Carbon Spoiler Build Thread

[6th-Element]

Here are some progress pics to show you all how a spoiler is made from scratch (at least how I make one, anyways)

First step, I protect the decklid with layers of packing tape and wax paper

1904

Second step, build a backdrop for the rear of the spoiler

1905

1906

Laying down the fiberglass for a base on the deck and the rear

1907

1908


Damn near impossible to logically load pics....

[BlknBlu]

really cool. A lot of folks will find this extremely interesting.

Bruce

[6th-Element]

Applying the resin to glass

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/07Resinappliedtorearandthebase2_zpse3e77004.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/07Resinappliedtorearandthebase2_zpse3e77004.jpg.ht ml)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/06Resinappliedtorearandthebase_zpsffc5f72f.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/06Resinappliedtorearandthebase_zpsffc5f72f.jpg.htm l)

Building the front profile of the spoiler

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/08Buildingthefrontprofile_zpse1b62592.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/08Buildingthefrontprofile_zpse1b62592.jpg.html)

[6th-Element]

Now we have poured the xpanding foam

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/09Wayyytoomuchfoam_zpsce9e09dd.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/09Wayyytoomuchfoam_zpsce9e09dd.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/10Bustingout_zpsee13de59.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/10Bustingout_zpsee13de59.jpg.html)


Removed the profile barriers , now it looks like a NASCAR Viper

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/11Barriersremoved_zps977070c8.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/11Barriersremoved_zps977070c8.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/12Nascarspoiler_zpsdc6a45d0.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/12Nascarspoiler_zpsdc6a45d0.jpg.html)

First trim and mark out a profile of the curve

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/13Markingoutaprofile_zpsa377695a.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/13Markingoutaprofile_zpsa377695a.jpg.html)

Now a template that can be flipped from side to side to make sure it is the same on each side

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/14Makingatemplatetobeflippedtotheotherside_zpsb41c fedb.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/14Makingatemplatetobeflippedtotheotherside_zpsb41c fedb.jpg.html)

Now a quick Photoshop to see if looks good

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/15Photoshopoftheprofiletoseeifitlooksgood_zps08abc a6a.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/15Photoshopoftheprofiletoseeifitlooksgood_zps08abc a6a.jpg.html)

[6th-Element]

Now the trimming and shaping begins....

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/16Readyfortrimming_zps3c19eaac.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/16Readyfortrimming_zps3c19eaac.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/17Shaping01_zpse9f3bdde.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/17Shaping01_zpse9f3bdde.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/20Shaping04_zps8830024d.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/20Shaping04_zps8830024d.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/22Shaping05_zps1528f572.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/22Shaping05_zps1528f572.jpg.html)

Now cut out a slot so you can see behind you in the rear view mirror

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/23Cutouttherearview_zpsf4e82fd1.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/23Cutouttherearview_zpsf4e82fd1.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/24Frontviewofcutout_zps7ce10b9a.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/24Frontviewofcutout_zps7ce10b9a.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/25Shaping06_zps6c073d03.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/25Shaping06_zps6c073d03.jpg.html)

Checking it out in the Dark!

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/26Progress01_zps0c5b6b94.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/26Progress01_zps0c5b6b94.jpg.html)

Now sand some surfaces down

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/27Sandingsurfacesflat01_zps29d8b84a.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/27Sandingsurfacesflat01_zps29d8b84a.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/28Sandingsurfacesflat02_zpsc19c032c.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/28Sandingsurfacesflat02_zpsc19c032c.jpg.html)

Getting the final profiles sanded out of the foam

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/29Shaping07_zpsbb8c03d5.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/29Shaping07_zpsbb8c03d5.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/30Gettingclose01_zpsdbad0074.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/30Gettingclose01_zpsdbad0074.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/31Gettingclose02_zpsd072a99f.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/31Gettingclose02_zpsd072a99f.jpg.html)

[6th-Element]

Now applying resin and a layer of glass over the foam to finish the piece off

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/32Glassappliedtofoam01_zps52ebe35c.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/32Glassappliedtofoam01_zps52ebe35c.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/33Glassappliedtofoam02_zps81a011f0.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/33Glassappliedtofoam02_zps81a011f0.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/34Glassappliedtofoam03_zpsa2beb13c.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/34Glassappliedtofoam03_zpsa2beb13c.jpg.html)

[Torquemonster06]

Very nice. Super labor intensive. Subscribed.

[DreadLox]

I love seeing projects come together. Way to go with getting it done, looking forward to more pics later!

[SmoknTires]

Wow. Now that's cool. Can't wait to see the finished product. Hope the splitter is project #2! ;.)

[6th-Element]

Here are some pics with the plug painted black after a rough trim. After this I will be doing a good 5-8 hours of fine sanding and finishing, then pulling a mold to pop these babies out in Carbon Fiber.

Matching Splitters... Definitely!

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/G-34TA_0005_zps61bef5f6.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/G-34TA_0005_zps61bef5f6.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/G-34TA_0002_zps30372320.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/G-34TA_0002_zps30372320.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/G-34TA_0004_zps812c2419.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/G-34TA_0004_zps812c2419.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/G-34TA_0010_zpsc7a85f6f.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/G-34TA_0010_zpsc7a85f6f.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/G-34TA_0007_zps238f69d6.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/G-34TA_0007_zps238f69d6.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/G-34TA_0001_zps15000973.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/G-34TA_0001_zps15000973.jpg.html)

[Canadian venom]

:t1236:

[J TNT]

Nice option for the coupe guys . :)

[commandomatt]

Have to ask a question.

While I can definitely appreciate the work that is put into something like this.....shouldn't there be a fair amount more to it ?

In other words, whats done to ensure that this design does whats intended when at speed ? When you bring this car up to 100 mph +....how does this spoiler change the way it feels ? When these speeds are reached, even the slightest change to the overall design of the car will start making a difference

It may push the rear end down but it could also make the front end feel loose. Could have a very negative result on how the car reacts. Matching splitters is mentioned, but again...it seems like these parts should be very carefully matched to each other

When these ground effects, wings and spoilers are designed at the factory level I would suspect that they are in fact tested in a wind tunnel or similar to see how they change the cars characteristics when the speeds increase

Not trying to start any crap here....just curious more than anything

Matt

[6th-Element]

MAtt,

YEs, one should always combine a splitter with a rear aero device such as a wing, and to a lesser extent with a spoiler. The ACR wing will create over 1000 lbs downforce at 150 mph, a TA spoiler 600.

The spoiler spoils the airflow and decreases lift which correspondingly makes downforce.

A car without a spoiler = fast
A car with a spoiler = faster
A car with a low downforce wing = fastest
A car with a high downforce wing = Faster in the corners , slower on the straights

[The_Greg]

Have to ask a question.

While I can definitely appreciate the work that is put into something like this.....shouldn't there be a fair amount more to it ?

In other words, whats done to ensure that this design does whats intended when at speed ? When you bring this car up to 100 mph +....how does this spoiler change the way it feels ? When these speeds are reached, even the slightest change to the overall design of the car will start making a difference

It may push the rear end down but it could also make the front end feel loose. Could have a very negative result on how the car reacts. Matching splitters is mentioned, but again...it seems like these parts should be very carefully matched to each other

When these ground effects, wings and spoilers are designed at the factory level I would suspect that they are in fact tested in a wind tunnel or similar to see how they change the cars characteristics when the speeds increase

Not trying to start any crap here....just curious more than anything

Matt

I have thought this often - Isn't there someone out there in Viper land who is a CFD expert who could analyze these designs for us? But my gut reaction is that these devices won't have any major negative characterists. I tihnk this spoiler will generate downforce, but it might create more drag than one designed in a wind tunnel or virtually through CFD. As far as being unsafe (lightening the front end at speed), while thats possible I don't think this spoiler design will generate as much downforce as an ACR rear wing, so it might not be as much of an issue.

The point is that you're right - its somethign that should be considered probably. However, I don't think this design will produce very large amounts of downforce.

[SSGNRDZ_28]

Looks great so far. What is your plan for attaching this to the decklid?

[SSGNRDZ_28]

I have thought this often - Isn't there someone out there in Viper land who is a CFD expert who could analyze these designs for us? But my gut reaction is that these devices won't have any major negative characterists. I tihnk this spoiler will generate downforce, but it might create more drag than one designed in a wind tunnel or virtually through CFD. As far as being unsafe (lightening the front end at speed), while thats possible I don't think this spoiler design will generate as much downforce as an ACR rear wing, so it might not be as much of an issue.

The point is that you're right - its somethign that should be considered probably. However, I don't think this design will produce very large amounts of downforce.

I have resources for CFD analysis but ideally the entire car would need to be modeled in CFD to get the whole story (tons of work). It would be cool to have though and once the base model was complete parts could be added and swapped fairly easily. Maybe someone at SRT can donate the car model? Wishful thinking, but it would be a powerful tool for product validation.

[ACR Steve]

Damn looks good but looks like a crazy amount of hours

[The_Greg]

I have resources for CFD analysis but ideally the entire car would need to be modeled in CFD to get the whole story (tons of work). It would be cool to have though and once the base model was complete parts could be added and swapped fairly easily. Maybe someone at SRT can donate the car model? Wishful thinking, but it would be a powerful tool for product validation.

Yeah, that base model would be one of the initial hurdles. Then also . Hmm, now we just need someone with a 3d scanner... This is getting more complicated! haha.

I forgot to mention also that I really like the way this spoiler looks and am very appreciative of the work you're doing, 6th-element!

[Viper Girl]

Damn near impossible to logically load pics....

Steve some people were having problems with pix from AOL, but most have fixed the issue by using firefox or chrome. Maybe use a different browser?

[Revolution]

Why not just model the Gen 5 spoiler and reverse engineer?

[The_Greg]

Why not just model the Gen 5 spoiler and reverse engineer?

Because isn't it like $3k?

The materials he put into this project so far are probably much less expensive. Though i do wonder how well a gen V spoiler would fit on other gens. Maybe one of the dealers can take one off and set it on a different gen for us :)

[SSGNRDZ_28]

Yeah, that base model would be one of the initial hurdles. Then also . Hmm, now we just need someone with a 3d scanner... This is getting more complicated! haha.

I have the scanner too; just not enough time for the base model!

[6th-Element]

Looks great so far. What is your plan for attaching this to the decklid?

I will post up the underside soon, it is 2 surfaces, one that is approx 2" x 70+" and one that is approx 1.25 " x 72" lots of surface area to mount with any of the 3M double sided body molding tape (not the hardware store stuff but the stuff the OEM's use), or PL Bonding adhesive or Windshield adhesive, all 3 are items that any body shop can use. NO DRILLING REQUIRED!

[6th-Element]

Because isn't it like $3k?

The materials he put into this project so far are probably much less expensive. Though i do wonder how well a gen V spoiler would fit on other gens. Maybe one of the dealers can take one off and set it on a different gen for us :)

It wouldn't fit at all, curvature at the back is different and angle if deck lid is different and at differing slopes.

This one fits this car like a glove (feels like it snaps into position just laying it on the deck lid)

[6th-Element]

Steve some people were having problems with pix from AOL, but most have fixed the issue by using firefox or chrome. Maybe use a different browser?

Used Firefox and it loaded some of the images and then just plain refused after the 5th one. Used Photobucket and all is good now.

[Bugman Jeff]

Looks great so far :) Having a composites background myself, I know the tedium that can come from trying to make the buck and mold as perfect as you can. Is your final carbon part going to be foam cored, or will it stay hollow?

As for how it actually performs, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most people who add spoilers do it for the look, not for any actual performance gains. In general, most aftermarket companies who sell wings measure their performance by "Yup, that seems to work" without doing any in depth testing. I'm guessing(though I could be completely wrong) that this one in particular isn't meant to help a car get around a race track faster, it's meant to look cool with some added downforce as a bonus.

[6th-Element]

Looks great so far :) Having a composites background myself, I know the tedium that can come from trying to make the buck and mold as perfect as you can. Is your final carbon part going to be foam cored, or will it stay hollow?

As for how it actually performs, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most people who add spoilers do it for the look, not for any actual performance gains. In general, most aftermarket companies who sell wings measure their performance by "Yup, that seems to work" without doing any in depth testing. I'm guessing(though I could be completely wrong) that this one in particular isn't meant to help a car get around a race track faster, it's meant to look cool with some added downforce as a bonus.

Hi Jeff,

Thanks for your comments,

Plan is to make it a totally enclosed piece then I will drill a couple of holes (needed for gas expansion anyways from the hot hot sun) and then I will inject expanding 2 lb/sq ft foam inside. I like the light weight of this prototype and the extra rigidity from the foam core.

[Rocket]

Interesting progress. It looks substantially thicker than the TA version. Also not sure about how the ends look (the part that hangs over the quarter panels). Would be interesting to see how the overall dimensions compare to the TA with regards to height, shape, etc. Good luck with finishing it.

[6th-Element]

Interesting progress. It looks substantially thicker than the TA version. Also not sure about how the ends look (the part that hangs over the quarter panels). Would be interesting to see how the overall dimensions compare to the TA with regards to height, shape, etc. Good luck with finishing it.

Hi Rocket,

I intentionally made the ends different, The SRT10 Coupes have a different profile on the sides and the SRT10's have more angular lines. The rear deck edge is a totally different profile on the SRT10's as well, 2 edges vs one on the G5.

[SSGNRDZ_28]

Interesting progress. It looks substantially thicker than the TA version. Also not sure about how the ends look (the part that hangs over the quarter panels). Would be interesting to see how the overall dimensions compare to the TA with regards to height, shape, etc. Good luck with finishing it.

Part of the thickness appearance may come from the center section. You can see in the TA version they maintained a consistent edge width across the top. In the center the rear is angled in to prevent the edge from gaining thickness.

19191920

[6th-Element]

Part of the thickness appearance may come from the center section. You can see in the TA version they maintained a consistent edge width across the top. In the center the rear is angled in to prevent the edge from gaining thickness.

19191920

My Spoiler angles down at about 9 degrees, the TA G5 spoiler angles down at a good 45 to 55 degrees, probably for cosmetic reasons vs aero reasons, I think they just wanted to have it meet up with the rear edge.

[DARKNHT]

This is looking awesome! Can't wait to see more pics of it!!! GOOD JOB

[Sybil TF]

Have to ask a question.

While I can definitely appreciate the work that is put into something like this.....shouldn't there be a fair amount more to it ?

In other words, whats done to ensure that this design does whats intended when at speed ? When you bring this car up to 100 mph +....how does this spoiler change the way it feels ? When these speeds are reached, even the slightest change to the overall design of the car will start making a difference


Matt
Ah , who cares. It looks bitchen!!!

[TooBlue]

Looks Great ....!

If you need downforce for the track, get the aero wing and splitter. It's that simple...

This spoiler is a cool looking street mod....IMO

It sure is nice to see some enthusiasm to build some NEW parts for our "old" Gen. 3/4s

Keep up the good work...:dude3:

[6th-Element]

A few update pics, after some filling and sanding and filling and sanding

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/DSC_0022_zpsdc89e6cc.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/DSC_0022_zpsdc89e6cc.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/DSC_0019_zps71a27230.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/DSC_0019_zps71a27230.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/DSC_0021_zps21dc6356.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/DSC_0021_zps21dc6356.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/DSC_0018_zpse7b2ca30.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/DSC_0018_zpse7b2ca30.jpg.html)

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/DSC_0017_zps6451ff5d.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/DSC_0017_zps6451ff5d.jpg.html)

[Torquemonster06]

Looking damn nice there sir.

[6th-Element]

A pic I did this AM while waiting for the carbon fiber to cure...

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/DSC_0013bluesm_zps56829d94.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/DSC_0013bluesm_zps56829d94.jpg.html)

[Revolution]

I will post up the underside soon, it is 2 surfaces, one that is approx 2" x 70+" and one that is approx 1.25 " x 72" lots of surface area to mount with any of the 3M double sided body molding tape (not the hardware store stuff but the stuff the OEM's use), or PL Bonding adhesive or Windshield adhesive, all 3 are items that any body shop can use. NO DRILLING REQUIRED!

Besides the 3m what are the effects on the stock paint with the PL Bond or Windshield Adhesive?

[6th-Element]

Besides the 3m what are the effects on the stock paint with the PL Bond or Windshield Adhesive?

I would consider the Windshield adhesive a more permanent solution, it can be removed from paint but I wouldn't want to do it.
The PL is a great super strong adhesive as well http://www.loctiteproducts.com/p/12/34/pl_ca_prem_adv/overview/Loctite-PL-Premium-FAST-GRAB-Polyurethane-Construction-Adhesive.htm

The 3M double sided will adequately suffice especially since this spoiler has 2 surfaces that bond and the rear most surface prevents the rearward rotation that could cause a separation. I will post some pics later today with the Carbon spoiler outlining the surface areas.

A mechanical solution is also available whereby we "bolt" the spoiler in place ate the deck lid edges without the need to drill holes into the car.

[6th-Element]

A little progress pic, carbon just about finished

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j381/vipairpe/IMG_2384sm_zpsb549e7ee.jpg (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/vipairpe/media/IMG_2384sm_zpsb549e7ee.jpg.html)

[Revolution]

in for more pics looking great so far

[usmcly]

stunning !