper car guys love to piss all over what I consider the ultimate track car, considering budget, pace, racing opportunities and more: Miata. i have 2 Miata race cars and even bought the new 2016, because to me Mazda got it and made a 2300 lb roaster again, while the rest of the world bloats out and adds power. The press loves the new Miata and I also concur with their assessments on that car. To me the press remain car guys.

You want to help Viper rep? Go out to DE and auto cross events where there are plenty of car guys and learn to go fast and don't be that guy who makes a train by parking in every corner only to blast off and not point faster drivers by. The GenV has the ability to be the track king, but the press, not the owners (except for a few, hopefully growing number) are the only ones showing track prowess. I hope to finally get my ACR set up and on track in May and will post data and video and hope I can put up some worthy numbers that befit the equipment.

[NT-ACR]

The press I have read is pretty positive. So positive that I went back to the well and ordered a 2016 that I love. I've owned at least one viper continuously since 1993 and by 2008 the C7Z06 was a better car, lighter for the frack, more useful, and had an amazing 7000 rpm 7 liter V8. I had pretty well resigned myself to just having my 2001 and 1992, but changed my mind recently. Why? B/c Dodge and the journos showed how quick the ACR Extreme is. As for being car guys, The vast majority of the Viper owners in my neck can't go around a corner on track to save their lives. Most wax, and cruise to see spring flowers or cars & coffee or other non performance events. Those who do participate in performance events think the mile and street racing is what these cars are for, and want to add power, not skill. I know about 4 guys in DFW area personally who track their Vipers (IMO the main design goal for the car, and definitely so for the TA and ACR). I see far more GT3 and Cayman/Boxster and Miata on track than Viper.

Don't get me wrong, I love my Viper. The journalists did not kill it, it's a combination of things IMO. First, they just plain are harsh and crude. Go try a 1992 (and I have one). That harshness is not all gone, and a reputation is hard to shake anyway. Second, the world has gotten where For some unknown reason folks will pop for a luxury SUV but not a sports car (me I'd have a used pickup and Sportscar way before a SUV in same budget). Look at the death of the Supra and RX7 for examples, while Cayenne, Rover and even Bentley sell tons of SUVs. Third, I think there is a bit of market saturation and the GenV probably went too upmarket. For me personally, I said to myself I'd rather keep similar looking 2001 GTS rather than spend $80K plus that car for a GenV, as I did not really care about the luxury items. The ACR Extreme changed that mindset for me, but I have to admit My GT3 and ACR are very similarly priced and the GT3 is a better all around car with Porsche pedigree to support its upmarket price (although I will probably sell mine in favor of the ACR). But I know I'll see more GT3s at the track and will have to drive the hell out of the ACR to be faster (last time I went to COTA) I was lapping my GT3 faster (2:24) than any Viper that weekend (although I think skillful car guy drivers are getting ACR Extremes that the car's potential may finally be showing on track). I think SV is at COTA this weekend or next and hope to see some ACR times under 2:20.

Finally, the so-called Vette and Viper car guys love to piss all over what I consider the ultimate track car, considering budget, pace, racing opportunities and more: Miata. i have 2 Miata race cars and even bought the new 2016, because to me Mazda got it and made a 2300 lb roaster again, while the rest of the world bloats out and adds power. The press loves the new Miata and I also concur with their assessments on that car. To me the press remain car guys.

You want to help Viper rep? Go out to DE and auto cross events where there are plenty of car guys and learn to go fast and don't be that guy who makes a train by parking in every corner only to blast off and not point faster drivers by. The GenV has the ability to be the track king, but the press, not the owners (except for a few, hopefully growing number) are the only ones showing track prowess. I hope to finally get my ACR set up and on track in May and will post data and video and hope I can put up some worthy numbers that befit the equipment.

I'm glad at least one person wrote a reasonable, well thought out response.

[NT-ACR]

I chalk it up to the pussification of America (and most of the rest of the world)....


You're probably one of the most perceptive individuals that I've ever met. Do you do consulting for a living?

[NT-ACR]

Man don't even get me started... It's the magazines that killed this car... Hmmm, an american sports car with a giant bestly motor that slay's on the track for $90K...
These guys will all repent in 20 years.....

:smilielol:

[NT-ACR]

Geez. I guess if I'm having a bad day and want to have a laugh or two then all I need to do is visit this forum.